roofing fasteners for asphalt shingles
Squareshooter
| Posted in General Discussion on
What is the best air driven fastener for asphalt shingles? best as in durability , strength, holding power and efficiciency ?
Replies
I use HT-65 staples and have good results, but that's a manual hammer-tacker, not an air-powered nailer. I don't actually know if a pneumatic roofing stapler is available. I've never heard of one.
If you insist on air, you're going to wind up with a coil nailer specifically designed for roofing nails.
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I would say the best fastener is a roofing nail. Nail by hand or use a coil nailer. Either way can be done well or done poorly.
Be sure to nail where the instructions say to nail (seems like most shingles around here are nailed high) and, if using a nailer, be sure to set the air pressure so that the nails are not overdriven.
The head of the nail should be on top of the shingle, not recessed below the shingle surface. Better to have to tap some down with a hammer than to have some overdriven.
Rich Beckman
We've used coil nailers, hand nailed, 1" crown 1 1/4" leg wide crown staples and 1" crown 3/4" leg wide crown staples and had no problems with any approach.
I like the 1" crown 1 1/4" leg the best personally because the guns are compact and the staples are compact and durable and go all the way through the sheathing.
But as a previous poster pointed out the placement of the staples is critical as is how you do your eaves and rake starters. and putting a good solidly applied galvanized drip edge on all edges of the roof is also critical.
------------------
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I am surprised to read so mny comment say "What I use is stapels" When the question was "What is the best.."
There is no question that roof nails are far better than staples. Staples hav even been forbidden by odes in high wind areas. Anybody who has re-roofed a stapled job can tell you how much easier it tears off compared to a nailed roof.
Hand driven hot-dipped galvanized niles are even better yet than pneumatic coil electroplates
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They were showing houses deshingled by the last hurricane, I saw staples left in the sheathing, but no nails. Apparently the staples hold very well to sheathing, not so well to shingles.
<< Anybody who has re-roofed a stapled job can tell you how much easier it tears off compared to a nailed roof.>>I live in a high wind area (no hurricanes so far, admittedly) and have put on several roofs around here with my Bostitch stapler in the last dozen years. In fact, one i just did was to replace a roof that had been nailed, badly, just three years ago and was ripped to pieces within visual range of one i stapled on three years ago. I think careful placement is much more of a factor than type of fastener.I was up on my own roof yesterday for my semi-annual chimney sweeping and noticed a tab had been ripped off on the first course, but it was ripped off right below the fastener line...and i only use four staples per shingle. In all the squares i've put on, that's the only part of a shingles i've seen blow off. I know some manufacturers insist on nails to warrant their shingles, but i'm just telling my experience.And my gun works flawlessly. I've only replaced the trigger valve just last spring...a really cheap repair.
Squareshooter,
One brand not to buy is Porter Cable, They are really nail starters rather than roofing nailers.. you'll bring out your hammer nearly once per shingle even when there is too much air pressure..
Bostich has a great reputation as does Hitachi.. Bostich is the brand I see most commonly used by pros.
Others warned you, don't overdrive the nails.. that's an absolute.. the head of the nail should lightly dent the shingle not tear it in any way.. Oil the guns regularly.. you'll ruin them without regular oiling (and use the right gun oil) buy it when you buy the nail gun.. your air compressor should provide you with a minimum of 80 PSI up to the max the gun is rated for.. more air pressure does not mean a better job if the nails punch thru the shingle..
I can load the Bostich with 1 hand, need 2 hands to load Hitachi, have to set the gun down while loading.
Availability, durability and reliability seem about the same -- one hand loading wins.
Jim
Never underestimate the value of a sharp pencil or good light.
Edited 9/25/2007 12:27 pm ET by JTC1
Maze nails HD galvanized coil roofing nails.
Maze--hot dipped galv. coil nails.
arguably the best--but i actually priced them last week.
$70 per box--box is HALF the size of a standard box of coil nails
so-the comparison is
$25/box of generic coil nails( china/korea)--vs. $140/box maze nails.
Very few contractors are going to go with the maze nails.
I am actually thinking about it-because it is going to make an interesting side by side comparison to show potential customers(" these are the nails I use mr. homeowner--they cost me XYZ---but they are that good--THOSE are the nails most people use--they cost blah,blah,blah")
Stephen
"Maze--hot dipped galv. coil nails."I wonder if it is even possible to buy those in Grant County, Indiana.I'll have to look around.Shouldn't be too hard. Another lumberyard (a United Builders Center) closed last week. We're down to a "local" yard, a Carter's, Lowes, and Home Depot.
Rich BeckmanSteve, you are aware, I trust, that Labron James is hosting Saturday Night Live this coming weekend.
Rich,
the roofing supplier i use most often tells me that they will order them in for me---but don't stock them.
If I am in no hurry and can wait for the nails to come on one of their regular deliveries- i can get them for about $70/box( half box really)--and have no freight charge. I will probably get a box this fall and try them out( kind of interested to see if little pieces of zinc break of and jam the gun.
Have roofs sold untill roughly july 2008--so looks like I am gonna still be in the roofing business next year as well. If the nails work out this fall- may order 50 boxes or so to use next year AFTER july.
BTW-- no- I was not aware Lebron would be on SNL this weekend. Probably have to tape it since I usually go to bed about 8:30-9:00 at night------of course I no longer know how to tape with this VCR--so looks like I will miss it, LOL.
Stephen
"Have roofs sold untill roughly july 2008--so looks like I am gonna still be in the roofing business next year as well."
That's tough. Keep at it. Success is gotta be just around the corner.
:)
Rich Beckman
Rich,-- I have been working for 3 years on"retiring" from roofing--or at least stepping sideways out of roofing.
Hail storm here june 8th is the reason i am scheduling roofs for NEXT july. I felt I had a lot of friends, family and neighbors here in the neighborhood counting on me, depending on me---------to handle their roofs. As a result-and like it or not-that means I have had to delay my" retirement" plans at least a year.
the roofing is work I no longer am enthusiastic about---- there is not much interest there anymore for me-------but maybe by the end of next summer I can resume my sideways move into windows,doors, wood siding, soffit,fascia and exterior trim restoration on old houses--much more interesting to me.
stephen
"I have been working for 3 years on 'retiring' from roofing--or at least stepping sideways out of roofing."
I know.Keep at it. Success is gotta be just around the corner (well, maybe next year's corner....)
:)
Rich Beckman
The OP Q was: "What is the best air driven fastener for asphalt shingles?".... etc
So, I gave what I considered the best answer. To me though, I'd think these nails would only be worth using on premium roof coverings.
So, I guess you have done a million tear-offs, etc. How many roofs have you actually seen failing due to cheap roofing nails? Do the cheapies ever rust enough to start to disintegrate (heads coming off, etc) before the roof covering itself is worn out? I'm sure you have seen it all...
Others: I believe you can order maze nails off their web site... http://mazenails.com/
Matt,
I could be wrong about this--but I think you are assuming an attitude in my post-that simply wasn't there in actuality.
you shared the info you had.
I shared the info I had
period.
interesting though---if cost was no issue-- clearly the maze stainless steel roofing coil nails would be the way to go--they are what $250-$300 /box??????
and sure-maze will ship them to you direct-at what cost?-- i am guessing the shipping cost per box would be 20% of what we can buy the crappy generic nails for locally.
Have i seen roofing nails fail--yes-usually in contact with aluminum drip edge or aluminum flashing.
locally we have a lot of smaller roofs where the material cost to upgrade from a 30 year dimensional to a 50 year/lifetime shingle may be as little as $300 or so.-an increasing percentage of my customers elect to do so--and I expect that percentage to continue to increase. the hot dipped galv. coil nails may well be a smart move for those customers-------but in reality would mostly be a marketing tool for the rest of the customers.
Best wishes,
Stephen.
>> Have i seen roofing nails fail--yes-usually in contact with aluminum drip edge or aluminum flashing. <<
Is it some kind of chemical reaction (or other) between the 2 metals or what?
chemical reaction?
yes- Grant can explain it better--but I think it's called galvanic corrosion---- too far apart on a scale of compatible materials-- I actually have the chart around here somewhere-- but it would take some digging.
stephen
I'm kinda coming to the conclusion that Al flashing isn't useful for much of anything...
I guess if you used Al nails - that would be a real punishment...
Matt,
I find aluminum flashing quite usefull here---within certain intended lifespans. for the most part-if using heavier weight aluminum and an intended lifespan of say 20-40 years--aluminum works fine and is quite cost effecetive.
on the other hand---- if your intended lifespan is 50 plus years--aluminum probably not the way to go.
usually i am trying to balance all the lifespans of various components so that the customer isn't overpaying for something that will be scrapped in 25 years.
locally- i have alot of houses where the cost of copper drip edge,copper valleys, copper chimney flashing, copper sidewall step flashing, copper apron flashing etc.-would approach or exceed the cost of the actual shingles----and typically would be torn off 25 years down the road--so the "better material" would actually be a poor value.---but the heavy weight aluminum--would be nearly ideal.
Stephen
Thanks for your insight.
"I guess if you used Al nails - that would be a real punishment..."
I hand nail aluminum anywhere the nail meets aluminum flashing. I also use them in exposed applications (last ridge cap) and cover them with PL.
Somehow, it just makes me feel better knowing rust/corrosion won't be the reason for failure.
They do kinda suck while hammering, though."Fortunately, the ideas of individual liberty, private property, freedom of contract and association, personal responsibility and liability, and government power as the primary enemy of liberty and property, will not die out as long as there is a human race, simply because they are true and the truth supports itself."
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