Recently I had our air conditioner (at least 20 years old) looked at by a local heating & air conditioning company. This guy mentioned that the new National Energy Plan will impact our old air conditioner and that we might want to consider purchasing a new one. He said the Plan requires manufactures to produce more efficient air conditioners. Although they have been given a reasonable period of time to convert over, it appears that they are beginning the switch sooner than necessary. If I buy one of these new units, we will have to redo the existing duct work in the house. And it looks like these units may be efficient but they will take twice as long to cool the home. He suggests that we buy a “current” energy efficient unit to avoid this retooling issue and save money.
Another issue is the Freon and EPA’s mandate to phase it out. It is to be replaced by R4-10A, a non-ozone depleting replacement. This new refrigerant requires pressures up to 50% greater than Freon, so it can’t be used in existing equipment. There is apparently no practical way to convert existing equipment.
I’ve looked on the internet to research the new energy plan & his statements but wasn’t very successful. I know our unit is not as efficient as it used to be. It just doesn’t cool the house like it used to, so I know it’s a matter of time before we have to replace it. Does anybody have any experience with air conditioning that concurs with this man’s view of the future of air conditioning. Or could point me in the right direction for answers. Thanks.
Replies
Let me guess he's commission sales.
Even if a new code comes out you're grandfathered in.
Question is your ac a heat pump or a split system?
If it's just a split ac , meaning a compressor out side & a coil inside, usually ran with copper suction <larger pipe> & liquid <smaller pipe> line. We test these @ 4 to 6 hundred psi.
Since your 20yr ac does not cool like it used too several factors can lead to this-here are some.
fan blower------dirty,bad motor,set on wrong speed etc.......
outside compressor-------dirty cooling coil , bad pump
inside coil --- dirty fins, corrosion, dirty nozzles
whole system bad freon----meaning impurities in it-- low freon
Suggestion --- call the manufacturer see if they have a local rep for service.
I had a gut feeling this was a dishonest sales pitch. I'll do some more research and let you know how it turns out. Thanks for your help plumbbill.
First, I would recommend that you find a competetnt contractor. Sounds like the one that came is crooked and incompetent.
Second, there are some distorted truth to what you were told. After January 20, 2006, it will no longer be legal to manufacture or import residential split air conditioner units that are rated at less than 13 SEER.
"If I buy one of these new units, we will have to redo the existing duct work in the house. And it looks like these units may be efficient but they will take twice as long to cool the home."
Both of these statements are completely wrong. The efficiency of the AC unit has nothing to do with the ductwork. The capacity of the unit is what will determine how fast it can cool down the house. If the unit is replaced with one of the same capacity but higher efficiency, nothing but your energy consumption will change.
The refrigerant commonly used in most comfort applications (i.e. air conditioning) is R-22, and after 2020, it will no longer be manufactured. After 2010 equipment may no longer be made that uses R-22. R410A does operate at higher pressures and cannot be used in equipment desgned for R-22. Look at http://www.epa.gov/ozone/title6/phaseout/22phaseout.html for more info.
Great information Tim and thanks for the EPA lead. You really have to watch your back with all sales' pitches. This one was definitely "the sky is falling" approach. Thanks again for your input!
>> If I buy one of these new units, we will have to redo the existing duct work in the house
What I've heard is that (i) new condensing coils will be necessary and (ii) they will be noticably taller than older units, so in some cases modification of some ducts at the furnace might be.
Bob,
IF the inside coil (BTW, the evaporator) is not large enough to acheive the full 13 SEER it can be replaced. If, as in several projects that I am involved, there are specific requirements that the system is to be ARI certified, specific, tested configurations exist and one of those combinations must be used. Sometimes, the evaporator is nominally 1/2 ton larger than the condensing unit, but not always. A TXV, which is a relatively simple retrofit, is usually required to acheive the higher SEER rating. IF the existing evaporator coil is a cased coil and a larger one is required, some minor duct modifications would be in order.
There are plenty of 13, 14 and 15 SEER systems that operate on R-22 refrigereant. R-410A has nothing to do the the thermal efficiency of the system, it is however, the most common present replacement for R-22.
Tim
Tim, you're spot-on as usual. The only valid reason I can think of to replace ductwork is to address CFM requirements in case the ductwork is inadequate. I have seen way too much ductwork at HVAC-Talk that was inadequate for the flow... the latest being a 10 ton package unit hooked up to two 8" round flue pipes, one as a supply, the other as a return. :-P So, perhaps the installer is noting that raingirl has a duct system that needs remediation to get the necessary flow and mis-spoke about the reasons why? Could be marketing hype as well.410A seems to be the refrigerant of choice to replace R-22 in North America. Europe and the rest of the world also seem to have their own ideas about what refrigerants to standardize on.
Edited 11/16/2005 9:10 am ET by Constantin
I am not familiar with the HVAC industry outside of North America. Does the EU utilize different refrigerants?
Way too many forced air installations have inadequate duct work to allow the system to function close to "as designed", and that could be very well be thecase here as well. It seems, given the scare tactics used, that this is primarily a case of a dirtbag shyster tying to soak the raingirl for unneccessary work, that would in all likelyhood be done poorly. However, I have been wrong before.
I cannot find the exact reference I read a year or two ago, but I seem to remember that R410A was not a dominant refrigerant in the EU - yet. The few sources I could dig up in 5 minutes on Google mention ammonia, propane, carbon dioxide, among other things but there wasn't anything definitive and up-to-date to sink your teeth into.If I happen to find something better, I'll get back to you.