If a guy were to buy his first router and he planned on having only one router (for a while) that could be used without a table or with a table (a future purchase), would the better unit be a 2 1/4 or a 3 1/4 HP version? Versatility. Or should he be advised to buy a smaller router for most work and buy a larger one with a table when money permits and work necessitates?
Expected uses are basic, such as decorative edges on window sills or a roundover on the edge of a deck, but one never knows.
The Bosch 1617 EVSPK kit (2 1/4) and the 1619 EVS (3 1/4) seem like choices that fit the bill.
Replies
I`d say to go with the big gun....you don`t want to be caught shorthanded.
I`ve got the 1611 EVS....probably about 15 yrs. old by now. 3.5 HP, has handled everything I`ve ever thrown at it. Picked up a Porter Cable trim router a few years back, but only use it for the most minor routing.
You can`t go wrong with a Bosch.
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
"DO IT RIGHT, DO IT ONCE"
Most of the time 2hp is plenty. 3+ hp is a brute and you have to hold that thing a lot. If you see the road ahead being production work, then go for the big one, but otherwise the smaller one will be a lot nicer for freehand work. You can always feed a little slower or take a series of cuts if the workload is heavy on a certain job.
Porter Cable have been making routers for a long time and have the details long since figured out. They have nice multi-pack ones that would a good choice for first router: one motor plus interchangeable fixed and plunge bases.
http://www.porter-cable.com/index.asp?e=547&p=4856
Bosch and Makita make good routers too.
Wally
I'm with you on the PC for a start up kit.
I have more routers than I can count without looking around to check, all different, but I was just thinking the other day that those old PCs are still my favorite all-around. one stays in the table mount all the time and has milled a tremendous number of feet of trims with no troubles.
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I liked what I read about the PC so I ended up ordering the 894PK.I guess now my questions center around the bits. Are the expensive bits worth the money?Thanks for all the help.
Are the expensive bits worth the money?
Only if you are doing production work. Some carbide is harder than others but if you are only routing a few hundred feet it doesn't matter much. Cheap bits will still last you for years. Some of those kits of several bits go on sale now and again and its nice to have a selection in the workshop for things you may not be considering right now.
Be Constructive
Gord
St.Margaret's Bay NS
Re: router bitsI buy expensive for bits I will use constantly -- roundovers, etc. I buy cheap for those bits I need for a specific job and may or may not ever use again.
Actually, I'd go the other direction--I'd get a small PC router, like a horse or horse and a half, and get used to it.Routers are fairly cheap used:http://search.ebay.com/Porter-Cable-RouterRegards,
Boris"Sir, I may be drunk, but you're crazy, and I'll be sober tomorrow" -- WC Fields, "Its a Gift" 1934
I end up using my little horse and 3/4 DeWalt router for 90% of the stuff I do. Like you said, roundovers, ogees, etc., on 3/4" material. I have both of the Bosches, the 3-1/4 horse is for the router table. I'd get the 1617 Bosch first.
I have several routers...maybe 8 or 9 all tgether.
Favorites are PC and the Bosch.
For what you're talking about, I'd recommend the 1617. I have three of them, they work well in hand or hung in a table.
My 3-1/4 hp is a PC. I use in in the table when spinning large-diameter bits, talking about 3-1/2" cutters. I really don;t like using it as a hand held. I have, but it's pretty large and cumbersome when comparing it to the 1-3/4 to 2hp Bosch and PCs.
The old PC 690 series is a workhorse as well, I have a few of those, too.
I'd recommend you get the Bosch 1617EVS first. Easy speed adjustment, easy gross and easy fine adjustment as well. You can use the variable speed to spin big chunks of carbide, and you can cut with large raised panel bits after first pre-cutting some waste on the table saw. That'll take some of the strain off the unit.
Another vote for the Bosch 1617. I have the D-handle, which is nice for one-handed work. Plenty of power for 95% of routing tasks.
I would have said get the PC 690 1.5 hp but it has been updated. I have had mine for 15 yrs and it's still going strong. Been abused more than once, won't quit. Small enough to use by hand, strong enough to do a lot of work if you take small bites. It's one of the best tools PC made.
I'm sorry, I thought you wanted it done the right way.
Bluemoose,
I did a review for JLC on the PC 894PK awhile back and found the kit to be an excellent value. The two base setup gives you easy table or hand routing. It's smooth, quite and powerful.
Thanks for the replies. I've been looking at the PC now too. The Bosch comes with a few more accessories, but I would like to get the best router regardless of what comes with it. I'm kicking myself, though, because many of Amazon's tools were more than 20% off over the weekend due to Lowe's 20% off sale. As I recall, the Bosch kit was $175 and it is now $220. Though a bit more expensive, would you say that the PC is still a better value because it is a better machine?
PC makes a couple of classic tools that can't be beat. The Portaplane door planer, the battleship heavy belt sanders, and a couple of the routers. Their 3+ hp router weighs a ton, it's built like it will last forever, and it probably will. Generally the classic tools lack some of the gee-whiz features of the newer competition, but you get a solid tool. I put the 690 in the same class, but since it's been replaced I don't have an answer.
I'm sorry, I thought you wanted it done the right way.
I find that I use my laminate trimmer much more often
than my big routers. Sure, it cannot handle the big
tasks, but it does all the smaller stuff so easily
and with so little fuss. It's always in the toolbox
when I leave the house. One of my favorite tools, and
this is a little surprising, since I bought it later
than the other routers, and always said "what do I
need a trimmer for when I've got a router?" Turns
out I would have been happier if I had bought the
trimmer first.
First, I would avoid the big guys (3 hp) as a first router. They're heavy, more expensive, and more suited to working with big bits -- such as raised panels.
I think you will find a router in the 1 1/2-2 hp range more versatile -- it can be used either hand-held or mounted under a table.
It is interesting that the folks in this forum seem to prefer Bosch, whereas the cabinet making crowd at Knots generally seems to prefer the PC.
I have both, but I would give the nod to PC -- mainly because I like their features a little better. I would urge you to look at the PC 690 series, which is tried and true, and you can probably get a good price on one of these models. The newer 890 series has some bells and whistles you might like, and user reports seem to be good.
The thing I would most strongly recommend is that you consider one of the kits that are now commonly available from most of the manufacturers. The most useful, I think, is the one which includes one motor, a d-handle base, and a conventional base. I think the d-handle is way-preferable for hand held operations, and you could mount the conventional base in a table -- and then switch the motor back and forth.
Finally, I don't think you can go wrong with any of the mainliners -- PC, Bosch, Makita, Hitachi. but I would avoid Sears, Ryobi, and Freud. The best thing you can do is get to some place where you can actually pick up the model you are considering; all have a slightly different feel, and you might find you prefer one over another just because it feels better in your hands.
i have several routers (8 I think) ranging from laminate trimmers to a 3 horse hitachi
the one i grab the most is a porter cable 693, there's not much it wont do
the laminate trimmers will run small edge trim bits easily
the three horse is really way too heavy and awkward for general use
caulking is not a piece of trim
Yet another vote for the Bosch 1617. This is the setup (only router) I have and it works for all that I currently do (non-production). I use mine most of the time in the field and find the 2 1/4 hp to be more than sufficient.
Derek
Go for the big one. It will do everything the small one will and more faster because it won't be loading down. Once you have it you will start finding more things that you can use it for, and you don't know what your customer is going to want you to make a year from now. It may need the extra power to handle a large diameter cutter.
Lots of edge treatment cutters tend to lift large splinters where the grain runs slightly in against the way you are traveling. Once you can recognize when that is likely to happen, you can avoid the problem by climb cutting first, then running back the normal way for the last 1/16" of the final pass. This is harder to do when a tool is under powered, because as soon as it starts to slow down, the bit starts taking bigger and bigger bites per revolution, until it gets real traction, and runs away from you if you are not ready. The more power you have, the easier the router is able to take the desired amount per revolution.
Whatever brand you choose, be sure and get a plunge model. I have 4 in the 3 HP range. Three are Makita, and 1 Ryobi, most were bought before the other brands even made the plunge models.
Always buy the 1/2" shank bits when you have the option. There is 4 times as much metal in the larger shank, but that makes it about 8 times stiffer I think. Anyway if the 1/4" cutter starts to chatter, it is because of deflection in the shank which ~= rough cut. Cheers K
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That I give a damn,
Well they damn sure told you wrong.
I've had ramblin' fever all along.
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Im all about Hitachi, and Bosch, but another consideration is that vac port on one of the PC's. If thats a consideration, I think they are the only ones so far, Milwaukee may have one as well. I dont do hardwood cabinets, but I get by fine on a Rockwell 1/2 dinosaur in the field, its about the size of a 2 1/2 body.
Hey Blue moose,
Don't forget that you can do alot with a pc 690. They are 1.75 hp now and also have the option of variable speed. In the issue before last I think, a guy was building a wainscoting out of mdf and bolection molding. he was raising the panels using a 3.5 inch bit and a pc 690 in a homemade table. you just have to take smaller bites with the smaller hp router. He would make a pass on all of his material then readjust the fence.
Also a reminder or fyi. I just purchased the PC 694 vsk variable speed fixed base and plunge base kit for two hundred dollars at Lowes. PC is offering this kit with a coupon for a free d-handle base, a seventy dollar value.
You just have to send in the rebate form postmarked by December 31 2004. If you purchase it off Amazon you have to download the two page form, and they don't give you the additional twenty five dollars off.
If you buy at Lowes I think they are still offering 20% off on power tools. If they will let you combine both offers.
Also the new PC 890 line is also nice. The springs in the plunge base in this line are removable , good for table mounting.
You could put the two knob base in a table and hand hold the other two or put the plunge base in the table...
Bosch also makes good routers as well, their 3.5 hp router is only thirteen pounds, I have circular saws that heavy..
webby
bluemoose
I use routers about 5 to 10 hours a week on average. I have the Bosch 1619EVS, PC 7519 and a 1/2 dozen PC 690's, plus a couple laminate trimmers.
I will reach for the 690 95% of the time.
If you get the PC 7518 or 19 and your doing simple stuff like putting a 1/4 round on a piece of wood your going to hate it.
Get the 690 or 693, you can always get the bigger one when you get big jobs that require it.
Doug
Most 1 1/2 hp routers that have separate collets will do. Ryobi and Craftsmen are two that have collet as part of the shaft, not recomended.I like the PC 690 myself, newer ones are rated 1 3/4hp and are called PC890.I would look for a D handled router with the switch in the handle for your first router.Large routers ( 3hp) are too heavy and awkward for free hand routing. I have used all PC routers, all Bosch, Makita, Dewalt etc. All of these gave good results, my preferences do not have to be yours. Pick each one up , fiddle with the height adjustments, stay with name brands except for Craftsmen and Ryobi for above mentioned reasons. Most routers come with 1/4" and 1/2" collets.Buy a straight bit and an edge shaping bit to start. I would not buy a set unless you think you will use most of those bits.
mike
I buy woodline bits, cheap and good. plus they have a great guaranty . Try them you'll be happy. They're all I buy anymore.