Replies

1. 
   MikeHennessy | Apr 18, 2007 11:27pm | #1

   You are correct -- heat will help. To do this successfully, you need only 3 things:

   1) a good heat gun
   2) a dead-blow mallet
   3) a generous helping of good luck. (Especially with old wood).

   Nos. 1 and 2 are something you will be able to control. If you find No. 3 lacking, no big deal. You can repair bust-outs with new slip tennons.

   Mike Hennessy
   Pittsburgh, PA

1. 
   Pascanale | Apr 18, 2007 11:35pm | #2

   Thanks Mike,

   I own numbers 1 and 2 but, "generous helping"...I've not found that at either HD or Lowes...

   Pascanale (Allison  Park, PA, BTW)

    

2. 
   Sphere | Apr 19, 2007 01:04am | #4

   I use heat, warm water and vingar to loosen fret boards from guitars and such. A hypodemic-nerdle and a 1/16 " drill bit gets the solution to the glue, heat, soak, heat , soak.

   Wedgeing is MUCH better than a shock from a dead blow, slow, steady wedgeing..and heat, soak repeat.Parolee # 40835

1. 
   MikeHennessy | Apr 19, 2007 02:36pm | #12

   You're right about wedging or, in the case of windows, reversing a clamp. I'll usually just whack an old joint a bit first -- they often just pop. If not, I'll grab the clamps.

   So you're a luthier too? A nice, shiny copper resonator guitar would be cool. Post the pics!

   Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PA

2. 
   alias | Apr 19, 2007 12:23am | #3

   first see if they have been pegged or if they drove a nail snipped it then set it . if you find that either scenario , is the case drill that out. with a smaller diameter than the peg/ nail. strip the paint (use a respirator), i stay away from a dead blow cause of more damage, i got a couple of biesmeyer clamps . the kind you can reverse the bottom and point it in reverse so when you screw it it pulls apart instead of pulls together. do the separation slowly and gradually, and set the clamps inside the sash where the pane of glass would be. this way you find out if the tenon is stronger enough to take the force, this particularly evident in through tenon's they usually can but some depending on they were maintained may separate , they usually come out well if they have not been pegged. when separated about 3/4 of the length of the tenon clean the tenon well and the shoulder . clamp it together and square it up with a diagonal , check your frame to see how much if the sash is out keeping SLIGHTLY out of square wil help in how much you trim at the meeting rails or top and bottom rails. as far as glue i'm a shill for west system , but gorilla glue works well but you to do a good cleaning job. as afr the joinery goes they usually off set the mortise , another words in directly in the middle of the stile so be careful forceing any of the components it can lead to cracks or separations. again gorilla glue is good for this because it expands and fills any voids or defects. i've done a few of these and so far so good . ......a

   .." I'm working on it"

   
   

   ---

   Edited 4/18/2007 5:25 pm ET by alias

1. 
   Sphere | Apr 19, 2007 01:08am | #5

   All good except for that last part about Gglue.

   Some HISTORICAL restorations are best put back the way they they were, in case of some other fool like me, winds up haveingto fix where the softball went through the glass and I need to take it apart again.

   Please everyone, if ya don't know how to not make it impossible for the next guy, don't do it.  Esp. with antique/historical restorations.Parolee # 40835

1. 
   Pascanale | Apr 19, 2007 04:51am | #9

   Great thought--no Gglue nor epoxy for  me. I'll try using modern hide glue if the joints are good.

   Thanks,

   Pascanale

1. 
   alias | Apr 19, 2007 06:03am | #10

   been through the hide glue , i would go with the pot and mix your own flakes or beads , there a much better quality. there are facts that they have unearthed egyptian furniture and the joinery is still together. although there in an environment that was pretty controlled (pyramids) . i use the gorilla glue / epoxy because of the severity of the damage. i took some things in consideration like weather, the dwelling, if there going to be a a good regimen of maintenance , are there gutters? is dwelling heated? etc. are you going to have to replace any of the componenents, and mix them with existing ? what kind of wood .
   granted the modern day glues E/G are permamnent and throws the idea of what happens down the road. but... i figure i plan these to last another century and i weighed it out . and it seemed to me longevity was the point. the wood would wear out first. i pined over it , believe me . again longevity was my primary concern. slainte' ..k..." I'm working on it"

2. 
   alias | Apr 19, 2007 06:16am | #11

   hey sphere- that's a good point about the softball analogy. i have been building sashes as of late , and the qualty of wood that you get concerns me , and also the paint with the through tenons if the paint fails those tenons are a sponge and there on the clock until the whole system poo's the bed . now i know you can seal the ends but if your going to that why not the joinery . your point is well taken. thinking about it if it was a true historical restoration your step would be the way to go ..... slainte'.." I'm working on it"

   Edited 4/18/2007 11:18 pm ET by alias

2. 
   Pascanale | Apr 19, 2007 04:49am | #8

   I was definitely using reversed bar clamps rather thant the suggested dead blow hammer. But, I didn't think about the potential pinned/pegged joint--thanks for that hint. As for glue, another suggested to be careful how "permanently" I glue this up in case of future needs for repair--good foresight. I'll go with modern day hide glue if the joints are otherwise, in good condition.

   Thanks,

   Pascanale

3. 
   timkline | Apr 19, 2007 02:11am | #6

   why do you need to disassemble the sashes ?

   to remove the stained glass ?

   no removable glass bead ?

    

   carpenter in transition

1. 
   Pascanale | Apr 19, 2007 04:45am | #7

   Exactly. I found no typical DAP33 putty nor a bead holding the glass in. I'm presuming there's a hidden tenon in the joint but otherwise, its a cope and stick.

   I'll press the frame apart with reverse bar clamps, not the dead blow hammer suggested. But the heat/moisture suggestions were what I needed to improve upon.

4. 
   YesMaam27577 | Apr 19, 2007 04:23pm | #13

   Heat may be quite necessary, bube careful with a heat gun -- they produce enough heat to crack glass.

    

    

    

    

   Support our Troops. Bring them home. Now.  And pray that at least some of the buildings in the green zone have flat roofs, with a stairway.