Replies

1. 
   Ragnar17 | Dec 30, 2002 03:39am | #1

   Bevelled siding goes up fairly easily, but maybe some of these tips will be helpful.

   I'd figure out ahead of time where each course is going to run.  For example, it makes a lot of sense to try to get one full (i.e. un-notched) course directly above the window trim.  Also, it helps to minimize the notching under the window sills.  So measure where the windows are at in terms of elevation and see if you can work out a uniform exposure to get things to lay out nicely. 

   Then, use a story stick to mark out these elevations.  I also find it useful to use a water level at the corners of the house to make sure you're keeping your courses level and parallel to one another.  Remember to always refer to your story stick as opposed to measuring exposures sequentially, as any error will really add up if you do it the latter way.

   I'd definitely get a siding nailer (Makita makes a good one) - either purchase it or rent one if you can.  The most important thing to follow when nailing cedar siding is to NOT double-nail at any given stud, as it can lead to buckling issues.  You might already know this, but if not, let me know, and I'll elaborate.

   I always miter the outside corners.  Since you're using 8" siding, you're going to have to lay the pieces flat on the chop saw and adjust your saw to a compound angle to get the fit right.   (There are helpful tricks for smaller siding, but they're not applicable here).  I always apply some caulk to the miter before assembly, and it really seems to help keep the joints closed.

   Ragnar

2. 
   Mongo | Dec 30, 2002 04:16am | #2

   As a DIYer, I'll offer slightly dfferent advice to you than Ragnar. I'd recommend inside and outside corner boards. This will make your iinstallation a heckuva lot easier. Cut your boards slightly long, 1/16th or so, bow the board out, place both ends, then "snap" the middle of the board into place. That'll minimize joints opening up as the wood seasons.

   Hand nail. The nail heads should be set flush with the surface of the clap. Use stainless splitless ring shank nails, 6d should suffice. Nail into the studs.

   If solid staining or painting, backprime, backprime, backprime.

   For more info, read this:

   http://www.lumber.com/products/cedar/ced_03.asp

1. 
   Ragnar17 | Dec 30, 2002 04:21am | #3

   Good points, Mongo.  Corner boards are a lot easier for someone without a lot of carpentry experience. 

   By the way, are you a DIYer, Mongo?  I thought you were in this stuff professionally.

   Ragnar

1. 
   Mongo | Dec 30, 2002 08:45am | #5

   When I wrote "As a DIYer..." I was referring too him.

   I've stradled both sides of the fence. When referring to construction, that is.<g>

2. 
   Lateapex911 | Dec 30, 2002 04:46am | #4

   Corner boards are the easy way to go, but the look is very different.  Do yourself a favor and look at some pictures of houses that you like the syle of, and then make your decision.

   In the long run it may be worth the extra effort to go with the right look, as you will look at and live in the house for years....the extra time spent will be long forgotten.  But if you look at the house a few years down the road and don't like what you see......Jake Gulick

   [email protected]

   CarriageHouse Design

   Black Rock, CT

1. 
   Mongo | Dec 30, 2002 08:55am | #6

   Valid point, Jake.

   I'm a little east of you and virtually all colonial-stye. I'd say almost everything out here leans towards corner boards. I didn't get too much into it as I figured he'd read about it on the link I posted.

   Edit: Also..I got an email regarding my previous post asking for clarificaton. When I wrote "cut the boards a little long" and "snap them into place" I was referring to the clapboards, not the corner boards.

   Edited 12/30/2002 12:57:58 AM ET by Mongo

3. 
   NathanW | Dec 30, 2002 09:50am | #7

   Buuuurrrrpp....sorry, just stumbled into here from the tavern...

   was thinking.. if you snap one board into place, and shove the corner boards out by however long ya cut that board, then snap another into place, and shove the corner board(s) out by that much, then snap another into place, and shove the corner board(s) out by that much...yer corner board aint gonna be touching the sheathing by much by the time ya get to the top.

   am wiht you with the ring-shank, hand driven stainless nails. Lets you and I make sure we make a nice and plumb line of them as we go up. Nothing worse than a wandering drunken line of bright nail heads. Unless it's pecker marks, or caulk applied to the top of the siding. Seal the end grain of the cuts and back-caulk with a decent sealant like Sika 1-A , before applying the board.

   HeY, You seen a bAr around here anywEhre?

1. 
   Mongo | Dec 30, 2002 04:10pm | #8

   Nope, corner boards don't move.

1. 
   Boxduh | Dec 30, 2002 06:00pm | #9

   A little 6" wide piece of 15# felt paper, stapled over an underlying clap where a joint will sit atop, bottom edge of the felt a smidge above the lap line, top edge a couple inches up on the sheathing, helps keep water out when it gets through those butt joints.  And at the ends, butting to the corner boards, I gun a small bead of caulk in the joint before setting the clap, big enough to get a seal, small enough so as to avoid squishout.  Keep a small can of alkyd primer handy and a brush, and coat all cut ends as you are going.  Good luck.

1. 
   Skiyup | Dec 30, 2002 06:53pm | #10

   One of your first considerations may be what to install under the cedar.Ther have been some issues in regards to Tyvek and other similar materials. My experience is that tar paper is as good as any material out there, with a proven track record.Don't let anyone convince you that galvanized nails are sufficient.They react with the tannin in the wood. FWIW Skip

2. 
   Ragnar17 | Dec 30, 2002 08:20pm | #11

   Nice tip regarding the use of tar paper as a mini-flashing at butt joints.

   Thanks,

   Ragnar

2. 
   NathanW | Dec 31, 2002 08:45am | #12

   When I was cutting the channel too long today, the doggone corner boards were moving, or, the brick mold at the window was moving.

   you fastening them corners with lags?

1. 
   Mongo | Dec 31, 2002 09:15am | #13

   I thought you wre joking in your previous post.

   I assemble the 5/4 corner boards before nailng them up. They're nailed off into the corner studs. They don't budge.

   Same with window/door trim. It gets nailed off into the studs that frame the rough opening. No movement.

   I could see the trim moving if your nails are only hitting the sheathing and not the framing. I suppose even if you hit the framing, the nails could give if you're fastening the trim with thin-gauge nails shot out of a gun.

   When the clapboards are bowed into place, the middle of the longest clap should only stand a couple inches max from the sheathing. Are you cutting them too long?

   In your post, what "channel" are you cutting long?

2. 
   FrankB89 | Dec 31, 2002 04:59pm | #14

   To BZ71:  (can't seem to edit the "TO")

   Since I've installed a lot of beveled cedar, (and sawed it, too), guess I'll weigh in here with an OPINION.

   I have pretty much come to using corner boards exclusively, partially because of appearance but also for durability.  Mitered corners may be a testimony to the skill of the installer (not really that difficult), but mitered corners are pretty vulnerable to getting beat up by dogs, tree limbs flying in windstorms, kids toys, etc., and repairs are tough.  Even the metal corner trim that gives the mitered look can get damaged over time.

   Cedar is pretty soft (redwood even more so).  Take that into consideration when deciding on install method.

   Jules Quaver for President   2004

   Edited 12/31/2002 9:02:45 AM ET by Notchman

3. 
   UncleDunc | Dec 31, 2002 06:43pm | #16

   If you use the Advanced View instead of the Basic View, there is a pop up menu for the To: field in the message composition window. You can switch between Advanced View and Basic View by using links at the bottom of the message reading frame, or by clicking on My Forums and editing your preferences.

4. 
   FrankB89 | Jan 01, 2003 01:21am | #17

   Thanks, Unc.  I'm still a little low on the learning curve on the fine points (and even some of the basic points) of this site.

   Andybuildz post reminded me of another corner treatment I've used, and like, and that is a moulded quarter-round made for the purpose.  They give a reveal of about 7/8" on the edges and are center-rabbeted on the backside to wrap the corner.

   The ones I've used are of VG red cedar...they're usually a special order item in my area and cost about $20 for a 10' stick and are available in multiples of 10' through 16' as I recall.

   Jules Quaver for President   2004

5. 
   NathanW | Jan 01, 2003 09:28am | #18

   Hey there

   Current siding job is horizontal channel ( I call it that, however it may be called differently in your neck of the woods). Tight knot, 3/4" second growth, fairly dry.

   Corner boards were cut from old growth, ripped to 7/8 x 1 1/2, to stand just proud of the siding. Fastened every two feet into the corner framing with 3 1/8 ss trim screws. Not a whole lot of holding power, but enough, especially with the sikaflex back-caulking. Brick mold at windows and doors is (probably) old growth doug-fir. or at least older second-growth.

   My guess is that the corner boards and molding are so dense, and the channel siding dense enough, that there is no compression of wood fibers happening, so all the extra length of a siding piece forces the trim to move. I would bet that a softer, younger cedar would allow you to overcut the length a little, and not move the trim...

   I'm thinking that the ultimate defense against shrinkage would be fully climatized material, before application.

   Happy new year

6. 
   Mongo | Jan 01, 2003 10:27am | #19

   Ah...wiith the new year comes clarity...

   I'm refering to cedar claps, you're writing about a much larger and stiffer piece of siding. Also, with your corner boards being only 1 1/2" wide, I can certainly see them being bowed here and there when pushed by the stronger siding.

   Thanks for posting the extra info.

3. 
   andybuildz | Dec 31, 2002 05:45pm | #15

   BE

      I "always" rabbet out the back of my 5/4" corner boards about a 1/2" deep and cut my claps an 1/8" shy or so. I also miter my corner boards, glue them and sand the corners a bit round...for a clean look.

   Be well

           Namaste'

                        Andy

   One works on oneself, always. That's the greatest gift you can give to community because the more you extricate your mind from that which defines separateness, that defines community. The first thing is to become community. "Ram Dass"

   http://CLIFFORDRENOVATIONS.COM