Tilting the blade on a tablesaw towards the fence has always struck me as a poor idea. I’ve made plenty of mitered rips like that, and it always sends my confidence plummeting. My old boss got kicked pretty hard on one occasion, ruining a nice piece of hardwood and developing a nasty bruise.
Right hand tilt saws are common, and I can see the following drawbacks:
– the obvious one: work is trapped between the blade and the fence, nowhere to go
– when pushing the work with your hand, is tilting the blade toward your hand a good idea?
– when making a box with mitered joints, putting the off-cut on the left side of the blade means the blade could be chipping out the edge of the good piece. Less of a problem with a good blade, I admit, but still.
So what’s the deal? I’m not a professional carpenter, so am I missing out on some compelling argument for right-hand tilt?
Replies
right tilt = fence on left
i don't think you're missing anything - a terribly dangerous idea to tilt the blade toward the fence -
I've got one LT and one RT saw - sometimes the right tilt facilitates a certain operation, but I would never trap a workpiece between a tilted blade and the fence -
OK. . . it's just that in my last workplace, our tablesaw (which was not used for production, just for this-and-that) tilted to the right, but the fence could not be moved to the left of the blade. So we frequently used it with the blade tilted towards the fence.It was a Delta unisaw with a Delta fence, not a Beismeyer (spelling?) style, which could be used on either side.
Edited 1/16/2008 1:49 pm ET by Biff_Loman
hmmm... - I'm not familiar with unisaw specifics - I do believe they are available as either lt or rt - I find it hard to believe that the set up you describe is factory - but I could be wrong - I wouldn't use it tho - - "there's enough for everyone"
biff,
Sounds very unusual that the fence couldn't be run over to the other side-even if it meant lowering the blade all the way and sliding it across the insert. I've got an old delta that has a "geared" dial to move the fence, so taking it off means sliding it off the end of the track, or lowering the blade and dialing it over the other way.
How old was this unisaw?A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
Well, what I really meant is that the fence wasn't reversible. Only the left side was designed to be a bearing surface.But wouldn't you know, I looked up the unisaw after starting this thread. The fence sure is reversible, but it takes a few minutes to swap it around. I'm not sure if my boss was even aware of that. That could have saved me some hair-raising moments. But like I said, the saw wasn't used for production.
Well just goes to show you.
Never encountered a one good edge fence.
Learn something every day.A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
Ahem..
Ok, I just picked you at random from the O posters..A properly set fence has a bit ( 1/64th or pick a number) of relief set aft the blade..helps with rips not being forced to bind at the worst place, on the upside of spinnage. Swapping to the opposite side of the blade creates a potential to feed into a tapered trough..and lemme tell ya..thats a no-no.You'll notice that the fence like the delta Uni has a short rip fence attachment, as do many Euro saws employ..this is so the meandering stock that is freed from the board can go where ever it chooses, vs. being in a state of clamping onto the blade..I was shown that no fence is needed after the arbor nut has been passed, but a splitter is a really , really good idea..keeps the kerfage open.We used to lamimnate 5x5 by 60" "billets" of hard rock maple and rosewood for bass guitar necks..ripped them on a 20" dia. Tannewitz table saw..running 5 HP, yeah..let it get bound up and you were taking a ride across the room, I saw it happen..drove a levi's rivit into a guys hip bone when it kicked.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
"Success is not spontaneous combustion, you have to set yourself on Fire"
And no one ever sets it dead nuts parallel because of the possibility of kick back?
Belt drives I used to be able to fight off any potential for grab and ram.
This from a guy that uses push sticks when the stock really becomes too small-hook the 3 fingers of the appropriate hand up and over the rip fence to aid in not being pulled into the blade.
The only real kickback I've witnessed was from a direct drive sears 10 inch. And yes, it packed a wallop.
Currently use an old delta set with a dado-belt drive, and the bosch 4000, direct drive.
Count 'em when you leave for work and don't express surprise when you've got the same number on the drive home.A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
see? your longest post ever withouta #### or a @@@@@..
I am impressd.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
"Success is not spontaneous combustion, you have to set yourself on Fire"
Well, don't that beat all.
You know, I kind of like the ####.
It'd be #### 'd up if I couldn't type like I seem to converse......
in the right company.
And the #### 's and #### 's get the point across w/o the offensiveness.
Though now that I think of it, it has the definite possibility of offending.
That is if you understand the #### 's and #### 's.A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
You da ####!Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
"Success is not spontaneous combustion, you have to set yourself on Fire"
Biff,Was it a Unifence? Unifence is a big aluminum extrusion attached to a short iron stub with a glide at the end of the iron stub to ride on the table. The Unifence looks like it can only be used on one side, but it can actually be quickly reconfigured to work on the other side if desired. That said, a Biesemeyer is a lot easier to switch sides with than a Unifence.BillEdit: Your post #8 was not up when I posted this. Looks like it was a Unifence after all.
Edited 1/16/2008 8:39 pm by BillBrennen
If someone really wanted to be idiosyncratic, one could probably move the rail of the fence over to the left, reverse the fence, and learn to do all the operations backwards.I'm not being serious, but it sounds like something my grandfather would have tried.
Biff,Was your grandfather left-handed? ;-)Bill
He's still alive. ;-) And yes.
You can always do the fence tango, and put your fence on the opposite side. Not as much rip capacity that way typically, but most of the time, it works for me.
Ripping with the blade R of the fence always feels backwards to me, but that is just because I have done it mostly the "standard" way.
Woodworkers sells a right tilt "Woodtek" brand saw that is pretty good, for a "cotractor class" saw. http://woodworker.com/cgi-bin/FULLPRES.exe?PARTNUM=109-349
Edited 1/16/2008 4:29 pm ET by Gene_Davis
http://www.ronin-group.org/shop_table_saw_tilt.shtml
It's all advantages to left-tilt. Interesting.
"so am I missing out on some compelling argument for right-hand tilt?"
No. You're absolutely right. I will never use a right tilt saw to miter with the fence on the right side. Very dangerous.
Why do they make them like that with the fence on the wrong side? Why is the sky up and not down?
Here is a good commentary on R versus L tilt tablesaws, clipped from Woodweb.
Both saws will make all the same cuts. The differences are all in the methods of work, and what will feel natural/intuitive to you. For me, what is natural tends to be safer, which is why I bought a left-tilt Unisaw when I upgraded from a contractor's saw.
1. Commonly, the left tilt has the bevel wheel on the right side and is easily turned with your right hand. Since I'm right-handed, that's intuitively where it feels like it belongs.
2. Again intuitively, I keep the rip fence on the right side of the blade. Since my Unisaw is the left tilt version, I can rip a narrow bevel (for example on the edge of sheet goods) without having to move the fence to the left side of the blade in order to avoid trapping the cutoff against the fence, risking it becoming the proverbial "hidden arrow" should it kickback.
3. Left tilt allows the blade arbor nut to be removed with your right hand. It is also threaded in the standard fashion... again, intuitive.
4. With a left tilt, when both edges of a board are beveled, the sharp point of the bevel is up on the fence when cutting the second bevel as opposed to the bottom of the fence where it might slip under.
5. The right tilt gives you the advantage of using the rip fence distance indicator (long tape measure mounted to the fence rail) when using a stacked dado blade set. The blades stack left, away from the fence, so the indicated measurement remains accurate. On the left tilt, the blades stack toward the fence, which means that you have to factor in the thickness of the dado stack and calculate, or else measure with a tape rather than the mounted indicator.
6. A right tilting arbor allows you to remove the arbor nut with your left hand, which may feel more natural to a "southpaw," but the nut must be turned clockwise to loosen. Counter-intuitive and, therefore, can be confusing.
7. On most cabinet saws, the left tilt allows you to have access to the motor and inside the cabinet from the more open left side of the saw, avoiding the need to contort yourself under the right extension table. If you've ever dropped the arbor nut into the cabinet (I'm sure I'm the only soul who has done so), and it doesn't pop out of the dust port, this is a convenience for which you'll be grateful.
Others will likely post additional considerations that haven't come to mind, but those are certainly the differences you would experience most often.
Right-tilt: Dangerous miter rips, safer miter crosscuts with the miter guage.
Left-tilt: Safer miter rips, more dangerous miter crosscuts with the miter guage.
No?
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-Groucho Marx
You could use the miter gauge in the right slot, or use a crosscut sled.
As was mentioned, anytime you change blade thickness (thin to full or dado) the measuring scale on a LT saw needs to be recalibrated or ignored.
That's a pretty good argument, for a production setup.
I solved the left-right blade tilt problem on the Delta Unisaw by installing a 48" L-R Biesmeyer (sp?) fence. The Delta's blade tilts to the right while some manufacturers have saws which has the blade tilting to the left.
One problem though, the saw takes up a lot of space.