Hi,
Flooring won’t be installed till June because of the masonry which can’t be done till late June due to the weather. Apparently the mason can’t start work on the fireplace till the nighttime lows are above freezing.
The subflooring in the main room where the engineered hardwood is to be installed is uneven in several areas especially in the corners and the middle of the floor.
What’s the best way to deal with an uneven subfloor. I laid a 4′ level across the highest point of the floor and found it was at least 3/16th’s of an inch out. You could rock the level.
Would it be best to install new plywood sheathing (1/4″ or 1/8″) over the entire subfloor? and then shim?
A friend of mine told me that some people actually use asphalt shingles to level floors. I have never heard of that!
Wanda
Replies
I would try this method:
Fasten a 2x4 along the longest walls, get a 1x6 screetboard (width of the room, Straight of course), notch the ends so that the screetboard touches the highes point of the floor.
Pour floor levelling compound and strike off with the screetboard.
Isn't floor leveling compound liquid enough to self level?
I have used floor leveling compound and although it is suppose to be self leveling you need to know what is low and what is high so you push it in the correct places. Suggestion: Set up a Lazar level. Find the highest point and mark a stick sitting on that point where the Lazar line hits the stick. Then start in one corner and set the stick on the subfloor. You can see or measure how much that point is lower than the high point. Install a screw or nail in the floor at that point that sticks up enough to match the high point. Continue in the room in some sort of pattern doing the same procedure. When complete setting the stick on any screw or nail head the line marked on the stick needs to match the Lazar line. Now pour your leveling compound and use the heads as your guide to level the floor. This assures you that the floor will turn out level. I came to this method after believing self leveling mixes actually work by themselves and had to do a lot of rework.
not all of it
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sometimes
personally I never relied on it if you want a well levelled floor
thanks for the info, I'll be helping my brother with a bathroom. I thought we'd tear out the original tile, and level the floor at that time, but he says he's been told he can just tile over it. I didn't think it was a good idea, any thoughts?
he says he's been told he can just tile over it.
Probably by the 'expert' at Home Despot....
There are different types of floor levelling compounds, Doc. The stuff you're thinking of is referred to as 'SLC' or self-levelling compound. It's expensive, and it can be a real 'Chinese fire-drill' to work with (to quote Boris Yeltsin, BT's former tile guru). The stuff sets up so fast that for a largish room if you don't have teams of helpers mixing up batches to keep it coming, you'll wind up with mess. It's also so thin and soupy (has to be, to flow to level by itself) that if you don't block up every little crack and crevice around the floor area you're pouring, it'll leak down into the walls or ceilings below.
Ordinary floor levelling compound is simply a high-compression cement product that will adhere in thin layers (up to about an inch or so max) to most porous substrates. You trowel it onto the sub-floor and do your levelling or flattening the old fashioned way.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
Lot's of methods work. I have to be looking at it and scratching my chin to decide the best for the job at hand.
Too bad and I take up the subfloor and deal with it on the framing.
Sometimes just some floor leveling compound on the subfloor.
Sometimes cedar shingle shims, then a new ply of subflooring.
Sometimes shims and leveling compound.
I wouldn't use asphalt shingles tho.
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Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
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I wouldn't use asphalt shingles tho.
Actually, I do use 'em...just not everywhere. I especially like them for shimming under sleepers I'm laying on a basement slab. They're a uniform thickness, they're tough, and they don't rot. And they're essentially free.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
For something like that maybe, but that is not her situatiuon.'course, after having to tear off the roof again, she p[robably has enough to shim the leaning tower of Pisa
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I musta missed that part....
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
'nuther thread. Wanda has had a few rather unpleasant experiences with a bad contractor who hired a "roofer" to rebuild her house instead of hiring qualified tradesmen.
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Ah....
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
for me the question would be how bad is it out of level Vs flat. Can you feel the out of level when you walk through the room?
This is a new build insn't it? Why is it out of level?
It should be flattened to within the specs required for the engineered flooring, whatever that is for that particular product.
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Hello Piffin,
I'll call the flooring company tomorrow to check out the specs for the brand of engineered hardwood flooring I have . I'm sure I read on their webpage that the max. was 1/4" over an 8' span.
wanda
Hi John,
This is a 35 yr old bungalow which is being renovated. The floors in the hallway are also out of level as well as the kitchen. The floor is highest at the center of the room where the old fireplace was just removed due to improper support. It dips as you walk towards the back wall (right in the corner.
I"m hoping shims and plywood will take care of the problem. I'll be meeting soon with the carpenter to see what can be done. See what he suggests.
Wanda
flattening may be the best route in lieu of leveling. May also call for reinforcing overspanned joists to get them siff enough to not sag any further.
Hi,
When the carpenter finishes up with the siding he's going to go down into the basement and check out the joists. Hopefully he wont' discover any unpleasant surprises. The joists could probably do with some cross braces for added support. He'll let me know if that's the case.
Wanda
what does the mason do the other ten months of the year?
anyway, latex leveling compound. mix it up in a bucket, pour it on the floor and trowel with the biggest float you can find or a long board
quick, cheap and easy
I really didn't want to open that can of worms, but sounded like a lame way of telling her that he has a better job going on right now. A fireplace build on the interior could be done up there any damn time of year.but word is probably out now that Wanda don't take no sh!t and don't hold no prisoners so he wants EVERYTHING to be purr fect
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Hello Piffin,
The mason is putting in a Rumford fireplace. So he has to put in a concrete footing outside to suppport the weight of the Rumford. Remember the old fireplace was one of those prefab jobs with the pipe going up and out through the roof. This new fireplace will involve masonry on the inside and outside. Must be the morter that he's concerned about.
I will try and connect with the mason tomorrow. Have no idea why he hasn't at least e-mailed me. He's supposed to have done up a written estimate for me. So no doubt he is working on some BIG job somewhere else at the moment. But I need an estimate so I can decide if I can afford this Rumford fireplace. Otherwise I will have a woodstove installed. If I can't get a hold of this man I will have no other choice but to call another mason.
Wanda
Rumfoord fireplaces are quite efficient as far as fireplaces go, but no fireplace can compare with a woodstove for heating efficiency. If you're actually planning on heating your place (to whatever extent) with this installation, I would strongly recommend you go for a woodstove instead of the fireplace.
Take at look at Jotul woodstoves on the web.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
Hi Dinosaur,
Nope, not trying to use the fireplace to heat the entire house. I have electric heat. But yes, it would be more efficient to go with a woodstove if that was my only source of heat. A modern woodstove is much cleaner and it doesn't use up as much fuel meaning less returns to the woodpile. :)
Wanda
Hi Piffin,
Since you've been following this reno from the very beginning. Here are a few pics of the old fireplace being dismantled. The Brick veneer is gone! Only a few bricks and the prefab unit remain.
These were taken last week when I was up to check on the work being done.
Wanda
whale, tank ewe!I see there's been a lot get done this past month. The new sheetrock up means the roof got re-framed and replaced, and I think that is new casing on the window.
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Two things:
1. Levelling a floor and flattening it are two different things. The floor may be level overall but still not flat enough to lay finish flooring. It might also be fairly flat but not level.
Laminated flooring (please don't use that grammatical abomination 'engineered hardwood'!) doesn't care if the subfloor isn't dead level--certainly not if it's out by the small amount you mentioned. But it does care if the subfloor is flat: Voids under the laminate that are too deep for the underlayment's cushioning effect to fill (a sixtheenth is about maximum) will cause the laminate to crack at the joints as it flexes when people walk on it.
2. How to flatten it depends a lot on how bad it is to start.
For a bad ridge or major (+1") height differences I rip up the subfloor, string-line the joists, then plane/shim as needed before laying a new subfloor. (This is also the procedure to follow if the floor is so far out of level that you can't deal with it even if the laminate can.)
For a moderately wavy floor, I snap a 2' x 2' grid then shoot it with a transit or laser level and a story stick. Mark the height at each grid intersection in eighths, right on the floor itself, then draw circles through all points of equal height. This makes a 'contour map' of the humps and valleys right on the floor itself. Then fill in the valleys with thinset concrete patching compound--not thinset mortar, which doesn't have enough compressive strength--and fair those patches into the humps so the whole thing is flat to the required tolerance.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....
Dimosaur,
I agree with you.... The flooring that I purchased is basically T/G LAMINATED flooring. layers of hardwood veneer glued to a plywood core. NO matter what people say it isn't as durable as real hardwood which might take more time to install but it can be sanded over and over if need be. Scratches and minior dents can be sanded out.
The floor is unlevel but it is /appears to be flat. The Sheets of plywood sheathing don't appear to have any serious dips or valleys. The floor isn't wavy.
Wanda
I laid a wood floor recently over new construction subfloor and wanted it flat to within 3/16" in 8 feet. I used 30# felt to shim up the low spots--there were two of them and they were both caused by joists that were a little low. I have a 12 foot aluminum straightedge so I laid that on the floor and moved it around to get an idea of where the areas started and ended, then cut layers of 30# felt to build up as needed. It's almost 1/16" thick so it goes fairly quickly if you're not trying to gain too much. Once the shimming was done I laid 15# felt over the entire floor, then laid the flooring. It's fairly shiny stuff and you cannot detect any variation in flatness anywhere, no matter what height or angle you look from.
If the floor had been worse, or had raised plywood edges, I would have brought in a floor sander and hit the high spots first. Using a long straightedge and a floor sander can do a lot of good.