Prep for ceramic, talk me out of this
I pulled up the laminate flooring today. Would’ve been helpful if the customer had warned me that SOME of the cabinets were on top of the laminate.
Anyways, I’m left with odd tiles. 12″ square, 1/4″ thick. A lot like linoleum…but tiles. Not very soft. Seems like I’ve read that ceramic can be put on top of linoleum…
The problem is this. From the joists (1 3/4″ to 2″ x 7.5″ actual, 19 inches o.c., spanning 9 1/2 feet) up:
7/8″ thick boards running diagonally.
5/8″ plywood
1/8″ (?) underlayment
1/4″ tile.
There are spots where the floor seems to move when I step on it. I can tell from the basement that the 5/8″ ply is not always in contact with the 7/8″ boards.
I plan to cut out and remove the tiles and the 1/8″ underlayment and replace it with a 1/2″ ply screwed to the 5/8″ ply. Combined with efforts from below to shim where the 5/8″ ply is not in contact with the 7/8″ boards.
OR
Would it work to just screw the tile/underlayment to the 5/8″ ply and shim from below. Can I put ceramic on the tile? Using ditra?
OR????
Attached is a pic of the floor, but I don’t think it is particularly helpful.
Rich Beckman
Coming to the Fest? Don’t forget pencils!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Replies
Rich, assuming that the joists are not warped, I would screw the sheathing down very well... at least every 4 inches, to stabilize the "foundation" for your floor. Make sure you use a screw with a clean shank of at least the depth of the sheathing so that it pulls together properly.
Ceramic can be laid on top of "linoleum" but I think that commonly refers to what is really vinyl sheet flooring. The important component of that being how well the flooring is adhered to the subfloor. In your case, I think going over the tiles is not the same and is asking for trouble.
If you are going to install 1/2" ply, why not use 1/2" cement board instead? But screw down the subfloor well first, then add the cement board. You definitely want the subfloor to be sound before installing anything over it.
If shimming is the appropriate thing to do, based upon what is out of line (the underlayment or the joists... although I'd first suspect the underlayment) you might be better to add a joist... even of 2x4 dimension... to the side of the existing instead, butted up to the sheathing. this way you'd have a nice and continuous bearing instead of shims. add glue and plenty of screws for a solid end result. Technically, you could add even something finer such as 1X material or even plywood strips to act as stabilizing strips instead of shims. With enough glue and fasteners, they should do a great job. I just think you'll have a tougher time than expected with shims in what is likely a series of narrow and inconsistent voids.
http://www.petedraganic.com/
Pete,Read the thread title! You're supposed to talk me OUT of pulling the tile!:)
I don't know why I mentioned adding 1/2". It's hard to imagine that the existing base won't be enough once it's screwed together.The voids are created by the first layer of boards. There are a few spots where, in between the joists, the boards are warped down.It does now appear that the movement I have felt is mostly a result of the top layer being insufficiently nailed to the bottom.
Rich BeckmanComing to the Fest? Don't forget pencils!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Rich,
Shouldn't you be packing your bags instead of thinking about work?
Ron
Pack my bags???We're leaving a week from tomorrow. I'll start packing a week from today.Never do today what you can put off to tomorrow!
:)
Rich BeckmanComing to the Fest? Don't forget pencils!!!!!!!!!!!!!
2x8s 19OC spanning 9'6"
On top of that you want 2" of subfloor and tile.
In a kitchen.
I don't know. But isn't that kinda pushing the span limit on them there 2x's? For tile, I mean.
SamT
II agree that it is marginal. But it is helped by the fact that most of the 2x8's are actually 2 inches thick (I think only one of them is 1 3/4).
I guess I'll find out!
Rich BeckmanComing to the Fest? Don't forget pencils!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I agree that will help spread point loading over more than one joist, but you're adding dead load over the whole floor.Won't that make a difference?SamT
When I used the calculator at John Bridge and entered the joists as 2" thick, it came up as OK. When I entered them as 1 1/2, it came up as not good enough.As for the dead load, I take it you are referring to the idea of adding 1/2" ply?I admit I had not considered that as adding weight, but I would be surprised if it was a problem.At this point, I might skip the 1/2" and use ditra. I might get a better level match to the other rooms that way.
Rich BeckmanComing to the Fest? Don't forget pencils!!!!!!!!!!!!!