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roof framing question

popawheelie | Posted in Tools for Home Building on April 7, 2007 07:24am

We are moving to a new old house and had an inspection. It’s in snow country so the roof needs to be able to carry some snow load. The inspector found where a valley attached to a ridge had split and sagged about an inch and a half.

The ridge is for a hip and is a 2 X 6 and the valley is a 2X8. I don’t know if it was nailed properly. It seems like alot of the 2 X 8 valley would be below the 2 X 6 ridge even if it didn’t sag.

Should a 2 X 8 valley be hanging off a 2 X 6 ridge? It seems like the ridge could have been deeper so there was more to attach to.

I asked the inspector and he didn’t know. He said he would get back to me on it but didn’t.

I got a reduction in the price of the house for repairs so i guess I will be up there fixing it. Is there a hanger I can use?

Thanks!

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  1. Piffin | Apr 07, 2007 03:14pm | #1

    hard to answer this without seeing it. I assume when you say this ridge is a hip that you mean the roof is a hip style and the ridge is a horizontal member, but maybe you mean it is a hip-ridge piece or that the ridge of a dormer interscts a hip, or that.....

    You have a digital camera?

     

     

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      popawheelie | Apr 07, 2007 05:41pm | #2

      I have a camera but the house is in another state right now. I drove out there (9 hrs.) and was there for the inspection. My wife and kids were out there a week before to "look" at houses and fell for this one. It was built in the 60s so it has some years on it and hasn't been taken care of the way I would have. I don't mind to much. It gives me opportunity to change it a bit and fix it up.

      I'm trying to describe what is happening. The hip roof comes off the main gable. The ridge for the hip roof is a 2 X 6. Where the hip roof intersects the gable there is a valley. They used a 2 X 8 for the main member of the valley. This valley (2 X 8) attaches to the (2 X 6) ridge for the hip.

      Since the 2 X 8 is taller 8" than the ridge 6" the 2 X 8 has a fair amount below the ridge that can't be nailed to the ridge. This where the 2 X 8 split near the top and sank about 1 1/2". Looking at it (in hindsight) I would have sized the ridge 2 X 8 also just for the connection. But that is just the way I do things.

      I don't know code on this connection any more. I was wondering if the ridge should have been a 2 X 8 60 years ago. The home inspector did a good job of pointing it out. This is the second home inspection I've had in two weeks. They were both pretty good at pointing out things. But as soon as I asked for a solution they were hard pressed to come up with anything concrete. To be fair they did what they were supposed to do. This guy did say he would find out if the ridge was sized right. But he hasn't. No big deal. When I get moved in I can always go down to building and safety and ask.

      1. Piffin | Apr 07, 2007 07:07pm | #3

        Code matters little right now if it was built way back when.All that should matter is the cost to solve the problem of the fact that it is in failure. That is your negotiating point for how muh to take off the price in your negotiations with the seller.It is not the job of an inspector to say how to fix it or to sugest a cost value. If he did make such a suggestion it would be outside his bounds and probably not accurate unless he has a strong background in contraccting or estimating.The way to proceed would be to ask a local contractor there. 

         

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          popawheelie | Apr 07, 2007 07:50pm | #4

          So what was general code for framing this back then. Do you know? I would be interested in knowing. It would give me an idea of how well the house was built.

          I've already negotiated over this. It is a done deal. the inspector threw out a figure that we used and the seller agreed to it. My question is if it was under sized for that time.

          I asked the inspector if it was framed correctly and he said he would get back to me. He didn't. If he didn't want to go there that is what he should have said.

          One of his selling points for his services was that he was or is a civil engineer.

          I just wanted to know if it was undersized. It would give me an idea of how it was built so I could start to understand this house a bit better. If you don't want to tell me it's ok. i can figure it out. I don't need a contractor to fix this. It is within my abilities to fix.

          1. Piffin | Apr 07, 2007 08:29pm | #5

            If a civil engineer who has seen it cannot say if it is undersized, how can anybody here? Especially without seeing it and knowing all the sizes and the local snow load requirements.As to codes, it would be almost impossible for anyone here to say what coides might have applied to your house at that time.Currently three codes are variously applied that I know of and there are probably twice that many plus local variations.
            Many localities still have no code whatsoever applied.In terms of genral princciples of framing, yes, a valley, a hip, and a ridge are normally going to be larger than a rafter.But there are sometimes good reasons to vary from that. Fact is - if it is splitting and sagging, it has failed so it was underbuilt, unless somebody had a boom deliver a load of shingles to one spot once upon a time 

             

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          2. dovetail97128 | Apr 07, 2007 09:04pm | #6

            I would guess from your brief description that it was not undersized to start with. The split could have been caused by any number of things. It perhaps should have (certainly would have been better ) had a full bearing support at the intersection . What is more important is what is it going to take to fix it? A post from a good bearing point with a backer valley from under it ? Remove the roof and replace? Gussets? repairing it may be easy if you start looking for fixes. what is is.

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