I’m living in New Orleans…trying to help folks rebuild their fully gutted homes. I know many home-owners finding the same problems…no honest trades-people. Very few contractors that have experience in FINE homebuilding. I would like to get people together to work on their projects, but most of the contractors that are available are half-steppers.
I can manage projects, but I am uncertain of some of the basic steps in a full home renovations.
Common questions I’m faced with.
Should you paint (one coat) before installing base boards and having floors tiled or refinished?
How do you build a door casing, instead of using a cheap door trim kit?
How many hours should painting a 1400 sq ft place (ceilings/walls) take?
The same house, how much should an exterior paint cost? Given that the wood doesn’t need to be sanded completely? Single story.
I know that these questions are broad…and I have no photos, but I need to start somewhere.
thank you.
Replies
New dawn
Welcome to BT.
You might have better luck posting this in the "Help Wanted" folder.
Are you looking to hire people for this work? or volunteers?
Your questions are way to vague to get any good response.
There are several people on here that have been to NO to work and I think a few of them had bad experiences, don't recall all the details.
I live south of Austin TX and I've known quite a few contractors that have gone over there to work, most complain about the whole situation and don't plan on going back.
I was in Houma in mid June on a fishing trip.
Drove through NOLA couple of times after talking to some locals, a lot of the rebuilding is stalled cause of h-o's not being there to rebuild or no money.
I helped a guy rescue a 50' wood sailboat out of the marina that was nestled inbetween 4 sets of pilings, & saw some slow rebuilding going on around there.
I know when my brother was trying to hire basic help for storm damage repairs, it was very difficult to get anybody willing to do manual tasks when they were getting $2,500 debit cards from the gov.
Should you paint (one coat) before installing base boards and having floors tiled or refinished?
Not strictly neccessary, but it makes your life much easier.
How do you build a door casing, instead of using a cheap door trim kit?
Need more info. Is it a simple casing of 2 legs and a head? The simplest situation goes so: If so, begin by using a combination square and a pencil to mark the edges of the jamb 1/8 in. back from the face. The inside of the casing will align with this mark. Hold the legs in place, and mark them to length. Use a miter saw to cut them at 45 degrees. If you've got an air nailer, use 1 1/2 in nails about every 16 in. to secure the casing legs to the jamb. If doing it by hand, use 4d finish nails. With the legs nailed to the jamb, miter one end of the casing head. Hold it upside down so that the mitered end rests on the point of one of the mitered legs. Mark the other side of the head to length, and miter it. Check the fit, and trim as need with miter saw, block plane (if the plane is dull, use 80 grit sandpaper on a hard rubber sanding block instead) or file. Nail the head to the jamb, and nail through the top of the head into the leg miters. Switche to 2 in. or 6d finish nails, and nail the outside of the legs to the wall. Don't nail the head to the wall as the seasonal expansion and contraction of the framing behind it will open the miters.
It can be a lot more complicated than that, but that method will trim a house.
I can't answer the painting questions, but Craftsman books and McGraw Hill both publish residential estimating books that you might find helpful. Try Amazon or http://www.builderbooks.com
Andy
"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig." Robert A. Heinlein
"Get off your dead #### and on your dying feet." Mom
thank you for your info. the only reason i took on helping others plan/manage is because so many contractors are faking it. i'm versed in only the most basic skills in renovations, unfortunately, but have much more experience than the home owners i work with. i haven't been in the business for years, but i have worked for some very educated and skilled contractors...which are difficult to find here. i try to help the people that i know pick someone with the most important part of contracting, honesty and an interest in returning them to their homes.so, i ask these questions because there aren't very many skilled people available here, and i don't like the trim/door kits and cheap 'flip it answers'. i also have to argue once in a while with the order of the remodel. i am always trying to get real answers to back up my instincts. this isn't to be a personal forum is it? i thought i could come here for very practical answers. please, regardless of your concerns as to what i'm trying to do...help me, because i care enough to ask. if you could understand how difficult it is to try and help in this town, as well as how much dishonest and scandalous wheeling and dealing is taking place, you could possibly appreciate that it is more helpful to have someone asking these questions...before the projects are ruined.
2nd friend just came back from the Gulf Coast. Although neither of them were in NO I think the problems are probably the same. 2 stand out to me.<!----><!----><!---->
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The first was housing. I don’t mind living out of a tent as long as it’s part of my vacation of hiking & climbing and during the cool seasons. With no hotel rooms available that narrows it down to people who have an RV they can live out of. <!----><!---->
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There’s a pretty good process of skimming going on. There’s a huge pile of govt money there. As it’s been told to me there’s a bunch of GCs hiring GCs to hire another GC to hire subs who hire out subs to pay someone average pay to do the jobs. (Lot’s of people taking a cut and not doing anything.) Not very enticing for the people you’re looking for. <!----><!---->
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I appreciate what your trying to do and don’t like raining on your parade, but the reality of it bites. Yes, there’s a lot of work in NO. But why should people leave their families and risk losing their market share in their home town for average pay (and average pay in the south is lower than average pay in the northern part of the country) and to live in a tent with an occasional shower?
John
"this isn't to be a personal forum is it? i thought i could come here for very practical answers."
This is a public forum. Everyone is free to post or say whatever they want.
So you're gonna get both some useful info and a lot of BS. The useful info is free, and you can skim over the BS.
I'm happily married, but my wife isn't.
The useful info is free, and you can skim over the BS.
Hold on thar, Bobalooee, I charge for the BS.Andy
"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig." Robert A. Heinlein
"Get off your dead #### and on your dying feet." Mom
What's the status of hotels & such in NO? The ones that have space, are they reasonably priced?
Pretty much every thing I saw that was open was full.
Even as far out as Houma.
I was staying at a house until my bro's exDW came back to town then had to stay in a hotel for a couple of days ( long story don't ask)
It was a good thing we knew someone or I would have been sleepin in the truck.
i appreciate that you are trying to help people rebuild in N.O., but how can you call other contractors 'half-steppers' when u don't even know how to trim a door, one of the most basic skills in homebuilding?
I was kinda wondering the same thing. Hope he's not one of those people that show up to roof a house with no hammer or bags. My understanding is that they need roofs on houses down there not managers telling em that they need roofs on houses.
This ISN'T meant to be a shot at the op but I've seen this same situation play out before , especially with volunteer work, where these self appointed managers show up to tell ya that the house with the roof blown off needs a new roof. AW shid , really?
In all honesty, I'm sure they mean well and they are just trying to help though.
Here's to hoping I'm wrong about this!
The reason I asked is that I've heard of this problem already but when people ask for help in the Gulf Coast area that was wrecked they politely fail to mention that you have to bring your own shelter or plan on living like a rat. I live in GA and have heard a fair amount of requests similar to this.
John
Pretty hard to answer those questions without some more specifics, but I guess just a generic W.A.G. is what you're after, so I'll give it a shot...
Should you paint (one coat) before installing base boards and having floors tiled or refinished?
My vote - prime base before install - paint walls before tile, install base before installing tile, use a spacer to hold it up for the tile.
How do you build a door casing, instead of using a cheap door trim kit?
Door casing? Usually buy 7' casing stock, 5 pieces per door. 45 degree cuts at the corners, install with the wide edge out, 3/16 inch reveal all around the jamb. Another detail is a band of 1x6 across the top, with a small crown molding along the top edge, and a half-round along the bottom edge. Then 1x4 sides, butted to the top, sometimes with a block at the bottom.
How many hours should painting a 1400 sq ft place (ceilings/walls) take?
Well, I'll take a stab at it - If its just painting, no prep work or priming involved, and if its just walls and ceilings, no baseboard, casing, doors, jambs, crown moldings, cabinets, etc, then maybe about 30-40 man/hrs.
The same house, how much should an exterior paint cost? Given that the wood doesn't need to be sanded completely? Single story.
OK, again, I'll take a W.A.G. to the question as it was asked - You mention that the wood doesn't need to be sanded completely, and I'm not sure exactly what that means, but... - I guess the labor and materials might be about 2700?
"...never charged nothing for his preaching, and it was worth it, too" - Mark Twain
Aren't you the guy that was going to charge 15-1600 dollars to run 3 or 400 feet of mdf baseboard a few months ago? I guess the painters time is not nearly as valuable as yours.
Oops. Guess I shoulda' guessed higher! Watcha figgure?"...never charged nothing for his preaching, and it was worth it, too" - Mark Twain
The problem is that the painting questions are much too vague. When you throw out numbers like $2700 to sand, prep, prime and paint a house including materials, it just leaves the wrong impression with people. You say you do high end work in other posts. Do you really believe you can get a high quality paint job for 2700? If you can do it, or know someone who can, Ive got no problem with you quoting prices like that. To be honest I live 2 hours from New Orleans and I could probably get it painted for around what you quoted but it would be a low quality job done by illegal immigrants that might last 3 or 4 years before it starts wearing badly. I would call that a blow and go. For about double that I could get a decent painter in to do a quality job. Even that doesnt really mean anything though because I really have no clue what condition the house is in. The amount of sanding could easily double that price. I know you said it was just a guess, but it just rubbed me the wrong way for a guy that charges $50 an hour or more to quote such a low price.
Didn't read anything about prep work. OP said something like "not complete sanding". So a light sanding of a painted surface, then paint. Same color. No prep, no primer, just paint. Oh, maybe I'd hose it off first.
If the OP wanted the price to prep, primer, and paint, I figure they woulda said so. Sounded to me like they were just after a quickie repaint price, and I figure I could give him one at that price, and still make my $50/hr. I thought I specified it was a W.A.G. You do know what that means, right? It means a Wild Arsed Guess on a house I've never seen, and know nothing about (except that its small, 1400 sq. ft., and one-story), and have no idea of the condition.
Sorry I didn't know my W.A.G. would ruffle your feathers. Just trying to throw a ballpark figure out there to help out the original poster, who seemed to be trying to get some bearings."...never charged nothing for his preaching, and it was worth it, too" - Mark Twain
Every paint job needs prep. No reason to sand unless its peeling so you are going to need some priming if you sand. Hose it down and paint? Yea thats gonna last. Thanks for clearing up what your idea of a paint job is.
with all the gang killing lately, I would move.
Along with Matt and Hucks posts that offer some good advice if you could, post some pictures, that can go along way towards describing your situation, especially things like the paint on the outside of a house.
Your original post was vague at best and you really couldnt get sound advice from that. Try again.
Doug
Doug
"Every paint job needs prep. No reason to sand unless its peeling so you are going to need some priming if you sand. Hose it down and paint? Yea thats gonna last. Thanks for clearing up what your idea of a paint job is."
Hey, I can only answer what they ask. My answer ONLY addressed the info given in the original post - and in fact, it was really intended just to throw something out there to get the dialogue going, so we could get some more info outta the O.P. Then we could start a meaninful discussion of existing paint condition, building materials, building configuration, trim details, colors, working conditions, access, etc. etc. All the stuff needed to start narrowing down a figure to something meaningful.
Just trying to get things rolling with an eyes-closed figure based on little to no information.
"...never charged nothing for his preaching, and it was worth it, too" - Mark Twain
Edited 8/2/2006 11:36 am by Huck
"I'm living in New Orleans...trying to help folks rebuild their fully gutted homes. I know many home-owners finding the same problems...no honest trades-people. Very few contractors that have experience in FINE homebuilding."
ROFLMAO They don�t have fine homes in NO. You sure go out of you way to bash contractors. Most if not all of the contractors you're dealing aren't local guys I take it. We have a lot of good local contractors here but most homeowners here aren't willing to pay what it cost for them to rebuild a home.
I'm from NO and now live in Destrehan (15 miles outside the city). I've been a state licensed and insured general contractor here for over twenty five years so I know what I'm talking about.
I find that most of the problems are caused by the homeowner hiring people like you who don't know a thing about construction. I see it all the time, I received 125K from my insurance and I want to put my house back together for say 50K, can you do the job?
So what they wind up doing is finding someone who doesn't know a thing about construction work because of what they are willing to pay. Most homeowners here don't have a clue as to what it takes or how much it cost to rebuild a house. And a lot of people here are greedy and want to pocket most of the insurance money they get.
"I would like to get people together to work on their projects, but most of the contractors that are available are half-steppers. I can manage projects, but I am uncertain of some of the basic steps in a full home renovations."
Are you a state licensed and insured general contractor or are you one of these half-steppers you're talking about? If not and you are acting like one (managing projects) then what you are doing is against the law in Louisiana.
"Common questions I'm faced with. Should you paint (one coat) before installing base boards and having floors tiled or refinished? How do you build a door casing, instead of using a cheap door trim kit? How many hours should painting a 1400 sq ft place (ceilings/walls) take? The same house, how much should an exterior paint cost? Given that the wood doesn't need to be sanded completely? Single story."
If you don't know the answer to these questions then you sure as hell shouldn't be managing any projects at all. It's guys like you who cost homeowners a lot of money by not being able to do the work the way it should be completed.
I had to move some walls, electrical and plumbing for a homeowner about three months ago. The homeowner didn't want to wait two weeks for my inspection before closing up his walls.
I didn't find this out until I met with the building inspector. I knocked on his door and when he opened it I told him that we were here to do the inspection.
The homeowner told us that we didn't need to do the inspection as he didn't want to wait and he already hired a friend that closed up the walls. This guy told the inspector that he didn't need and inspection because his friend (who is a wanta be carpenter/drywaller) told him so.
The building inspector asked if he could see the work and the homeowner told him sure, come see what a great job my friend did.
The building inspector told him that it sure did look good but he wanted the walls opened up to inspect the framing, electrical and plumbing.
The homeowner told the inspector that he wasn't going to open up the walls and for him to get lost. Big mistake on his part as the inspector put a cease and dismiss order on his door.
The inspector told the guy that the only work he wanted to see was drywall being removed from the walls. He also told the guy that he would be back to make sure that no more work is completed until he can inspect it.
So this guy and advice from his friend who don't know chit about construction cost him about 8K more in drywall work. Ya see, I don't feel real sorry when someone uses a wanta be contractor to save money and it comes back to haunt them.
"The same house, how much should an exterior paint cost? Given that the wood doesn't need to be sanded completely? Single story."
Without seeing the job I would say it should cost about $999,999.99 or something close to that.
busta
some of you guys are unbelievable..(maybe I am missing something) as far as I can see this person is simply stating that he knows NOT enough.. can we help him with some basic information. We do not really know the context of his questions. We dont know the personal situations. At least he does not sound like someone trying to pass off as an experienced contractor .. getting free info. By the sounds of it.. he may even be donating his time. .. in which case this is a great opportunity for profesional contractors to help out. Is there something wrong with not knowing how to case a door? in fact if he cannot, wouldn't it make sense to ask? All of the things the last person said about contracting in NO .. may be true, but why the presumption of and why the accusatory tone. Strange.. Arthurhttp://www.thesmallbuildingcompany.com
No this person is NOT simply stating that he knows NOT enough.Go back and read his post, he's stating that he would like to get people together to work on their projects. He also stating that he can manage projects, but he is uncertain of some of the basic steps in a full home renovations. In this state that is called being a general contractor and you need to be licensed and insured to do that here.I have no problem with helping this guy out if it's for work he's doing on his own home. I would even go as far as going to his house and showing him how to build door frames, paint or what to expect an estimate for painting would cost.However I have a problem with this guy if he's acting as an un-licensed, un-insured general contractor.I get tired of fixing the damage that in-experienced contractors do to peoples homes when they don't know a thing about construction.Sorry if my post sounds cold but that's the way I am, no BS comming from me.busta
judging by what you and ccal are saying..I think you must know more then I do about this guy then I can read from his post (s). I agree his post is general and vague and could be interpreted differently but how or why you arrive at such indignation is beyond me. In his post I see nowhere that he is even being paid by anyone. I also see nowhere that these people he is helping or hoping to get together to work on their houses are not broke homeowners themselves... maybe doing work on each others houses.. who knows? which would justify why his managerial help could be better then nothing. .. maybe the time questions he has are related to how much money they can ask for in assistance or insurance. I don't want us to get carried away guessing this stuff now and I am sorry I am saying so much already. ..forgive me Busta; I just felt surprised by the assumptions. Just like you I to have a strong dislike for anyone pretending to be a GC and charging money for it.. who does not know how to do any of the work he mentioned..Arthurhttp://www.thesmallbuildingcompany.com
I hope I interpreted his post wrong, and if I did I'll delete my post and be the first to tell him I'm sorry for it.He is right about finding honest trades-people here as they are few to be found. But I do find if you stick with contractors who are licensed and insured instead of the wanta be contractors you will get a better job. Don't think that people here are broke as every homeowner in NO who isn't insured or doesn't have enough insurance will get a big fat check for 150K paid for with your and my taxes. Let me tell you what a lot of people here are doing. I have a friend who has a home in Oak Harbor in Slidell that is worth about 900K. I did his drywall but couldn't get to his painting for about a month. I gave him a price of 32K to paint his house and told him it would take my men about five weeks to complete, he said no problem. I told him if he found someone else that could get to his job before me that to go ahead and use them. I also told him to expect to pay within 10% of my estimate to get the job completed right. Lots of crown molding, 8" wood trim, 10' ceilings, etc.While waiting for me he said that an out of state painter knocked on his door and offered to paint his house for 5K and he could start in the morning and be finished in about three days.I told him that I would not use this guy because one, he was way under price and two, no way could the guy complete his job in three days unless he cut corners. Well he didn't take my advice and used this guy and he did complete the job in three days. But what he failed to do was prep the job the way it should have been done. He sprayed primer on day one. He sprayed ceiling and wall paint on day two. And he sprayed trim paint on day three. What he failed to do was caulk, spackle, putty, sand wood, or wipe off dirt from the surfaces he painted and it showed up real bad when he was completed.My friend got that 5K paint job and it looks like a 5K paint job. Now he's bad mouthing painters because of the work this guy did when my friend is the one wrong for hiring this guy to start with.He paid this guy in full and now he can't get him back out to fix these problems as the guy went back to TexasI even told my friend if it was me I would check out this guys work before I would use him and that if this guy can start in the morning something is wrong as contractors here are months out with scheduling.Now to get back on topic at hand, this poster is complaining that contractors here are not honest trades-people and that all he can find are trash who don't know how to do construction. I'll be willing to bet that this poster is bottom fishing for contractors or hiring the first guy he can find and what he's finding is people who don't know what they're doing then complaining that we have no one here who knows how to do the work. Like I said, if I'm wrong I'll make it right with this poster, but I have a hunch I'm not.busta
Alright. that's it. i'm going to state my case and consider this a pointless forum for real advice.first. this poster does not just hire any smoe contractor. i keep going to the 'projects' of the contractors in a means to help a client find a good one to hire, but one after another i find the same. i don't do the hiring, they do. but they don't often see what i see...i used to work for a great contractor and he taught me a lot about detail.second. there are not enough gc's in this town to do all the work there is to do. there is an enormous need here. three. it's continually assumed that i have to be a half-stepping jack #### man, instead, i'm just a pretty compassionate female with a few years trades experience and that's at least more than my home-owning friends. i simply want to help and most of the time the 'work' i do i pay myself is so low most 'contractors' just laf at me. but i'm used to working for social programs and making little to no money...like group homes for severely emotionally disturbed children, community gardens, etc. not to make myself sound like a saint, but you don't know the first thing about the poster. four. i do have experience with the basics as i said, my home-owners DON'T and it's a dog eat dog out here. i haven't made that much progress, but neither have they, so we're under a learning curve. better together than alone. when i first got here i was continually recommended after some smuck would come in and rip them off. i know how to hang/finish/paint/install cabinets/appliances...basics. but i continually get recommended by other people whom i've helped wade through the non-sense here.so. finally, i'm just looking for some real answers to some scary questions for home owners. i'm not trying to be a contractor...i'm trying to help with planning...to help with excluding contractors before it does turn into a nightmare. who are you to judge. i try not to judge until i see the work. and like i said. much of it is half-stepping BS. so, unless this is just fun for you to tear people up. you all should really consider how it is that you represent yourself and how your assumptions prove so much. this site was recommended to me by two of the VERY BUSY carpenters i know, to try and help me with my endeavor. nearly every one of the people i've met, accept for the happy people i've helped, have laffed at me. but they told me it was because i was a woman. maybe it's just cuz i'm trying to help in a place where 'i couldn't possibly have any business'and by the way, the laws of louisiana aren't putting new sheetrock up. or painting. or putting on roofs. or helping homeowners ask the right questions from their contractors. i am helping them. i do look for insurance. i don't recommend people without licenses. and the laws certainly aren't growing more gc's or starting apprenticeship programs for people like me, so we can actually get any work done. i'm not being a gc. i'm just trying to help people know at least a little more than they did before they lost everything and had to make all these horrible decisions in the first place. most of them have day jobs and can't go look at the work of their contractors. they can't interview and be stood up by the plethora of contractors that just don't show. or they have already had the unfortunate experience of being lied to and ripped off. i wouldn't have clients if i wasn't recommended. i don't knock on doors...and i don't ask for work. not for a long time. i'm just pretty organized and have some basic resource skills. but. i don't even know why i took the time to write this. maybe cuz i deal with it every minute...what are you doing trying to help? leave that to the 'big boys' and watch the people around continue to suffer after their losses.
Hey new dawn - I thought you got some pretty good answers. No reason to get angry. Your original post left a lot of room for confusion or misunderstanding, but still, some of us struggled to find something to contribute. OK, one guy said my W.A.G. on the paint job was too low - heck it was just a W.A.G.! If you stick around, and narrow down the parameters of your questions to a more specified project, you'll get more useful answers."...never charged nothing for his preaching, and it was worth it, too" - Mark Twain
Here is my take...
Start another topic, and narrow the scope of your questions. You want to know about painting, fine, post a few questions about painting, and see what answers you get. You want to know about trimming doors - another topic thread. Here is the main thing though: keep to the topic; stay objective. Leave out the commentary about different types of people, etc. Keep it nuts and bolts. Use titles for your threads that relate directly to your home (re)building Qs. You will get the info you need.
I thought we had a BT Board meeting last year and decided that if you build below sea level, on a river delta and it flooded out, that it was a waste of time and materials to rebuild. That it was in the best interest of all to move to higher ground and heed natures natural selection of weeding out the stupid?
New Orleans.....The New Atlantis...
Was that the same BT board meeting where "we" all decided no more building in San Francisco cuz it's built right above the San Andreas fault?DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
or on the CA hillsides...Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!<!----><!---->
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
Or the whole state of FL for that matter!DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
and the toenado corridor...Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!<!----><!---->
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
I think you're right and I live in FL. Taxpayers elsewhere should not foot the burden of rebuilding disaster prone areas.
I certainly think it's stupid to build below sea level with money transfered from my paycheck. I'll take my own chances here. My insurance is not federally subsidized. I live at least 20 feet above mean high tide :)
just so you know most of these law abiding GC are still hiring undocumented workers whom have very little to no experience doing the hired things that they are supposed to be doing. not that experience is everything, cuz what they often lack in that they make up for in work ethic. but my point is...laws are snubbed when it's in the favor of making money for a GC.but that wasn't the point of my post.
I think I understand your point. You have your opinions and you live your life IAW your framework of personal accountability for decisions you make - like WHERE to live.
Good for you!
As to subsidizing others...well we all do that to some extent or another, voluntarily or not. My own e.g. of doing so is that everywhere I live and taxes I pay subsidize schools, is a "I get nothing (directly) from" since I don't have kids in those same schools. But I choose to view this use of my tax paid dollars as a contribution towards the greater societal good.DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
I disagree with the school analogy. It's not predictable that the school is going to be destroyed in a natural disaster. Yes, there are some things that need support from the entire population e.g. defense, public education, highways, etc.. Beach renourishment, flood zone rebuilding, building houses below sea level are not among them.
ok. let's agree to disagree. :-)DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
I would guess that most port cities are below sea level.Some cities are built near fault lines, along hills that get heavy rain, and others built where tornados might pass thru.Some states have trees that burn, and build cities and towns near them.Whole parts of the country get filled up with snow and freeze.
No, most port and/or coastal cities are not below sea level. Of course they are close but not below unless they have levees ala NO.
Yeah, some cities are built along fault lines. They have taken strict building code provisions to limit damage. People living there can buy insurance to help rebuild if necessary, but it shouldn't be subsidized.
Snow melts and goes away. People living in ND don't ask for Federal sit on my A** debit cards all winter. They count on being stuck in the house for days and they provide for themselves.
Everything has a risk/benefit ratio. You want to live somewhere, fine...but don't ask people elsewhere to back up your decision when it turns bad.
Can we insert a "[POL]" onto this thread's title now?DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
will run dozer to clean up condo row. no pay needed
Really sorry to hear bout the hot check. (although, I had to read your post twice cuz it wasn' t to me and at first, I read it too fast and thought you wrote "hot chick"!!! LOL!)
Dear friends of mine had house whacked due to proximity to 17th street canal...and other gal friend (old college classmate from UNO) still trying to get her house in Old Metairie squared away. The situation you encountered is SADLY, happening a lot - and, in "both directions" as it were.
Just got off phone after taking a call tonite from my buddy Don down there. Told him I'd plan a drive down soon after I get back from my impending trip to WI; and lend a hand for one of my upcoming "long weekends" off work that's coming up. Will be good to get there and see some things first hand as last time I was there was July 2005.
Who knows? maybe it'll also be an opportunity to have an "axe murderer meeting IRL" with Busta and/or ND.
DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Well I think you know the research I did over the thing .
Ive kept in contact with a couple of people I met working on it .
What you just said is very true .
Story is that its so bad
It was a big job finding a place that was safe for the guys to go and where they would have some living conditions.
Its still not safe , still unsanitary , and there is really no living conditions . Still.
The people there dont have any money and they are trying to get people to work for them .
Lots of workers down there been just as bad .
Tim
You did an awesome thing Tim - I still salute you most sincerely for all your efforts. That you still stay in touch with people there speaks volumes as it can truly be "draining" even to be at a distance but hearing perpetually all that's still going on - and NOT going on.
When I find myself listening and growing SO distressed and feeling overwhelmed with the info, I just kick myself upside the head and go "what must it be like to BE there and HAVE TO deal with this day in/out?" and go on to the next thing I can find to pragmatically do, to help. And sometimes, that's just listening and commisserating as people's mental and emotional health is razor thin for oh-so-many down there.
True story: my friend QP house in Lakeside...got flooded back by nearby canal breech. Things were progressing S-L-O-W-L-Y wiht the insurance adjuster etc. One day when they expected him, he never showed. They called, and called and called. Then called and called his co. and finally got somebody to call them back. The adjuster had committed suicide; had gotten overswhelmed by dealing with it all... Now here it is a year later and she STILL hasn't gotten a check from her ins. co!!!!! (I forget which co. it is, but doubt is the only one being slow to pay...)
DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
I didnt do anything . I never went down there .
Your story is what is supposed to be happening over and over .
So there the people are with no fixed home and they want to live there . They cant get any money to fix the house and now they are broke . You dont have choices when you are broke . Its close to being in jail.
If you have been reading the AR news , they are trying to get those damn trailers moved out of Hope Ar. What was it , 10,000 mobile homes still parked at the Hope airport never sent to Rita or Katrina? You have a better memory than I do. I do know there is another location for the trailers too but I fergit. <G>
You remember that song Johny Cash sung and said , 4 ft high and risin mama.
Well to the discussion yall were havin to me wasnt the point. The point was to me is that the flood plain has raised its bar . When I was BI I was also the flood plain manager . I even got to go to training in the rock . I still cant believe the city paid me to do all that training . Anyway , for the next 100 years the flood plain will be where ever it flooded and the level is bench marked . In a 100 years it wont matter.
It doesnt make any difference what the goverment does to the levy. The flood plain will never come down now that it has raised its bar .
The result is that people cannot afford flood insurance and cannot build a house above the flood plain [where it is at now ] just from the cost.
I dont know if that is any different than Florida beaches that keep getting wiped away with hurricanes . Larry the Cable Guy makes money talking about those stupid folks that just keep building back after being washed away.
They interview this guy on TV and he says we`re gonna build back . This is the third time but we want to stay. beep beep beep beep beep there backin it in now !
Tim
My cousin built a house near Pass Christian, Miss. Just to be safe they built it out of concrete and steel (he's in the commercial construction biz), with the first floor 17 feet above sea level. After Katrina rolled through they saw some aerial photos and the house looked O.K. When they finally got to it they found out they had 10 feet of water in their house. They are inland and water came up 27 feet! Wow. Not much you can do about that.
Billy
"You dont have choices when you are broke . Its close to being in jail."I just added that to my quotes file.=0)
Yadda yadda yadda
Touche' mizshredder!
Correction...the majority of the city is just on the edge of, not right above the fault.
I stand corrected and
lotsa San Fran "stands close"...
<g>DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
"...decided that if you build below sea level, on a river delta and it flooded out, that it was a waste of time and materials to rebuild."And sea levels predicted to rise twenty feet in one hundred years...Does that mean five feet in twenty five years?????Rich BeckmanAnother day, another tool.
Hello New Dawn. Let me introduce myself. I'm not a "tradesperson"...I'm a degreed engineer (UNO Alum, class of '90), and I'm a female who's been getting excellent advice and support from this forum for a couple of years now. Please know that I recognize the position you're in and the caring heart you clearly have. It's in your nature to be giving and to try and help. That's clear to see.
What's seemingly happened in this thread is that you made a couple of typical "newbie" errors. That happens simply because HOW'S a NEWBIE POSTER to know?
Specifically, you've gotten some VERY practical advice on how to use this Forum to get specific and most helpful advice and info, in the posts above this one by me:
I'm talking about: Huck in Post 27 & Matt in post 28
Please dear lady - do not let this thread be your only and final experience with this Forum. Your friends who steered you here in the first place, did so for a reason - and a very solid GOOD reason.
Please: DO take the advice Huck and Matt gave you and let this community of posters lend their time, info, experience, and advice to help you in your endeavors.
BTW - with Bustaduke being a GC in Destrehan - and sounding like a caring and honest guy who's encountered his own valid reasons to be frustrated with the way things are going down there - I'd recommend you 2 have an In Real Life (IRL) meeting - maybe a cuppa CDM at Morning Call in Metry?... I suspect he'd be an EXCELLENT new friend for you to make.
What do you say BUSTADUKE? Would you be willing to meet up with New Dawn and help guide her thru some situations (i.e. talk to her about specific things she's seeing and how she can help) and mentor her posting here on BT?
All the best to ya NewDawn...hope to see more from you here.
Clara
DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Clara--Thanks for the excellent post to New Dawn. I hope she hasn't given up on us to the point where she doesn't read it. We really need to rein in our egos and try to help new posters instead of finding a reason to attack them. Especially someone like ND who is really doing her best to help in NO. A face top face meeting with her, like you suggest, would really help her. It would be nice if we could provide volunteers to answer questions like hers, but I suppose, when it is working as it should, that is partly what this forum does.
Edited 8/1/2006 7:10 pm ET by Danno
I wish her friends who steered her here in the first place, would spend a little time with her in learning to navigate this Forum (the pragmatic navigation that is) and also advising here of the unwritten rules of "etiquette" here...NOT TO MENTION the acronyms!!!!!!!!! <g>DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
thank you. i will take your advice. when i figure out what/how to ask the questions i need to...i will be more specific. i mostly ended up here at an 'out of steam' moment of manic stress and panic. i've had a figure as high as 10,000 to paint that house...and then low as 2500. i figure the right answer is somewhere in the middle. but what it really comes down to, i'm struggling to find any advice or words to trust. i will be more specific and downright direct in the future. but more than anything, i really appreciate your response. at times i just wonder what i'm doing in the trades, but i just love to build. it's the most satisifying thing i've done in all of my carreer. to walk up to my house and know that i did all the maintence, minus carpentry, on my own...sinks, windows, walls.i try to give my clients those types of elated highs, but lately it's just been so rotted with crook-filtering and inflated bid boasting, that i seem to have lost my thrill in it, i'm not a specialist and all the specialists are so damn busy there is almost no one to teach us. i'm doing much less with my hands and way more on the phone, just so that SOMEthing gets done. anyway, i hope NOLA puts it back together. i would really like to see a trades apprenticeship program down here. because if there is anything we need from these licensed GCs, it's to teach us how to be better at what we want to do. anyway, just thank you.
NewDawn -
Please DO try again with your posts here on Breaktime.
Please note there are different "topic" folders to post your questions in "General discussion" vice "business" etc. Take some time to go and read some of the threads in each of the folders so you'll get a feel for what gets posted where... Then follow suit.
For your new posts, try and pick a thread title that is specific to the situation you are asking about - and make it succinct as you have limited space for a thread's title.
In your post, play "joe friday" and state the facts of the situation. the layout, any dimensions involved, materials involved and try to keep your queries limited to specific items. Sometimes this MAY mean you start more than a few threads in order to address different aspects of the same overall task...(to catch the plumbing aspect, versus the framing aspect, versus the electrical aspect, for e.g.)
DO remember the famous Italian saying: "Don't Sh*t in yer own kitchen". I know that it is extremely frustrating in N'Awlins these days...but when you come here to Breaktime, please post here to this group of professionals and DIYers with the mental paradigm that you are asking a bunch of construction professionals who are honest and good, how to deal with their peers where you are. To be specific, try NOT to ever "paint with a broad brush" that all contractors are scum or thieves or any such thing...when you're coming here to ask professionals in the trades, for help. OK?
Hang in there. My dear friends I went to UNO with and others worked with while I spent 8 years in NO, keep me abreast of things there this past 12-13 months and I note that each of them goes thru cycles of despair, hope, anger, frustration, that seems never ending right now as the local and fed govt programs are not functioning effectively nor efficiently and the social ills that plagued N'Awlins before Katrina, remain but have simply morphed into (somewhat) new versions, afterwards.
I salute you for wanting to stay, and to help. DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Women who love to build seem to be pretty rare. I hope you'll hang around. This really is a great place to learn.Check out the following thread. In this thread, a lot of the folks talk about how valuable BT has been to them over the years. (Me included)It's in the tavern, so I hope you have access.
http://forums.taunton.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=tp-breaktime&msg=76720.1
Hate can't end hate. Only love can do that. [MLK]
Hi mizshredder2 and a great post however, after reading post 46 by this person no way would I be willing to help her out.She sure goes out of her way making accusations about our local contractors, not a great way to get the help she needs.busta
I didn't see it that she went out of her way to make accusations about local contractors, only that she spoke the truth (as she saw it) when she said that many are dishonest. I'm not familiar with NO, but I wouldn't doubt that she is right.
Of coarse you could look at this as an opportunity to show her that there ARE honest respectable contractors in N.O.Tom
Douglasville, GA
I can understand your sentiment...truly I can.
And, I felt all your prior posts here were fair and to the point.
And yet I would still ask you to find that corner of your heart that's still charitable and giving, and with regards New Dawn, stand neutral (at least) in judgements til she's learned the ropes here a little bit...and until/unless you've had a chance to meet her and find out what life is really dishing out her way these days. (the old: "walk a mile in my shoes")
It was scary as all get out for me, a "DIY HO PITA" to go to my first BT Fest, but having the chance to meet some people face-to-face has helped SOooo much, in being able to relate while posting here on this electronic medium. In the absence of that, and with the challenges that the written word presence (lack of TONE, lack of non-verbal cues, etc), I admit I am strongly advocating for an added extension of patience, and compassion, and "the benefit of the doubt".DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
New Dawn,
I grew up in New Orleans and I know what you're dealing with down there. I've worked in the flooded homes and been through the devastated neighborhoods. There are lots of folks with no idea where to look for trustworthy advice and no easy way to filter through the different advice that they receive.
Thank you for helping. There are licensed GCs doing poor work there, as well as fly-by-nighters. There are also good GCs and others doing good work. At least you're trying to do the right thing. Follow mizhredder's advice and try again with new posts and more focused questions. There are lots good folks here willing to help with good advice.
Billy
i'm just looking for some real answers to some scary questions for home owners. i'm not trying to be a contractor...i'm trying to help with planning...to help with excluding contractors
Well, that's the nub of it in reverse.
The "audience" here, typically, is filled with persons who have taken, and continue to take the considerable trouble to be licensed contractors.
Please, stop, take a second, and lets both re-read that: "licensed contractors." That is a very specific, legally-defined, "thing" to be. Which, sadly varies from state to state, and locality to locality. But, does not reduce the importance of the "legally defined" part.
You want to help, that's perfectly understandable. There's great need, that's patently obvious. Unfortunately, the way you have written your request can be (and looks to have been) read as: "Look, I'm not a pro; but can you tell me the 2 or 3 things you hafta know to be a pro, so's I'kin better spot the crooks (among'ya)?"
Can you see why that might not have gone over real well?
You are asking an important, and needful question. The sad part is that the question, and its answers are very complicated.
There are a number of legally licensed contractors in Lousiana. A majority of them will be good (not crooks). However, there being more work, or more manhours, than is available, that creates a scarcity of "good guys" with availble manhours. That tends to drive prices up--the inverse of what is desired.
Complicating things is the rather sad fact that "practice law," the enforcing of such things as licensing is probably the least prosecuted crime after barratry. That tends to permit people to "act" like a responsible party. It also allows the unscrupulous to "call" themselves whatever they want to. It also means the unscrupulous can conduct bad business as a regular habit, too. Note how all of those things permit some bad people to do bad work for quite some time, to the deteriment of those who don't.
The folks here at BT are a varied bunch--but, it's not likely to be a place where there area lot of low-life shady characters hang out. In fact, you might have to poll every member here to find just one who had not been victimized by a bad 'contractor' in one way or another at least once. That's likely why so many hackles were raised when you asked.
Now, I think, just maybe, the question you really want asked is "What sorts of work can be done by skilled workers who are not licensed contractors, that would help alleviate the enormous amount of work to be done?" With the caveat of safe, efficient, economical, work being included as well.
Is that closer to where you wanted to go?Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
bustaduke
Is correct.
Other than that Im torn on the thread . I wouldnt mind helping but its like helping to commit murder.
Sides that its against the da&& law .
I could go get the code but what the heck.
You must be a lisensed contractor in the state of La or have a state liscense with a ricip state they recconize and accept to perform contract work in the state . This guy either needs a GC lisense where he can legally be held liable . I dont believe a GC has him hired as a project manager so we will need his full name and address . Mebbe that way we can keep him out of bigger trouble .
We arent helping a freebie deal here .
Tim
I hope I'm wrong but until I see something to show me different I'll stand by my post.What I see is someone who is looking to act like a general contractor and without the proper license and insurance, that's a big no no in this state.Now if this guy is working on his own house asking these questions I'll be more than glad to help him out but if he's acting as a general contractor then he is so out of luck.busta
I've gone thru all the posts so far, and I think your analysis is correct and have nothing to apologize for. You gave the sermon from the high church of the painful truth.
I spent appx 7 months on the gulf coast (9/6/05 to 3/29/06)and traveled (several times it seems) between Pascagoula, MS and Houston TX. Many areas remain in a state of devastation due to the lack of any real leadership!! Political or otherwise.
I've dealt with all types of contractors that were there 'to help' and many of the ones that I spoke to in the New Orleans area stated that the happiest day of there 'existence' in NOLA was the day they left.
Their complaints ranged from the routine of "nobody wants to work" to "goverment red tape" messing the whole thing up.
From what I was able to observe (too much), the NOLA area is divided into the haves and the have nots. Notwithstanding the 'burbs that were devastated in St. Bernard's Parrish, the eastern end of town, starting just blocks from the French Quarter was inhabited by many folks who had long ago given up and were dependant on the goverment for there well being. Having said that, there were/are pockets of folks that are doing all within their power to move on with their lives and repair/rebuild their homes and buisnesses. There are many, many more that are waiting on the politicos to fix the problem. Unfortunately for them, the fix will be a long time in coming!!!!
I apologize for not being able to really respond to your questions............as others have statede their is a lot of missing information in your original posting. I wish you all the best in your endeavors!!!!
Best Regards
me and my partner went to New Orleans. Came back with a 2000 dollar hot check from there. Won't go back Evidently honest people are a premium down there. Good luck with it.
Take a look at this BT message thread:
http://forums.taunton.com/tp-breaktime/messages?msg=64062.1
It will interest you.