Good Morning All –
We have a small argument going and I can’t find a current NYS plumbing code book handy. All I have is my book for VA, not NYS.
One guy that’s working with me says that it’s legal to use the fresh air vent on top of a house trap for a three inch line then take off a t and run to the roof for air, but pick up a second two inch line for 2 showers.
I say no, first it’s a wet vent, second, that’s not what the fresh air is for on the house trap.
Anybody care to settle the debate? Got a code citation?
Thanks –
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations – New Construction – Rentals
Replies
Don,
What's a house trap?
Is that like a P trap after the Waste line leaves the house but before it enters the sewer?
Is a fresh air vent on top of a house trap different than a DWV cent?
Ya no a wet vent is just a section of pipe that sometimes has liquid flowing and some times is part of a vent for a different drain source.without knowing what it is your calling "fresh air vent on top of a house trap" Non of what the other guys is saying makes sense.
Pro'lly 'cuz I'm senseless
hehehehehehehehehe
hehehe
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Hi Sam -
A house trap is the main trap for the entire house, usually at an exterior wall, the last thing between the the house waste and the septic/cesspool/sewer. Here on residential they are typically 4" cast iron, about 30-36" long, with an inlet and an outlet on each side of the "trap" for horizontal pipe, and two brass cleanouts on the top of the thing. But also on the top is another uncovered opening for a 4" pipe to run vertically. Usually, it goes up a couple feet, takes a horizontal turn and vents right through the wall. That's the fresh air vent.
As far as wet vents, my understanding is that NY (or this part of it) does not allow wet venting. I can't debate that they work in many other areas. Just the rule is here, don't use them.
I've got an older guy working here for a couple weeks who tells me he knows plumbing (not licensed) and he says it's okay. I don't think it passes code. I guess I could call the local inspector's office, but they're never in and when you do get them, about as cooperative as a bunch of pizzed off rattlesnakes.
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations - New Construction - Rentals
Around here (Buffalo), the trap you speak of is outside, with a verticle vent with a mushroom cap. I've never seen one in the basement.Bear
I've occasionally seen them outside too, in pits. That's usually on commercial stuff.
Residential work, with a cellar - they're inside. I guess the logic is that they are less likely to freeze inside? Or maybe it's just more comfortable to work inside standing up instead of outside kneeling down...? Or maybe they're easier to find? Ah, who cares...? <G>
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations - New Construction - Rentals
I think that the only way that you are going to answer your question is to get a code book or find a inspector that will talk to you. The problem with codes is that even if you use the same code as I do the local board modifies them. Where I live most counties banned whole house traps many years ago. Sorry I can't help.
Shacko - I'm curious. If they banned house traps, what do they use to prevent sewer gas from backing into the house?
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations - New Construction - Rentals
Don,
That's a new one on me. 'Course, I'm from the West Coast.
"what do they use to prevent sewer gas from backing into the house?"
Fixture traps. 'P' Traps. Used to use 'S' traps, but they got banned in favor of 'P's. Fixture traps make a lot more sense from the publics view, because they can be cleaned and unstopped any person handy with their hands.
A vent to air must attach to the waste line within a short distance upstream of each trap. As I understand it, the only places typically using a wet vent are the main stack and the washing machine.
"One guy that's working with me says that it's legal to use the fresh air vent on top of a house trap for a three inch line then take off a T and run to the roof for air, but pick up a second two inch line for 2 showers. "
I don't know code in your area, but that would work. The purpose of the vent is to break suction so the trap doesn't siphon dry. If the showers are running the trap will be full. If they're not running the vent will be to air. He will still have to vent the showers.
I see that this post doesn't offer much help with your small argument.
SamT
her even washing machines now are required to have a vent after the trap and before the Y into the waste... the only "wet" trap i know of is for an island sink then you are permitted to use a 3" drain line with out a vent... the thinking is that a kitchen/bar sink could never fill the 3" line and it'd be "self venting" they use to let us use a "volume of air" for islands but that was a few years ago
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Sam - Just for the record, we need individual traps on every fixture too.
As far as will his way work - I agree that it will. I just don't agree with him that it's legal or the right way to handle it.
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations - New Construction - Rentals
Don,
Hmmmn. . . . .
I know. Tell your plummer, that I said, "It's illeagle in my teepee."
SamT
SamT,
Not just a west coast thing. Here in central VA we do not use whole house traps either. A cleanout (typically a T-Y) is required outside of the house.Frank DuVal You can never make something foolproof because fools are so ingenious.
Other posts have answered the question, all fixtures must have their own trap.
I've been on the plumbing forum and these guys really know their stuff and many are from back east
check out...http://www.plbg.com/ and then click on ENTER to get your question answered
Woodway - I appreciate the direction. I'll likely check in on them later.
Don K.