I had quartz counters installed this week on our new cabinets as the last piece of our kitchen remodel. I worked with a designer at a kitchen remodeling place during this process to help with the layout and coordinating of the ordering and installation. I did the prep work, demolition, and finish work. My house is old, out of level and not plumb virtually everywhere – such is life in the old house. I feel that both the cabinet and counter installers were good guys and did good work individually. The cabinets had to be shimmed quite a bit in places to adjust for the flooring and wall issues. The counters were not templated, but ordered simultaneously, because my kitchen guy said they were all pretty straight forward. I believed him because I don’t have any experience with cabinet and counter installation. You can probably guess what happened. The counters were cut exactly to the right size, not accounting for the shimming. To achieve the proper overhang at the fronts, they had to be pulled out from the back, leaving a gap, up to a full inch in places. This gap was covered by our full-thickness splash. The problem is that at the edges the gap is exposed, and on one L shaped piece of counter, having to pull it out in two directions caused an awkward edge. Now, you really have to be looking for the details to see this, but that’s what I do. The counters are beautiful, and so far no one that has come to see them has even noticed. I had the designer back out yesterday and we talked about options. Short of completely replacing them, the best solution seems to be to have the fabricator cut and polish little “plugs” to fill the corners in. Does this seem reasonable to you all? I’m not the kind of person that will raise hell about something unless I’m really mad – it’s just not my personality – and I’m not really mad, just kind of disappointed. These counters weren’t cheap. If they can pull this off I think they’ll probably look fine. I just wanted to bounce it off of you pro’s to see what you thought and make sure I’m not getting taken advantage of. Thanks for your time if you’ve made it this far!
Edited 6/20/2003 11:56:39 AM ET by CAMPBELLDUST
Replies
Did your kitchen designer act in a GC type role? If so, he/she is responsible for coordination of the various trades and the overall sequencing of work. Whatever the solution is, don't pay a penny out of your own pocket to correct a lack of oversight on their part. If the kitchen designer was simply a designer and you contracted individually with each of the trades, it's probably not as clear cut. In either case, I would think the counter top installer is responsible because he/she did not verify existing conditions before ordering the counters. Just my 0.02.
The kitchen designer acted as GC for the cabinet and counter installers. It was also him that ordered both and specified the counter sizes to the fabricator. The fabricator provided the counters to the installer who then ran into the problems I descrided.
By the way, I forgot to add before that I will not be charged (nor would I pay) for the plug solution. Also, he is working up a reduction in price for me for the problems experienced, including this one, and a miscommunication on the sink cutout and installation. I haven't gotten a figure yet, but don't really expect it to be a lot - just a bone.
If I understand this correctly you have a gap at the back of the counter top. Could you add two layers of sheet rock to the wall between the uppers and lowers and finish and paint, tile or ...........?
Yes, there was a gap, but the splash covered it along the wall. The remaining gap I'm talking about is what you see at the ends of the counter pieces - if you have a piece of counter pulled out from the wall an inch and then set splash on top to cover it, then at the ends of the counter at the corners you still have a little square gap exposed. It's not a huge deal, I just have a perfectionist personality so I notice little things like that. Also, they are coming back to fill the gaps in with little blocks of the counter material, so they will blend in. I guess I was just looking for comments on whether that's no big deal or if I should be more worried about it.
Since my original post I've spoken with our kitchen designer and he is giving me a $210 credit on the remaining balance to fair things up.
I have done a lot of remodeling, and the little flaws eat me up. I am working on dealing with it better. Sometimes they can't be helped, sometimes judgement calls you can't go back on, sometimes plain mistakes. My experience is that other people never notice. I have been in construction all of my life and notice things other people who have not trained their eyes don't.
like... I can look at a yard and see if the finish grading is done properly. I can look at a wall and tell if crooked studs are in it. I notice uneven tiling. All of these obviously are if the problem is significant enough. I would say in your situation no one will ever notice and you will be happy if you put it behind you with the plug experience.
My worst was pointing out to my wife after a complete bathroom tear-out and rebuild where the ceiling drywall finish wasn't great because of a rafter warped at the end. When she showed my in-laws the new bathroom the first thing she pointed out was the dw.
remodeler
Thanks remodeler, that's exactly what I was hoping to hear from someone. I drive my wife nuts obsessing over little things that no one will probably notice and that won't affect our enjoyment of whatever it is. This is an example. The up side is the things I do myself are done well and right (if a little slowly) :). The down side is that I'm hyper critical of everything.
Thanks for the words of wisdom.
About a year ago my new Corian tops were placed on my new cabinets (new construction). The Corian fabricator was the installer.
When they set the down, I was immediately disappointed with the "gaps" I saw along the front "build-up" edge...3 pieces are glued together. I used matterhorn material, apparently there is no matterhorn specific epoxy/glue, so they do the best they can.
There was also one seam in the L corner that was clearly visible.
Clearly visible to me that is...my wife, my parents, and a handful of other people couldn't see these things, some even after I pointed them out....
So I understand that "can be a little anal" problem I think...LOL. Especially when the expectations are high.
The folks told me they'd rip it all out and do it all again if I wanted...so they were on my side to make me happy. In the end, they came out and did a little more polishing. And now I can't see that one seam in the top...and I have to look hard to find the seams in the front glue up.
So more than likely, they want to make you happy. $210 won't do it...$2100 won't do it most likely, you just want it to look good.
I did go in their shop and look at the other displays...and sure enough, some of the front build up seams can be "seen". You have to look...they do good decent work I think.
Bottom line...do what makes you happy. Have those plugs put it...if I understand your description, it will fill that hole and you won't see it. You'll know they are there...you may point them out to others....but they'll NEVER seen it if you don't. I do the same...point out all the "mistakes" I made in my work...and I don't think many folks can see 'em when I'm pointing. Nothing like being your own critic.
If they had the blocks during install you may never have noticed them! Let them install and cash the check and relax!
the best solution would have been to template the top after cabinet installation
an experienced kitchen designer would have caught the fact that the house is out of level, plumb and square, in our trade this is very common problem solved by templating after cabinet installation
solution now? well how well can they fill in the gaps?, how visible are they?
sounds like the only solution to me
moral of the story? a template is a heck of a lot cheaper than a ruined countertop
steve
"caulking is not a piece of trim"