This should really be interresting .
I hope a lot of people participate in this thread .
How much would it cost you to live if today was your last day? Times up!!!!!!!!!
Tim Mooney
This should really be interresting .
I hope a lot of people participate in this thread .
How much would it cost you to live if today was your last day? Times up!!!!!!!!!
Tim Mooney
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Replies
How much would it cost you to live if today was your last day?
Not much, I don't think I can or have the ability to spend too much on my last day.
Well, if you mean the last day of working, then it depends on a lot of foreseeables and unforeseeables. With some realistic assumptions barring any unforeseen catastrophes, the amount can be easily calculated.
Are you seeking advice or are you trying to see how BTers live.
Last day of work.
Its been a while since I posted this thread . Could be some people don't want to talk about it , since you are implying I'm prying in to the lives of Breaktimers. It wasn't really meant that way. What I believe the thread to be is an honest question that I'm living every day. I'm speaking out and treading on deep waters. In the business folder we hear upwards of 100 to 125 an hour being charged. I could go on about the charging for different things , but I think I've made my point . Yes , for one thing I was wondering if a 100 dollar an hour man was disabled tomorrow, would it take a hundred dollars an hour to contain his needs?
My most all important query though;
Is there an equalizer in locality? The South doesn't live on what the North , West & East seem to need . So if it ended tomorrow , what would be the outcome ? Its an honest question. We work a dangerous and physical live . That speaks volumes , enough said. Where do the old carpenters go? What happened to the 60 year old brick layers? I just don't see a lot of 55 year old concrete men. When you look at a framing crew on house after house as I did as an inspector , you see an age bracket of up to 30 yrs old placing decking and roofing. Where did all those fellers go that did that 20 years ago? Why aren't they still up there ? Yes , there are a few . Most all the crews I walked up on in all the trades , 30 would catch most of them.
Do we live a short career such as athletes?
So, if I haven't asked an honest question, then mosey on and ignore me . It really wasn't meant to be a prying one.
Where do the old carpenters go? What happened to the 60 year old brick layers? I just don't see a lot of 55 year old concrete men
Tim, I've been raising that exact issue to everyone for the last 20 years!
This is a good topic, one that is not for the faint of heart. We all tend to bury our heads in the sand on this issue because very few tradesmen honestly face up to this question. If they did, they'd be a little more focused on pension, insurance, and passive income issues.
I'll toss out my infor in a later post because I'm a bit too swamped to think very hard about this.
I will say this though: I KNOW I can live with a very modest income, but I also know that I've taken the right steps to create a much higher standard of living, than survival mode, by seeking passive income. I don't know if I'd ever make a nickel off my carpentry business in retirement, so real estate investing is really the only reasonable, viable pension that I have going for me at this time.
Of course, I have the most productive years left in front of me, but your thread premise doesn't take that into account.
If I was going to put hard numbers to my plight, I'd take a wild guess and say I need 30k every year but maybe as little as 20k. The largest unknown is health care costs and health insurance.
blueJust because you can, doesn't mean you should!
Warning! Be cautious when taking any framing advice from me. There are some in here who think I'm a hackmeister...they might be right! Of course, they might be wrong too!
I was waiting for you. <G>
I knew when I posted this thread it would not be popular to talk about . Ive heard race car drivers will not talk about this subject. According to an article they wont dwell on a negative for fear of losing an edge of the famous no fear factor. Allison didnt need to race anymore but couldnt live with out it. Ive often wondered how people like Ali made it when he was forced to retire. Such a difference in income to adjust to.
We just got through with tax time like most everyone else that has to pay taxes by April 15th. The other crowd does their business in January. <G> I took a look at social security and realized again that its not a sufficiant retirement and is way off a good income. The thought keeps occurring to me that SS alone will be quite a step down for a lot of folks.
I tried to pick a time for the last 2 weeks to talk about it at home . She wasnt receptive either . You would have thought we were talking about her funeral arrangements or mebbe worse. Ive been talking about it around here for a while trying to put a "now" purpose to it . I have tried to lay out every thing she should need to do if Im not around or incapable. Ive asked her for the same information. What would I need to do with out her and what she would need to do with out me . So far weve accomplished having our information in one place . That however is not the purpose of the post , but planning is the purpose.
You made a statement that you could evidently live on a lot less. You would then be in the prize fighters category where several steps down would be necesary which I think puts a lot of people in the same boat including me unless I figgure it out which Im working on. My problem is I dont want to live on less . You didnt say you did either . If today was the last day I can make it on a lot less, but thats not my choice. So, Im trying to put this thing together like we work the day before vacation.
I went to McDonalds this morning at 8.10 am for breakfast and coffee. My new help didnt show and I am not able to do the job I have by myself. I ordered a bisquit and a small coffee . She said a bisquit and a "SR " coffee , will their be anything else ? Now either she thought I was retired because of the time of day or the way I looked to her. I surmized it was both and gave that 60 year old lady a sexy smile for she had saved me a quarter. At any rate she was trying to help me as she had grey hair herself.
I still would like to know what happens to the 55 to 60 year olds ............. They are missing from the job sites. Made me ask that question and think "hello"? We might not have to 55 to 60 to make up our plan.
Tim
Tim, this subject scares the bejezzuz out of most folks. I always was looking at the topic through rose colored glasses. I always just assumed I'd manage to pull it all together at the end, but really wasn't being realistic about the realities of it all.
I buckled down a few years ago after reading Rich Dad Poor Dad and realized that I didn't know squat about money and finacial matters. Since then, I've stopped learning rough carpentry ( I don't know everything, but I know enough) and started learning about money. And you know what? It has helped considerably!
I mentioned a few months ago that I didn't intend to get into the landlording business. I stated that I was thinking along the lines of a strip mall or something like that. Well, how would I know about that stuff if I wasn't researching it? I got chastised by a resident real estate investor in here telling me that I'm just wandering around doing nothing and going nowhere. I think the words were "preparing to prepare". Of course I know what I know and I know where I'm going and I also know that I intend to set up my retirement in commercial or industrial properties. I simply like the indea of triple net income.
How would I know about NNN income? It's a process, one that I started several years ago.
If I found out today that I could never pound another nail, I wouldn't panic at all. In fact, I would look at it as a blessing because I'd have 24 hours a day to use the knowldedge and apply it to the real estate investing that I've already begun. The truth is that pounding nails out on the jobsite gets in the way of actually making money. I'm sure that as many carpenters get older they fall into two groups. One group finds out that they don't make enough money with the tools because wages are low in the industry for failing bodies and the other group learns that their minds and experience is worth more in different areas of the business. Either way, both groups leave the trades just as I am doing at age 51.
By the way, I'm into the final stages of listing the real estate property up on Lake Huron. We are listing it at 655k and intend to 1031 it into another real estate deal. I've already started looking for the commercial or industrial property that will give me the next step in that investment phase. Currently I'm seeking properties in the one to two million range that provide a significant cap rate, but I'd not rule out a joint venture or syndication deal that might invest in something much larger. As you know the rules about 1031 are rigid and once we go to closing on the current property, I have a very limited time to identify a target property(s), then close on it.
This type of knowledge cannot be gleened out in the projects. I have nothing but respect for carpenters and the other trades but the knowledge that they share with me won't provide for retirement. Doing commercial deals and investing in significant income streams will.
Now, if you rephrase this thread and tell me that my mind is going bad too due to mental disease, I'd say I'm in big trouble right now, but might be well set up in a year or two. No one can be sure that they have another year or two to set themselves up, but at least I'm heading in the right direction. If I did lose my mind, we'd be forced to accept our fate of living frugally forever, but my wife is such a workhorse she'd be making some employer happy in no time!
blueJust because you can, doesn't mean you should!
Warning! Be cautious when taking any framing advice from me. There are some in here who think I'm a hackmeister...they might be right! Of course, they might be wrong too!
I really suck at most things besides work'n hard... but i do work hard and often... i read "rich dad poor dad"... and saw what he was say'n was excatly what i preach to anyone who asks...
for those of you who have not read the book what he teaches (or you could listen to me) is that a job will never make you rich (stock options might) that with real estate you basicly have someone else working for you (ie..the property)
what most books don't teach you is how to borrow money... on a trip to FL i was stay'n with a good friends dad on his boat when he asked how much $$ i owed the banks... he know i had a few free standing commerial blds... when i said zero... he said "we need to fix that" going on to explain that owe'n the bank 3-4 hundred k and not paying... they come & take your stuff... but if you owe em 3-4 mil and don't pay... it seems you are partners try'n to work something out.... debt is not a bad thing... IF it produces income that is greater than the debt service... ie: note is 3k and income is 5k.... not bad... but if note is 3k and income is 2900.00 how many properties like that can you afford to own?
what you also don't learn from books... is to look past the numbers ROI, ROR, lots of letters that all mean something but unless you know the numbers to be good...
if you can't manage your own property... i'd say stay away... I'm sure management companies have a place... i just don't know where it is for an investor with under 20 million worth of property and wanting a return on it... I've told my wife if something happens to me sell everything... I enjoy the "trouble"
if you can't fix anything... stay away... i know you guys love quote'n $150 an hour for labor... but how many of you want to pay a guy $400 labor to go replace an office door that goes to an office that rents for $300 a month... or pay the elevator guy $195 an hour + drive time to replace a light bulb... sounds alot better make'n it than pay'n it... oh yeah... and who would pay a guy $2600.00 to paint a 3 room office that rents for $500 a month... (a management company would because it's not their money and they are get'n a 20% fee on top of it... why would they ever question price... ( i bought one office complex that had a management co... $475 a mo to water the lobby plants... $600 maint contract on the elevator that didn't include parts or labor... $300 a mo dumpster... $400mo water treatment for the water tower...)
and yes all this in most commerical space/leases can just be added to the CAM fees but it just ain't right...
back to how much do u need... ? i really don't know but i've seen folks who who didn't plan for squat... and thats what they got.... I just really don't want to have that worry when I'm old and 50
pony
and yes all this in most commerical space/leases can just be added to the CAM fees but it just ain't right...
Why isn't it right? Shouldn't the benefactors of the services pay for it?
blueJust because you can, doesn't mean you should!
Warning! Be cautious when taking any framing advice from me. There are some in here who think I'm a hackmeister...they might be right! Of course, they might be wrong too!
Why isn't it right?
guess if it doesn't feel right? I know it was a rip off... so i just pass it on?
pony
Believe it or not, I've put some thought and effort into it. I have a friend who sells retirement funds. He once offered to calc what we needed for retirement, and how much we'd need to save each year. At that point he said we needed to save $6,000 a year to have enough to retire on. Most years, we've been able to do that. But there have been a few where we've saved almost nothing. But I've also tried to do other things which should help in the long run. Like keep our old house as a rental, keep our debts low, and pay our mortgage off in as short a term as possible. Barring any unforseen problems, we should be in good shape at retirement.
What happens if you get scared half to death twice?
Tim, the facts around retirement savings and most people's lack thereof are easy to find. There are any number of websites with retirement calculators that you can use.
You're trying to instigate discussion, and that's fine, but what are you contributing? Are you looking for everyone here to lay out their finances for you?
Yes I am trying to instigate discussion.
No , Im not expecting people to lay their finances out in public , but I can understand whyu you might have concluded that with the title.
The truth is David we have a problem out there . The retirement information you speak of doesnt give a tradesman an edge or the ones I know. Most didnt invest in a retirement program. I saw some numbers years ago that an IRA could do it if you started it at 18 years of age. The problem is that people put off things that are far away and unpleasant to them last like April 15th as I stated. If it benifits us now then we are ready January 1.
Many that I talked to and read about started making their move at 40 to 45. Something about that black 40th birthday that says its time . Dad said several times that "from 20 to 30 man learns to make money. From 30 to 40 he enjoys making it and spending it . From 40 to 60 he trys to put it away like a squirrell. " Of course that was just his observation, but according to data hes not far wrong . So anyway for an example an IRA wouldnt suffice a man of 40 for A RETIREMENT . The man that started at 18 would have accumulted enough to quit paying at 40, then wait till 65 to draw. The difference in the numbers are staggering and point to starting at a young age.
The drum roll said above that 4 million would be needed to sustain 208,000 per year. I didnt check those numbers , but I knew it was a lot of money and well over a million. Speaking of which I thought when I was young that a million was out of sight . 3 or 400 thousand would be a good place to stop with some SS retirement. Then at 40 , a million was a sight to set the goal. Now unless its invested smartly , it wont suffice a living with out stepping down for many. Theres not many retirement accounts that offer that kind of money and sure didnt 30 years ago.
Blue said from some where it said that men dont normally start making that extra money till 50 to 55 I think. From my studies Ive found that a lot of men are comming down the home stretch at 50 making up lost ground or at least gaining a lot of ground to come under the wire at 65 .
I surmize theres several ways to geter done.
Tim Mooney
It's not just scary for carpenters, it's scary for everyone, espcially with all the talk about SS tanking, etc. I keep reading retitrement pundits saying that people will have to work longer, postpone taking SS and pensions, etc. That may be possible for an office worker, but a framer or roofer?? They tell us we should be saving all of our working lives. That's easy for folks with comfortable incomes, difficult for young people starting out with kids, mortgage, etc.
And that was a damn good post short to the point and on a killing target.
You been readin Smiths posts too long ? <G>
Tim Mooney
They tell us we should be saving all of our working lives.
They are right. If anyone thinks that they can't save something, I suggest the book called : The Richest Man In Babylon.
blue
Just because you can, doesn't mean you should!
Warning! Be cautious when taking any framing advice from me. There are some in here who think I'm a hackmeister...they might be right! Of course, they might be wrong too!
The phrase that got me in that book was about turning your money over to business leaders for investment. Made sense in the 50s when accountants were about accountability. Corporations had a tax rate many times what they are presently and still business was, for the most part open, honest and quite profitable. Now most accountants spend most of their time obscuring the truth. Investing is horse track bet where those with money and power know, sometimes pick, the winners and spend considerable amounts of money making sure the commoners seldom get to see this simple truth and will never win in any significant way.You think you own your home, land, investments and bank accounts. Your fooling yourself. You may hold a piece of paper but as soon as anyone with power wants what you have their gone. Simple as that. This isn't an consequence of government. Government, presently, is the handmaiden of the powerful. Same as it was in the 1890s. Government tries to survive. Presently it does this by serving the true elite. If the population rose up in outrage, as they did in the 1890s and 1930s, they would serve the population.Presently investing in nearly anything that you don't truly understand in a global context is no more effective than converting your savings to hundred dollar bills and tossing them out your car window as you drive through the poor part of town.What happens when the single largest portion of the GNP, by several orders of magnitude, is graft, corruption, smoke and mirror accounting and simple theft made to look , at least on paper, like profit and progress?
Good thread, Tim. It's a good exercise to just, well, stop and think sometimes. I had a good friend that lived to be 89. He had been retired for many, many years. Problem was that he retired on 1968 dollars. He basically outlived his money.
Yeah, passive income is one of my answers. Residential rental and a little farm land, which is rented out.
I've said before, the only person that can take care of the old man you will become is the young (er) man you are today. Make some decisions, make some sacrifices, whatever it takes to put away some retirement money. Disability coverage is pretty hard to buy in the trades, they like "white collar" risks a lot better. But if you can find it, buy it.
I had a painter doing some work for me the other day and there was a little trim work to be done, too. Ripping down some brick mold to fit a particular application. Guy said, "If I had a table saw . . . " I said, there's one right there behind those doors, but I can't afford for you to whack a finger off. Think about it - you're self-employed. We'd better leave that to me.
Greg
While at McDonalds this morning I saw a man I had known since youth. I was thinking , "he should have died?" Sorry for that thought , but its true. He let me borrow a bird dog when I was 16. He owned a sporting good store and lives in a very old affluent addition that has old money "dripping " from it .
Anyway there he stood all 6 ft 6 of him and quite handsome for his age. I spoke and he walked over to my table with a big smile and shook my hand with very long fingers. I told him is was truly a pleasure to see him so well. That triggured a small story from him. He said "yea, Im working on being retired longer that I worked. I retired at 72 you know. He said Im 92 now and it looks like I might have a few good years yet as good as I feel ". From his structure, presense , and general attitude in his voice , I dont doubt him one bit and would not gamble against him making it to a 100! In fact I might put money on him getting another 8 years. Might be a problem finding takers. <G>
Tim Mooney
Could be some people don't want to talk about it , since you are implying I'm prying in to the lives of Breaktimers.
Tim, sorry if I sounded that way but the thought that you're prying into the lives of BTers never crossed my mind, there is a difference between prying and seeing.
If anybody should feel that way so be it, they can stay away from the discussion. Others can have an honest opinion spilling as much or as little as he wants, isn't that the purpose of the forum?
That said, you seem to be talking about two things here, disability and retirement, and I think we should address them in their own rights.
As you know disability is a risk, the solution is risk management and retirement is an inevitableness if you lead a healthy and fruitful life and it can be planned. Although there are exceptions like forced retirement from being disabled and some people just work till their last day, planned or otherwise.
But then you don't have to worry about that do you?
OccupationGovernment/Public Service Military
Personal QuoteI work for the government, I pay taxes.
I know this will come back someday and I do have some explaining to do. You are not in Canada so you may not understand. That was all tongue in cheek when I put down "Government/Public Service Military", if you see the quote following "I work for the government, I pay taxes." you could have taken a hint. Don't we all?
Just like a lot of BTers I am self-employed, a 90% carpenter. That term came from a prof of mine at dental school who said dentistry is 90% carpentry.
Luckily for me so far other than some aches and pains I haven't had to claim any disability insurance. Last year I reduced my coverage to half because at this stage full coverage would be over-insured.
One of the best advice my accountant gave me from day one was to put away money for retirement. I follow that advice religiously and it's only about 10 years ago that I realized the impact of saving early for retirement.
I am too wondering where do the old carpenters go? What happened to the 60 year old brick layers?
Your $200,000 a year retirement income IMHO is outrageous, for me anyway I wouldn't know what to do with that money. Caveat, just make sure DW doesn't get her hands on it. Without a mortgage and kids out of college, I could have easily lived on $40K to $50K and I'll be happy.
And that's Canadian $ too.
That said, you seem to be talking about two things here, disability and retirement, and I think we should address them in their own rights.
That's a good point Tomchark.
Starting early on retirement savings is huge. I started early enough but didn't make good investments in my early years and therefore am behind. The only way to catch up is to properly leverage my earnings as I sail into the twilight years. I'm fine with that, but there is an element of risk.
Risk management....again enters the equation.
blueJust because you can, doesn't mean you should!
Warning! Be cautious when taking any framing advice from me. There are some in here who think I'm a hackmeister...they might be right! Of course, they might be wrong too!
I'm sure we live cheaper than most, so I'll put numbers on my redneck style of existence.
Biggest expenses are government contributions and insurance. Leaving out income taxes, those are more than we live on. Have saved over 50% of after tax income for at least the last 20 years. No credit payments of any type for last 30 years.
Seem to be able to live pretty good on $20k or so a year, could cut a grand or so off that if DW didn't travel with me sometimes, could also give up beer??? . Could cut property taxes by 6 grand or so by leaving this area for an lower property tax state, give up 2 or 3 of 4 vechiles licensed, etc. and get expenses under $10K/year if had to.
Gifts, etc obviously not included.
Local taxes and insurance over 50% of living expenses, even leaving out stuff like the $16/year for polution tests, etc.
Taxes
sales tax
$800
property tax
$7,327
tack on tax
$200
rental car, phone, hotels, etc.
car tabs
$120
local tax tot
$8,447
Insurance
HO
$823
cars
$732
life
$600
medical
$500
(includes deductibels, good company plan)
Ins tot.
$2,655
Living per mo.
Qwest
$25
Comcast
$58
PSE
$90
garbage
-$5
recycle nearly 100%, no carbbage service
water
$0
well, part of power bill
sewer
$1
septic maint proratedpump every 20 years
Beer
$20
Food
$300
gasoline
$60
total /mo*12
$6,588
Incindental/mo
maint
$35
travel
$200
clothes
$20
(mine are all from goodwill, even shoes, DW makes most her own)
garage sales
$50
entertainment
$20
total incid*12
$3,900
Overall
$21,590
Proud to be cheap!
Good post Junkhound!
ONce you get down to the lower numbers, all sorts of government programs kick in. You could get heating credits or qualify for income supplements.
Don't give up the beer!
blueJust because you can, doesn't mean you should!
Warning! Be cautious when taking any framing advice from me. There are some in here who think I'm a hackmeister...they might be right! Of course, they might be wrong too!
all sorts of government programs kick in
Yep, blue, too bad I can't tell the gov I don't have any assets or just the income we live on and take advantage of some of those just to get back some taxes.
I maybe outta spend some $$, but it just ain't in my genetics. DW has told me if she is feeble when I die she's going to move into a $3500 a month assisted living setup, so maybe I might as well spend more?? . Still think it is part my responsibility to help the grandkids get the best education and start possible, but maybe that's wrong too?
Where my mom still lives in central IL north of Boss Hog, I think I could sell my house and acreage in Seattle area and buy a whole (maybe even 2) city block of houses and go into the gentrification businees for retirement - hum, there is another businees oportunity to explore, of course you would not want to buy, leverage a lot?
Still think it is part my responsibility to help the grandkids get the best education and start possible, but maybe that's wrong too?
There is no right or wrong, it's almost impossible to time it such that you spend your last penny on the last day. Anything left over would go to the kids and/or grandkids and/or favorite charities. Hey, do you know you can donate money to the tax department?
For me my responsibility ends after the kids finish college. Actually they are taking out loans to finance their education right now and although the arrangement never came up for discussion I think I'll have a hard time trying to convince them that I'll pay off their loans for them.
You'll never know, when time comes seeing the grandkids running around, I'll probably set up education trust funds for them.
hum, there is another businees oportunity to explore, of course you would not want to buy, leverage a lot?
LOL, Junkhound, get him.
"Where my mom still lives in central IL north of Boss Hog, I think I could sell my house and acreage in Seattle area and buy a whole (maybe even 2) city block of houses and go into the gentrification businees for retirement"
Funny you should mention that. Carlinville hasn't had any luck attracting businesses. So they're looking at the possibility of trying to attract retirees instead.
Heck, we're gonna have a super wally world, so they could all get jobs. (-:
The watchword of the left in those days [1960's & 1970's] was 'Never trust the government.' Now, of course, the left IS the government, and the new watchword is 'Never mind. [C. D. Tavares, 1997]
Yeah, I like the town - except for those humorless CC guys<G>
Thanks .
That was nice of you to do.
Even as you said , you could cut it deeper if you wanted to.
BTW, you might should check property taxes here from realator.com and other places.
http://208.229.144.62/dyn/pages/index/i/usahud/h/hudusa//pages.html
That site will tell ya some prices of homes with the taxes attached. Pick yer place.
Tim Mooney
"Your $200,000 a year retirement income IMHO is outrageous, for me anyway I wouldn't know what to do with that money."
How long you been at Breaktime Tom?
I live in Arkansas . Everytime a money discussion comes up on any subject it seems , we are on the bottom 10 percent. DW hired a lad from North Carlolina and paid him a 2 dollar raise to get him here and moved him here to boot . She took him and rented a 2 bedroom apartment which was pretty new . The price on it was 365 per month. At that time when they were back in the car he said he just realized he had a sizeable raise. Not in pay but in living savings. He told her that apartment would have rented for 800 where he came from. Ive heard about the same deal going for 2500 other places. Utilities total will run him 75 per month total. Trash and cable is paid . Phone will be 20 bucks per month. Hes making 15 dollars an hour and hes a key employee. Hes got a complete health plan here with dental and a retirement with vesting earnings with the company. Two weeks paid vacation and 1000 for Christmas. He actually was paid no benefits before.
To some the 208 figgure would be very excessive and others it would be hard. A lot of it depends on region.
Tim
>>>>""Your $200,000 a year retirement income IMHO is outrageous, for me anyway I wouldn't know what to do with that money."How long you been at Breaktime Tom? "Tim, I think you're misinterpreting the billing rate. The difference in billing rate and take home pay is huge.I would agree with Tom, $200k a year is excessive retirement income for 95% of the members of this board.
Jon Blakemore
I would agree with Tom, $200k a year is excessive retirement income for 95% of the members of this board.
Ok, let them say it .
Jon I appreciate the posts and I meant to answer yours too.
Jon, Im a trader plain and simple . The billing rate dont mean sqaut to me . Thats to live on . Im always looking for"licks" to pad the pocket. I may be wrong , but I dont believe thse gentlemen live on that billing rate. My billing rate was no where as huge but Ill refuse if theres a fire to go to. I refuse all the time now . They dont pay enough to tie up a billing rate here. So bid it better than a billing rate. What happens when they get clear to make a lick?
Tim
Tim,Pardon me, but what is a "lick"?I'm not insinuating that the billing rate is used for working by the hour (although it may be) but rather for estimating.
Jon Blakemore
" Pardon me, but what is a "lick"?
A lick is an overwhelming amount of profit on one deal. Much more than you would bill out in a billing rate. Most normally they call for an unusual amount of pain and suffering that has to be paid for in full in its entirety. There may be also risk involved and that must be priced accordingly. Some licks are just dumb azz luck, but they are licks just the same such as completing a job 75 percent ahead of shedule with only 25 percent bearing the cost of the labor projected. Sometimes your knowledge and expertise and or equiptment can bring a deal down for a big win or excessive profit. Im fixing to make a lick just in that way with no one looking . Its a bad job and no one wanted it. If they had on their mind what I have on mine they would leap for it. No one showed up at the sale . It will be a big winner for me.
Buying a house and finding out it was on 4 lots after the bid closing and acceptence , when I only figgured it to be on one which gave me free , three commercial lots to build a 6 plex on. That also is the security of the loan. It was a gift and I looked to the heavens and said , thanks . That was a "lick", even if it was BA luck.
Tim Mooney
Edited 4/20/2005 4:21 pm ET by TIMMOONEY52
She took him and rented a 2 bedroom apartment which was pretty new . The price on it was 365 per month. At that time when they were back in the car he said he just realized he had a sizeable raise. Not in pay but in living savings. He told her that apartment would have rented for 800 where he came from.
Tim, here in Toronto, the second most expensive city in Canada in terms of residential real estate prices, an average 800 sq. ft. 2 bedroom apartment in the outskirt would rent for around $1300-$1400. So we are talking about quite a bit of difference from where you are. That's why Junkhound said he can live on $20K US and I said $40K Canadian.
Jon said<!----><!----> <!---->
I would agree with Tom, $200k a year is excessive retirement income for 95% of the members of this board.
To give you some perspective, if somebody makes $200K here he would have been in the top 1% of all tax filers according to stat from Revenue Canadian. So either the Americans have a much higher income in general or a lot of the richer folks here do not file tax returns. You haven't mentioned it so far, how much do you think you can retire on?
Buying a house and finding out it was on 4 lots after the bid closing and acceptence , when I only figgured it to be on one which gave me free , three commercial lots to build a 6 plex on. That also is the security of the loan. It was a gift and I looked to the heavens and said , thanks . That was a "lick", even if it was BA luck.
Is the above your personal experience? If so, congrats. It could never have happened here because the real estate market is so efficient. With my luck I would have never come across this kind of "licks" in my lifetime X 10. Gerald Hayes the astute business man here once said hope and luck are in no way part of a business plan. Along the same line Jon said ss is just gravy.
he can live on $20K US and I said $40K Canadian.
That 20K is in the greater Seattle area, which is only a little behind CA in cost of living nowadays. That $20K US would drop to probably $12K in central IL or Louisiana, likely even lower in other places as you've said.
" you haven't mentioned it so far, how much do you think you can retire on?"
I consider that question a negative. I prefer to set goals and try to reach them. But in reality Im not really sure because Im doing some wide open gambling trying to make up lost time. I figgure I can back off to what ever it is but right now its very high. It needs to be 100,000 .
" Is the above your personal experience? "
Yes it is . No one knew becase there was no legal. It was a goverment repo and they had not recovered title when it sold.
Its true it cant be part of a business plan, but Ill take it ! <G> And thank you.
Tim Mooney
$4,000 a month to spend.
"Tell me again, Mr. Ledbetter. What's a Mississippi Flush and how's it beat this hand?It's a small revolver and any five cards."
Thats a great retirement here.
But then you dont have to worry about that do you?
OccupationGovernment/Public Service Military
Personal QuoteI work for the government, I pay taxes.
Thats quite a retierment plan in itself.
Tim
Tim, I have to make a trip into town for a couple of good steaks & a few beers to go with them.
The rest of the charges will be phone bills that I'm not gonna be too concerned about by the time they arrive.
That's it, Joe H
The rest of the charges will be phone bills that I'm not gonna be too concerned about by the time they arrive.
That's it, Joe H
You may be in the best shape of anyone.
Tim
This is pathedic .
If we were drawing 100 per hour , that would figure up to 208,000 per year. If we were disabled or for some reason the work had to end tomorrow , what would be the best plan ? How much money would it take to sustain that income and how would you do it?
Tim
But you don't need 208K per year 'cause you no longer have the costs of getting to work or maintaining a work wardrobe.
However, let's stay with your $208,000 let's assume that you live for another 25 years, and that in the last year of your life medical expenses and the funeral cost $300,000let's adopt an interest rate of 2.5% per annum (after alowing for taxes, investment fees and inflation)
drum roll please the amount you need to invest today is about $4 M
Ian
Tim
Rather than quote a number I'll let you work it out
How old are you? do you smoke? are you overweight? stress? heart problems? drug (alcohol and illicit) problem?
the answers will allow you to work out your life expectancy.
say you're a 57 yo male, Social Security quotes your life expectancy as about 22 years. But this is an average, if you feel lucky add 50% i.e. you expect to live till 90 so you need 33 years of income. If you're unlucky you'll only last year or two.
If you're 78, your life expectancy is 8 years. BTW the new Pope is 78
so lets say you expect to live about 25 years after retiring.
What would you like to do with your time? play golf, eat out three times a week, travel, sit at home?
this will help you work out the annual income required to support your desired lifestyle.
Do you want to leave a lump sum to the kids or grand kids?
With the above you can calculate the lump sum which, once invested, will generate an annual income for you. The easiest way is to use a spreadsheet.
Ian
wouldn't cost me a thang...just want sex on my last day and a beer and then kick the bucket.
Be well
a...
The secret of Zen in two words is, "Not always so"!
When we meet, we say, Namaste'..it means..
Once the house is paid off we will need about $36k net to live with some level of comfort.
I have no idea what to expect from Social Security in my waning years, so I'm figuring I will get zero from them. Any amount over that will be a bonus.
Jon Blakemore
the big question are the politiocs going to run up inflation like happened in the early 1980's interest rates at 15 to 20 % which killed real estate for a while. when the economy slows down you need to have your money spread around, not all your eggs in one basket. I think all this talk about private accounts for soc security is to create buyers for the baby boomers 401k plan, when they want to sell for their retirement money there needs to be new buyers and if you look at demographics there is a gap of available people with enough income to buy their 401k stocks. if you have a lot more sellers than buyiers the price goes down. soc security and a lot of the stock market is just a big ponzie scam. know when to get in and when to get out. 90% of us in construction will probably have to decrease our style of living. at 50 i thought i had every thing going my way but i had a house fire and got screwed by State Farm, then a divorce, then two heart attacks with no insurance so now i teach construction part time and live in my camper. It will take a long time for me to pay my 90k med bills when i am not physically able to work like i did to make my first mil that she got.
It depressed me to read that story.
My last brother got cancer on insurqnce hes never had and then got on medicare. He doesnt have anything now but hes not having the hardship you are and doesnt owe bills. Hes may be dieing though.
I had two heart attacks , a stroke , two heart caths , and open heart surgery. My lungs are permantly damaged from the operation. Cant figgure that one out. Ive paid out 47,000 in medical in the last year and a half since it first started. Theres no telling what the insurance paid. Last total I had them at 165,000.
The above is why Im in a hurry. I dont think Ill be around for old age . Two arteries have shut down and meds are keeping me alive . Theres nothing more they can do at the hospital. Surgery partially failed and the heart cath failed. I need to get this retirement thing done .
Tim Mooney