ANY SUGGESTIONS ON HOW TO LEVEL A CEMENT GARAGE FLOOR FOR A BEDROOM CONVERSION. I PLAN TO USE 2X4 STRINGERS WITH FOAM INSULATION AND 3/4 PLY. THERE ARE NO MOISTURE PROBLEMS
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Scribe some 2 X 6's to get your desired 2 X 4 height - I'm assuming that you have some drop in the floor. Tap con down and your good to go.
Would you be using treated 2 X's for this?
Doug
DID NOT INTEND TO BECAUSE OF NO MOISTURE PROBLEMS BUT NOW THAT YOU MENTIONED IT, MAYBE A GOOD IDEA FOR INSECT PROTECTION, THANKS
I dont know if you need to use the treated but I do know that wood can wick moisture from concrete. Maybe you dont have any to wick - you'd know that better then I.
BTW, unlock your cap button - the computer police will be along shortly!
Doug
Hey Doug,
Out of curiosity, do you have a method of scribing sleepers to a floor that is both uneven and out of level?
thx, k
Rotary laser, if you can get he beam down low enough. By far the most accurate way
Forrest - interupting
yeah, but I was asking how he would temporarily place the boards to that level in order to scribe them so they'd end up both flush and level, whether you get it from a rotary or builder's or spirit level. He said he'd level up two or more sills first, then place the sleepers, then scribe.
k
I'd establish a spot that all things were leveled against or to, then level my boards to that height with shims or what ever you chose. Make sure that your shims don't stick out far enough to impede the scribe.
Once I had the 2 X level I'd scribe away. Remove excess and screw to the floor. If you happen to take a little more off then your supposed to shim it back(using a little PL on the shims) to where it belongs.
Make sure that if you set your point of level to say 4 1/2" and you want the finish board to be say 3" tall when done(from the low point) you take the same amount off - in this case that would mean that the scribe would be set to 1 1/2" from the low point, not necessarily do you take 1 1/2" off.
It makes sense to me but probably not to anyone else reading this!
Doug
That actually did make sense, except that if you're doing all that shimming to be able to scribe anyway, why not just shim 2x's up level to the highest spot and not scribe at all? I guess you get solid bearing if you scribe, but I might rather have the breathing room anyway. Plus, I'd rather not carve all that PT if I didn't have to; there's the toxic dust, but also, when you cut away the wood at the edge you remove a lot of the preservative.
But, I also have to be honest that I would just rather play with a laser or builder's level and stack different thickness shims around a room than scribe and cut a bunch of joists/sleepers. personal preference, I guess.
k
KFC
I get what your saying about just shimming the whole thing level, I think someone else mentioned that's the way they do it - build your box with all the joists in it and shim the whole thing level. Seams like a much easier way to achieve the same thing! And as you said, you don't have to breath in that nasty treated dust.
Doug
Yeah. I understand your satisfaction with a nicely scribed board sitting perfectly on the slab, too. That's the great thing about a lot of this stuff- we can do it any number of ways.
all right, i gotta get some sleep...
k
I have a similar project coming up. When you shim it level, is there any concern that the shims will compress over time?
Cut shims from end material--less shrinkage.
I did a floor over slab like this by shimming 2x on edge, up with end cut 2x material.
Worked fine."Research is what I'm doing when I don't know what I'm doing..."
Use plastic shims.
What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the will to find out, which is the exact opposite. --Bertrand Russell
What Walters said. Plus you can get these hard plastic shims that would do the trick to. I see them in the tile section at the big box stores.
I see DanH already mentioned the plastic shims!
Doug
Edited 4/4/2008 8:54 pm ET by DougU
Just get a temporary "sill" shimmed level and flat along opposite walls. Lay the (straight) stringers on top of the two sills (and maybe one in the middle) and scribe to the floor.
What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the will to find out, which is the exact opposite. --Bertrand Russell
Wicking won't be a problem if the foam is under the stringers.
PT is always recomded for contact with masonry surfaces, moisture problem or not
Im sure you dont want to pull it all up someday.
just because you dont see moisture dosent mean once you close it in it wont be there, lay some plastic on there for a vapor barrier too.
you could test it by laying some plastic on there temporay, espically during this time of year with cold nights and warmer days the concrete will always condensate.
At least thats my opinion in my area of the country. Would always use PT in contact with concrete.
If you don't want to scribe you could build two or more stringer frames (or one, if you could figure out how to drop it in there) with the stringers all laid out, put them on the floor, clamp & nail em together flush, then shim up the joists as needed, level and in plane. You could use felt shims, or wood shims over waterproofing. Then tapcon or ramset em.
k
Typically in this scenario, I do 1 of 2 things.
If the garage floor steps down alot from main floor, I frame a whole new floor over the slab. Usually the 1st floor top plate height is consistent throughout, so ceiling height stays same. That way, I can frame a 2x8 or 2x10 floor w/ fiberglass insulation and 3/4 sub. Line floors up with the rest of the house, and pretty easy to accomplish. Also makes it easier for plumbers, electricians, etc, depending on the use of the space.I'm also a lot more comfy doing hardwoods over ply sub 16" above conc than I am over conc with other methods out there.
If trying to maximize ceiling height or keep close to original grade. I do the shim thing, but I don't scribe a tapered wedge type deal. I run the other way with the sleepers. Usually the floor is consistent enough to go with gradually increasing thicknesses of pt lumber with small shims to make up for slight waves. 3/4, then 5/4, then 2x on flat, then 2x on flat+3/4 then 2-2xs, then 2x on edge, etc. shimmed with tapcons and pl adhesive.....has worked for me pretty well. If you have access to a laser, you don't necessarily have to put it low... use a grade stick and you can put it wherever ya want.
Bing
ok... way outside the box here but... then i usually am...
build your 2x4 joist floor just as you would if it was 2x8 or 2x10... might have to shim it some but get it level... i don't know your spans but shim it about 4ft o/c if you want.... now get your spray foam out and fill under every "joists" between it and the concrete floor... zero cutting or scribe'n ... no tap cons... your load is going to be very well distributed with 3/4 decking... i think you'll be fine...
p