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I bought my 87 Toyota because I wanted a truck with good mileage. I’m only getting nineteen to a gallon and it’s burning oil, I’ve decided I deserve a real truck. Anybody out there getting decent mileage out of a 60 vintage Ford or Chevy? I’m wondering if a six cylinder might be the answer.
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A six cyl is the answer if your runnin empty with no weight.If you're haulin tools and lumber I reccomend a V8.The newer rigs 1997+ are pretty efficient.I get 17-18 mph with the GM 350 ci Vortech engine.Fully loaded it never slows down climbin hills on cruise.
*Man there have been so many discussions on what to drive that if they were printed it would be a Very Thick Book. Not to be snotty, but spend some time reading the archives on this.One thing that hasn't been discussed is buying an old truck for your business. I think you need to decide what you are. Are you an old truck collector and hobbiest, or are you running a business? Answer that and you'll have your answer to the old truck question. As for me, always buy the truck that will do the job and that has the cheapest total cost over its' lifetime.
*Benjamin,Don't discount the older trucks, they're out there in good shape. Keeping in mind you'll have to have a decent amount of mechanical knowlege to repair or bring to dependable status, they're a lot less hassle to work on and maintain.Pro-Dek...I'll put a six on the dyno against any newer small block for torque, and get just about as good a mileage number to boot. Here's mine, runs loaded most of the time (tools and job) at 18/20 mpg, and has plenty of power for the hills.
*My 85 toyota PU get 24.5 mpg city, loaded. All day everyday. couple months ago it drop to 21 and smoke but by changing the valve guide seals it went back up. It has 213,847 has of today.
*Nice truck, Chris! That 300 six is one of the best truck motors ever made. Lots of low end torque .....the newer 4.2 can't measure up to it.
*I ave got an 83 F150 and a 94 F150 both w/ the 300/I6 . They both get the same gas mileage 15/18, but the 83 can carry a load better. The only difference is the 83 has a 3.55 miff. and the 94 has a 3.05. Oh, and the 94 is fuel injected. Dave
*I've got a 97 Chevy with a 4.3 and I average 13 mpg with mixed driving (mostly city) and I'd recommend a V8. I know guys with v8's getting better mileage because the engine doesn't have to work as hard.My 2 cents,John
*You guys are getting awsome mileage...'Specially Chris, (is that 4wheel drive?) I've got the same 6Cyl in a 92 F150...15mpg unloaded with a tailwind.
*Chris:Are you in business? If so why doesn't your truck have a logo/sign on it? You'r missing out on some good advertising. Now ProDeck's is a bit too classy for me. I like In Your Face advertising because people are too distracted to pay attention unless the sign really steps out at them. But at least there is a sign.
*'64 GMC 1T 4x4 with dump bed (6900# empty), rebuilt, 10.2 MPG, town or road. '71 Datsun @ 270K mi on motor gets 32 to 38 MPG, mixed town/road, lots of hill, coast w/eng off down the hills (no power anything).
*Robert,Years of racing has given me a little advantage (knowlege) in making power, simply put, better mileage...when I replaced the head, a little porting goes a long way (mach ported to gasket, nothing fancy), a cold air kit nets about 5hp and a couple of mpg, combined with a K&N filter and good clean exhaust system (no plugged cats, etc.) 3.08s in the pumpkins are a help, and if anything lower is needed, four low is there. In my opinion mileage is everywhere, just look for it, example..2 oil changes and 6 bucks in spark plugs a month is cheap when figuring the mileage? 5 bucks for a colder thermostat is good for about 3 to 4hp and better mileage, the list goes on and on. Simple stuff. Fred, No signs...I work for someone else. You're right on with Decks truck being nice, I just can't justify a huge truck payment every month when mine gets me to the same jobsite, and does the same job.
*Chris Robb-Nice ride! I like the side tool boxes.I know that the bore and stroke on a 6cyl produces more torque than an eight, I sold diesel engines before I decided to where a tool belt for a living, but I find it hard to believe you are getting that kind of mileage with a gas six in a 1/2 ton rig.I've owned several gas sixes and never came close to the mileage you're getting.I brag on GM Vortech because my last 1978 350 Chev got 8MPG on a good day.I can also attribute the mileage increase of 17-19 to the overdrive transmission.As far as old trucks go, I would give anything to have a 1956 chevy with todays drive train.
*FredB-I hate signs and had a hard time putting them on my truck,especially when I'm usually going to fast for people to read them anyway.Is this "in your face" enough? I thought this might be easier to read than a phone number.
*This was my old workhorse truck. 1978 Chev "big10" 350 cu.in new paint,upholstery,eng,trans,ball joints,tie rods,shocks,and I loved everything about it except the mileage.I had it for 17 years.Bought it 2 years old for $4200.put about $10,000. into it and sold it for $5000. Like Chris says"there are some good used trucks out there.
*Oops-try this
*My 87 Ford F-150 (300 six, 3.55 rear, 4 speed granny gear) got 14-16 mpg ...didn't matter if is loaded or not ........ the 3.08s do make a difference. My 91 with 302 V-8, 3.08's, and 5 speed od, got 15 around town and 21 on the highway but you couldn't tow a wet roll of toilet paper with it. Wish I had hung on to the 87.
*Chris, I'm a mechanical ignoramus. Can you explain how a colder thermostat can improve mileage and improve hp? Ron (running a GMC Sonoma at 25mpg - and that's a US gallon)
*Hi Chris,I've got a 96 F250 4wd with the 460 V8. It gets 12.5 mpg city or highway. Any ideas on how to gain some mpg? Don't want to take off heads. Got the K&N air filter. Thinking about headers ($360), maybe Flowmaster mufflers. Do you know much about computer control modules? I know my truck, being about as aerodynamic as my house, with a 460 will never get very good mileage but even 2 more mpg would probably save me $500 a year.thanks, jiml
*Ron,A cooler, not cold running engine will make more power by changing the density of the fuel/air charge, a denser charge means more power, more power means better efficiency (not directly, but follow me here), which means you stick your foot in the throttle less. That's the fast explanation, obviously some slight differences with the computer controlled cars are to be had, but with a carbed engine, it works. For every ten degree drop in air intake temprature, you gain approx. 1hp. Example: If air is being drawn from under the hood at lets say for arguments sake 200 degrees..the temp outside the hood (ambient) is 100 degrees.. thats a "possible" gain of 10hp (it's on a sliding scale), drop the underhood temp. (via thermostat)it gets better, block expansion is not as dramatic thus closing tolerances in piston to block, piston ring end gap, cooler running manifold temps, and adding the air cleaner does two things, it lets the engine draw air faster, AND since the air is moving faster it does'nt have as much time to pre-heat, making it more dense. Ultimately if the engine block runs cooler than the cyl. head(s), you get all of the above plus better burn (ignition) in the chamber (cyl head) resulting in better overall numbers. Engineers tried to do that very thing with the "reverse flow cooling" on the small block in the early nineties, and it worked well.Jim, think of ANY engine as an "air pump", the more efficiently it will pump air...the more power and better mileage you will get...period. Move more air via, condensing the air (cold air kit to supercharger), and letting the motor exhaust the air (freeflow cats, headers, flowmasters, etc.), and if you get the headers, get them JetHot coated. It reduces heat saturation to the pipes, keeps the exhaust hot (moving faster) and keeps the cats clean for better flow. Mileage will follow.
*Pro-Dek:Now That Is a Sign! Looks Great!Assuming you want business off the street, the only thing I would do with it is put something in the middle so people know how to contact you. Maybe your city, or county or something.
*FredB- If people want to contact me all they have to do is go to Pro-Dek.com there they will find my address,phone number,city,pictures,and a little about my company.This way they can qualify me before I set foot on their doorstep.You may check out my site by clicking on my name(Pro-Dek)then click on (view home page)or (favorite url).
*Pro-Dek,I checked out your website and those are some sharp decks! I like the roofs also, I need to build one this year to get out of the direct sun (picture Phoenix in July!) Hav'nt quite decided on a design yet though. Choice work.
*DUH! Guess the no-line glasses weren't as good as I thought. Anyway I see, now that I see. And if someone can't afford a computer to contact you they sure can't afford any of the beautiful decks I saw on your site.
*Thanks, Fred-Chris,got off track on this thread though,Sorry Benjamen,Chris- Question? I bought one of those $100 K&N filters but lost the cleaning instructions.Do ya just put them in soapy water and let them dry in the sun or what?
*Wherever you purchased the filter will have cleaner and oil. DON'T let it sit in the sun, it's cotton like, and will shrink as such. Kinda like your wallet will if it's ruined and you have to buy a new one. No compressed air, it separates the fibers of the filter
*Chris, Thanks for the explanation. The denser engine intake air improvement makes perfect sense to me, now. Though mileage always drops in the winter, that's probably due to longer warm-up time, wouldn't you say?I don't see the connection between the lower intake air temperature and lower block temperature, though. The air intake is just behind the grill, hardly in the engine compartment at all, and the air doesn't hang around long enough to get warmed up anyway. My 4.3l engine pumps over 3000 litres of air per minute at cruising speed. Something else that just occurred to me is that a thermostat that directs more coolant through the rad is going to increase the underhood temp at the same time as it decreases the block temp.Ron
*Keep in mind I said "carburated" engines, and also said that "slight differences are to be had with computer controlled engines". Air density metered vehicles and F.I. vehicles are a little different having that the computer has to be fed some information and in some casses re-programmed to do what you need, the only thing that is the same is the core of the engine, and little else. A different approach must be used, but the same results can be achieved.
*Here's something that EVERYONE can take advantage of, and save a few bucks at the same time. I don't know how to link this (never done it) but here goes.http://performanceunlimited.com/illustrations/sparkplugs.html
*Chris: I've read (but not had the time to try) that splitting the ends of a std plug with diagonal cutters, filing, then indexing the plugs on installation works best. What's your opinion or experience.
*chris.. thanks for the spark tips...here's mine... a '91 5.0 L. v8got 12.5 mpg on the first engine and gets 12.5 mpg on the second engine... i think that sucks.. and it's a national disgrace... am i wrong .. or shouldn't we be getting about 25 mpg with the available technology and the progress since 1980 ... in other words..if congress had held the car mfr's feet to the fire and included SUV's and light ttrucks in the same mileage requirements as the rest of their fleets.. wouldn't we already be there?
*Art,Indexing works great IF you know where the best "quench" area or swirl pattern for you vortech guys is. My race motor always has indexed plugs but takes usually about three sets OR washers to do it, very time consuming but well worth an extra 10th at the drag strip. Cutting (splitting) a plug has'nt shown in our case to make a difference worthy of the time or hassle, worse yet getting a "finger" of the electrode hot enough to burn off (nitrous motor) and damage the engine is'nt worth anything. "cutting" the electrode back as in the picture, and regapping has a much bigger effect as far as power and burn quality (the burn pattern can be seen when the heads are off (not that you'll be doing that every week) but an improvement can be seen. Another big improvement is in ignition boxes such as the MSD6, and Jacobs Electronics box, they convert a normal inductive ignition (normal coil ignition) to capacitive discharge, which gives a longer burn time (about 3 to 5 degrees as I remember) AND lets the coil achieve full saturation. A normal coil WILL NOT put out 120,000 volts as some companys would like you to believe (Accel was a company that sold "Super Coils")bullsh*t, they only produce enough power to jump the gap of the plug, release their energy, and start over, usually about 20 to 40 thousand and thats it. A capacitive discharge ignition is not hampered by inductive resistance and will fully saturate a coil, giving better burn, over a broader degree sweep, burning ALL the fuel/air in the chamber, reducing emmissions, and therefore bettering mileage.
*Mike,LOTSA' stuff is out for the 5.0L for power and mileage. Grab any issue of any of the Mustang performance monthly magazines, and keep in mind MOST, not all of the 5.0 stuff for a Mustang is the same on a truck, and the companys that sell the parts will have catalogs for truck stuff too. My dad had one (5.0) in a pickup and it was a turd, a little tweaking here and there, it ran as well as any Mustang. 12.5 mpg sucks! Check conditions of your cat(s) and as in earlier posts, think of the engine as an air pump, any restrictions beyond normal are going to make mileage suffer. Air cleaners, cold air ducting, manifold/headers, bent/dented pipes, cats, ANY of the emmissions equipment malfuntioning, etc.
*Do not even think about buying a Ford f150.They are trash. I know because I own one.
*mj...i no yust what u mean..my '73 was trashed...my '80 was trashed (well , i still seee it around town).......my'83... my '85..and probably my '91 will eventually be trashed too....yust not yet...hah, hah, hah...
*Still driving my '88 F 150 that I bought new.Still not trashed.Still original engine-220,000 miles
*I bought a 97 Ford f150 (new) and I had to replace the motor at 65000 miles. When I talked to the Ford people about this they said too bad. That is why the truck is trash. It happened about two weeks after the last payment. My wife drives an 89 toyota and all we have done is change the oil. go figure.I guess my truck was built on a friday.
*Pro,This is what you want to buy.I had to leave the picture the size it is so that you would be able to read it. The instructions on the back of the box are rudimentary. The directions included inside the box are better. They say that the filter should not be left out in the sun, like Chris said, nor should they be dried in a dryer or with a hair dryer, etc. They should be left to dry in the shade.
*Art, if you can cut the side electrode on a spark plug with diagonal cutters, you have the best diagonals on the market, and forearms the size of my thighs.I have made my own splitfires by using one of those super thin cutting wheels on a dremel tool to cut it most of the way through, then using a cold chisel while the electrode was held securely in a vise. If your time is worth little enough that you don't mind taking the time to do this, it actualy does work. I did have to dress them up with a file and regap them before I used them, but it actualy did improve the power and the gas mileage on the 83 Nissan king cab pickup that I put them in. Not tons of improvement, but it was noticeable. They also had to be replaced at about half to 5/8 the lifespan of unaltered plugs.Now that I have read the web site that Chris directed us to, I think next time I will make my own side-gapped plugs. It'll be a lot easier...
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I bought my 87 Toyota because I wanted a truck with good mileage. I'm only getting nineteen to a gallon and it's burning oil, I've decided I deserve a real truck. Anybody out there getting decent mileage out of a 60 vintage Ford or Chevy? I'm wondering if a six cylinder might be the answer.