Hi everyone…. I have a revenue property that was built in 1959 and both the upstairs and downstairs suites have windows in the shower surrounds. This was all the bldg. code required back then for bathroom ventillation. Needless to say, anytime somebody showers, the window gets soaked and the water collects on the sill and soaks in rotting the drywall and insulation behind the tub surround and under the window.
I’d like to replace the windows as they are very old sliders (4 panes of glass) but I suspect I’d still have the same moisture/rotting problem with the wall regardless of window choice. Has anybody encountered this type of problem and what did you do to permanently fix this? Remove the window and fill in the void?? Any suggestions? Our winters are very cold so I need to be concerned with proper insulation/vapour barrier.
Thanks in advance,
Mike
Replies
The best way to do it is to strip the interior (and some of the exterior) so that you can create a completely integrated flashing and waterproofing situation for both sides of the wall. On the inside you need to flash from the window opening out onto the waterproofing over the wall framing, and then tile over it. I don't think there's any way you can just pop another window into the opening you have without some serious demo. If you're talking about sheetrock below the window, forget it.
Has anybody encountered this type of problem and what did you do to permanently fix this? Remove the window and fill in the void?? Any suggestions?
Sounds like you already have the answer to this issue. If I was living in that house I would:
1: Remove the window and fill in the void
2: Install a power fan that can vent to the outside, wired into the light switch along with a timer that forces the fan to run for 10-15 min after the light is turned off.
3: do a search on this site for Vapor Barrier, and get ready for a good LONG read.
Adam
Had the same problem.The way I fixed it was to move the tub to another wall.Put in a two piece fiberglass tub unit and it solves the problem permanently.The 1st floor bathroom not to hard to do if you have the room and can get to the plumbing from the basement,2nd floor bathroom a bit trickyer.If its directly over the 1st floor bite the bullet and do them both.You will be glad you did.
An ex-girlfriend had the same problem.She had the bathroom remodeled but they left the new(vinyl)window as it was in the shower.It took less than a year for the shower walls,sill and window components to start causing problems again.IT just doesn't belong there.
Oh Yeah if you can swing it I would put in some new windows
Stay Safe Greg
Edited 4/17/2004 5:35 pm ET by GREGGO10/2 10/3
I replaced the window in my shower with a solid vinyl window. Not the most beautiful thing, but doesn't care about water inside or outside. Then I used PVC for the trim and sill. Glued it all together into a waterproof unit with jambs that slips inside the original window jambs. Tiled up to the window and then applied the trim unit over tile and bonded it to window and wall with silicone. Not a hint of the previous water problems. The PVC molding glues like a charm with the same glue you use for plumbing.
I did glass block in a shower. Looks good. Deal with the water issues on the casing -- use ceramic with waterproofing or Corian, sloped sill, etc.
billy
A common solution in my area is like Billy mentions - glass block.
Sometimes they put in a small awning window up high, the better approach (IMO) is to put in solid glass block and a power vent.
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Hi Bob, thanks for the feeback. I was thinking glass block at one point as it offers privacy and a decent solution to the moisture problem but I've never worked with glass block. I assume that if the existing window opening will not fit a row of whole blocks (width or height) the opening would have to be made larger? I doubt the blocks are able to be cut down to fit the existing opening. Any pointers with this?
Mike
Here's a pic of a nicer one we did. Maintenance is the key: gotta keep the caulk up and the grout sealed. Don't worry, we can fix that later!
Oh yeah, the pic<G> Don't worry, we can fix that later!
Place a curtain rod and plastic shower curtain in front of the window. The choice in curtain design is unlimited.
I bought this house not too long ago and would you believe that is what the last owner did - however it was just enough to cover the window edges thus the problems. Certainly a bigger curtain would be an inexpensive solution for the time being until I can have access to the bathroom for a couple weeks without tenants to fix it properly.
Thanks. Mike
MG911 - noticed you are in Sask. Did a similar reno several years ago in Toronto. Not quite as cool in winter as you, but you wouldn't know it this past one. Attached is a photo from the reno, showing glass block we put in the window opening.
Check out the Pittsburg Corning website for product and installation instructions. If buying from HD, you will need to special order product for use in a shower (you don't want clear). I do not recommend the PC clear caulking they recommend for their glass blocks, unless their formula has changed. In another application where I used that caulk, it aged to a hideous yellow. PC has a variety of block sizes/finishes.
Used white flexible caulk to fill the side and top joints with x-pansion strips, glass block cement and reinforcement for the rest. Clear caulk is preferable, as you won't see it thru the edge of the blocks. We installed it flush to the tile surround to avoid shower sill issues with the block.
The house is double-brick construction, so we framed the opening with 2x8, vapour barrier wrapped it, lined it with cement board and then installed the blocks with reinforcement. I essentially treated the blocks as a window unit. The exterior, as it is on the second floor, was framed up with p/t, a beveled sill and painted after the wood was dry. I found the framing up on the exterior to be easiest as this gave flexibility for block size that can be used.
Install a power fan as previously suggested for the ventilation. We dropped the bath ceiling to give us the room needed, as it is a flat roof above the room. Punched out thru the wall above the window.
Hi Varoom, thank you VERY much for the detailed response and the photo - nice job.
Do you think the glass block should be a concern with the extremely cold winters we're known to have here in the Praire region? If you have any more photos of the construction part, I'd love to see some. I'll send you my e-mail if you do.
Thanks again,
Mike
One last question...keeping in mind this is a rental property - was the glass block reno expensive?
Mike
Mike,
Your question re: the use of glass block in prolonged cold is a good one - maybe post it in the energy section of the board. I don't have an answer for you. The website http://www.pittsburghcorning.com/index.asp gives specs on the blocks and the R values I briefly looked at are 1-2 range. With the added insulation to the exterior wall that we put in, it is not bad at all for our region. I personally would sacrifice R value for water tightness. I presume your larger concern re: the blocks is cold transmission, rather than physical performance. It's been 3 years now and no problems at all. Added a heat lamp off the tub to take the chill off.
I'll see if I can dig up some photos of the reno - it was a gut and rebuild. I'll post the photos if I can find them.
The cost was not high, not low either. A box of special order ice scapes design (8 or 9 in a box) was approx $120 from HD. Needed two boxes. With materials it probably came in at $320 (CAN).
Hope that helps.
It may be cheaper for you to buy a prebuilt glass block window. They can use different size blocks and positions to obtain different window sizes. Call your local suppliers. I have used some of these (scroll to the bottom for the banded windows made using glass block masonry cement):
http://www.marylandglassblock.com/id10.htm
All you have to do is set them in your window opeing, shimming as necessary. I used white PL polyurethane caulk to seal around the edges.
They let in lots of light while retaing privacy. With regular windows people put up curtains or blinds for privacy and you lose much of the natural light.
Billy
Edited 4/21/2004 2:11 pm ET by Billy
Thanks to both yourself and BILLY for the last bit of information - it's given me alot to think about. Love to see those pics if it's not too much trouble, otherwise not to worry.
Best regards,
Mike
Here are a few pics of a basement bathroom with glass block windows.
The first pic is of the window in the shower. Note that the sill is sloped. The frame is wood painted with a high quality gloss oil paint, which is probably fine at the opposite end from the shower head in a bathroom that doesn't get much use. Otherwise I strongly suggest building the jambs & casing using tile with waterproofing behind it or Corian. Caulk wisely with a high quality caulk.
The second pic is a window over the sink. The glass blocks are a different pattern -- they are less frosted than the shower window but they do a good job of distorting the image while letting in lots of light and creating great rainbow patterns when the light is right.
The last pic is of a shower track instead of a shower rod -- just like they use for hospital curtains. It makes for clean lines as you don't need a shower rod with all sorts of Rube Goldberg brackets hanging in front of a window .
Billy
Mike,
Here are a couple more pictures of glass block windows taken during the daytime.
Billy
Thank you very much for taking the time to post those photos and for giving your advice. I'm giving it some serious consideration.
Mike