Separating Mechanicals for a Hot Tub?
For our remodel we are planning to install a hot tub on the 2nd floor of the house, with the room open to the backyard (area is under existing roofline, but with 1 open wall to rear yard with a handrail). Am thinking of a standard configuration, electrical “jacuzzi”-type 5-person fiberglass type (for economic considerations). However, I’m concerned about the noise & vibration from the pumps coupling into the house framing (a home theater room will share an interior wall with this area). Am considering removing the innards and remotely locating them in the basement 2 floors below (on a slab). Given that the pump/heater is a “closed” system, and providing that I use thickwall PVC with secure glued connections, the head pressure at the pump inlet ought to roughly equal the head pressure for the outlet – ie., the pumps should not be worked any harder than normal and, as long as the additional static pressure doesn’t cause any leaks, I ought to be OK, right?!?
I was wondering if anyone had any experience separating the mechanicals from the tub – particularly if separated vertically – and would be willing to pass along any words of advice. My friendly neighborhood “spa stores” look at me as if I’ve got 2 heads…
Virtually every commercial spa installation I’ve ever seen utilizes separate mechanicals, although I don’t recall having seen them separated vertically by any significant height…
Thanks in advance for your help…
Replies
You are going to need a stronger pump to get the water to go up 2 stories.
The water flow may have a slight hum from the water movement and pump sound transmission Insulate the stud bays the pipes are in. Maybe even use CBUs skimmed with compound or plaster rather than GWB to deaden this sound.
I have no idea how one would get the proper sizing for the pump. Maybe you could "over-size" it and use a valve or some sort of diaphram to regulate the flow to the proper rate.
I am sure someone has already done this, but who?
Frankie
Experiment with the placing of the ingredients on the plate. Try the mozzarella on the left, the tomato in the middle, the avocado on the right. Have fun. Then decide it goes tomato, mozzarella, avocado. Anything else looks stupid.
Richard E. Grant as Simon Marchmont - Posh Nosh
From the point of view of the pumps, you're right. Once the tub is full, the extra pressure the pump has to put out is counterbalanced by the extra suction pressure. In theory, it will be a wash. A bit more friction through the pipes, but not a lot.
Check the pressure rating of the pump; I can't imagine that an extra 10 psi would make a difference, but you never know.
I have a hot tub on the outside deck at my ski place, and I don't notice any vibration at all coming through. With 400 gallons of water in the spa, there's a ton of damping there.
I think you're signing up for a lot of extra work without much benefit, and you'll certainly void the warranty of a spa.
I have a hot springs spa. It's pricier than a lot of the others, but it uses a separate low-wattage pump for heating so the jet pump is only on when you use it. I think that's a nicer solution than what you're thinking of.
I remote mount pumps for jetted tubs quite a bit , but there always on the same plane.
I would bump up the hp a tad for the extra piping, but I am always known for overkill.
& yes it is a wash for the elevation change.
I would rather isolate the pump where it is verses the chance of a pipe leak & flooding the interior of the house.
Most newer hot tubs pumps are much quieter than they used to be----- the noise is going to be more from the air industion for the bubbles than it is for the pump turning.
"I'm here to chew bubble gum & kick azz, & I'm all out of bubble gum" Rowdy Roddy Piper
Thanks everybody for the responses - I really appreciate it...
I'll look into the Hot Springs models - I understand they have a decent reputation...
Also thanks for suggesting that I consider the "holistic" isolation approach. I hadn't previously considered it. Below the tub will be a guest bedroom; adjoining the tub will be the kitchen and a home theater room. Intelligently programming the filter cycle may mitigate much of the noise concern, provided I can get a model with a fairly quiet heater. When it's operating, noise isn't a concern 'cause we'll probably be in it!
Our engineer has already spec'd doubling the joists beneath (2x10s spanning ~12', 16" o.c.) which I've done, and added simpson hangers to beef up the xfer beam connection (they were only toe-nailed previously)...
I hate the plastic consoles that the self-contained spas come in, so we were going to set it into some PT framing, surfaced with backer board & mosaic tile. It'll be fitted into a corner with a step-up surround to ease access. The entire area will be membrane water-proofed with drainage to the exterior in the event of overflow/rains/etc.. Perhaps, as implied by some of your responses, it would be easier & more efficient to incorporate some vibration deadening along with cycle timing to address the root concern?
Any thoughts on acoustic deadening techniques - particularly between the tub and floor beneath?
Check this guy out: http://www.spaspecialist.com/
Everything you ever wanted to know about spa design, engineering, construction. Just a little opinionated, but what he says makes a lot of sense to me. Worth an evening reading it all before you commit. I don't have a spa, but when I do get one it will most likely be from Haven Spas.
Perhaps you've already thought of this.
A hot tub full of water and people can weigh quite a bit more than the capacity of standard framing in most houses, most porches, and most decks. If you haven't done the math yet, do so before your investment goes through the floor.
Unless you're the lead dog, the view just never changes.
Your spa is not a "Closed" system. A pump downstairs will lose over half its power. A "Closed" system will happen when a solid airtight and water-tight lid is placed over the tub. If the pump is disconnected or has a leaf catcher to open up, the water pressure will blast whoever is down there.
Healthwise,ALL pumps should be higher than the tub drain. When tubs are drained, all the water should be removed. If water remains in the line, it will grow all sorts or organic stuff, and it smells too. It will contaminate the new fresh water.
A spa motor will be quiet when the connecting water lines are flexible. The motor itself is mounted on a waterproof block that is padded. A box made of particle board will quiet it.
keep it simple
use good equipment and all this is just a mental exercise, fun but not needed