I’m not sure what folder to post this under, so I’ll have a go at it here. Are there any septic experts floating around here (no pun intended)? I’m under the impression that a septic system is designed based on the number of potential occupants and that is determined by the number of bedrooms. If thats the case, would it be safe to assume that no modifications would need to be made to the system to add a powder room to a house? Here is some background. Manufactured log home in south jersey. Build less than 15 years ago. Friend of mine wants a family room addition put on with a powder room. The house is a two bedroom single bath house now and he lives in it alone. He alone will never tax they septic system, but who know what will happen down the line. His question to me is if he should submit plans showing the powder room, or should he just get the addition put on and sneak the powder room in some time down the road. So the question, does a powder room constitute re-engineering a septic system?
Discussion Forum
Discussion Forum
Up Next
Video Shorts
Featured Story
Listeners write in about haunted pipes and building-science tomes, and they ask questions about roof venting and roof leaks.
Featured Video
Highlights
"I have learned so much thanks to the searchable articles on the FHB website. I can confidently say that I expect to be a life-long subscriber." - M.K.
Replies
its base on the number of bedrooms but they count every room, its not 1 bedroom, kitchen, den, family room, game room, room library. Its every room that could be a bedroom. so it be like five bedroom kitchen.
Thats what he is afraid of. A family room could easily be considered a bedroom. Though call here. The Powder room will go in on way or another, it's a matter of if it makes it onto the original set of plans or nor.
Around here the guidlines are based on the number of bedrooms. This makes sense to me because it tends to reflect the number of occupants. You can have as many "powder" rooms as you like.
Scott.
thats what I always though. It doesn't matter how many toilets you have in the house. If you only have one person living there, you can only flush one at a time. And what kind of an idiot would run around the house flushing toilets.
To avoid taxes and having large septic systems, people often label bedrooms by other names on drawings. So any room with a clothes closet is considered a bedroom here. Well not front halls etc, but you get the picture.
Yeah, this one has an exterior door and will be the primary entrance, so it has a coat closet. He isn't trying to avoid higher taxes, but he is trying to avoid having to re-engineer the septic system which will likely cost more than the whole addition.
He wouldn't have a problem here, but it's a strange planet. Good luck.
just get the addition put on and sneak the powder room in some time down the road
Yep, that is what I'd do.
Did my own septic system 40 years ago, still working great, never been pumped, less that 3" of sludge still after 40 years.
PS: 4 folks for 20 or so years on ours, just me and DW now. There is a 4-6" layer of TP cellulose residue on the top every 10 years that I shovel off by hand and put on the garden, anerobic worms and all.
Edited 7/28/2009 6:24 pm ET by junkhound
It depends on your local health department. We had a 1600 sf addition plan shot down (on a 3BR 1600sf house) even though we added no new bedrooms, because the health dept. wanted an entirely new septic installed. We were looking at 15 - 20k, minimum, maybe more.
We scaled down to 800sf of added space, and they eventually approved it after we spent a couple thousand getting new baffles, test ports, a stress test, risers, etc... done with the existing system. Mind you, the existing system worked fine - it was just 30 years old.
Once again, no new bedrooms, only an enlarged kitchen an additional powder room and reconfigured and enlarged interior spaces. The health dept. "professional" we got was a real piece of work - all of the septic people we met with rolled their eyes and sighed when we told them her name...
Many of the folks we worked with said that we could fight it in court and win, but it would probably cost about what a new septic would cost.
good luck,
-t
You are going to have to find out how they interpret and apply those requirements locally.
if I submit a plan with an added room labeled 'Bedroom', it ne3eds the proper septic capacity, but if I label the same room on plans as 'Studio' or 'Sitting Room' or 'Library', it flies through, unless the HO has mentioned at a cocktail party that he is having a new bedroom added, when one of the enforcers is standing there.
I once had a client tell me they were moving the furniture, including bed, into a place before I was finished. I had to write a letter informing her that this was unwise as the final inspection was not yet done and she had claimed this room was to be her art studio.
'course, you know how horny those artists can be.
Welcome to the
Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
like others said... it depends on who controls the design criteria
your state will have specific requirements... here in RI it is determined by the number of "bedrooms".. and that depends on the definition of "bedroom"
ask your local building inspector what the design criteria is for your jurisdictionMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
In NJ it is strictly number of bedrooms, not bathrooms.
A room is going to be identified as a potential bedroom if it has a closet and access to a bathroom. If it *can't* meet code as a bedroom for whatever reason you'd have a pretty strong case that it isn't one I would think. Example - a door from a garage cannot open into a bedroom - so a family room with a closet and nearby bathroom can't be considered a bedroom if it would violate the code (by having a door to the garage).
Jeff
This one is a head banger. He has no intention of using it as a bedroom. It's about a 400 square foot addition. Family room with a powder room, closet, and laundry. The garage is detached, so no luck there. You enter it from the kitchen or from one of two exterior doors. There is no door or separation other than a single 8" elevation change. I think his best option is to leave it off his plans, but I'm not sure how to handle the exhaust fan ducting unless he just retro fits it. Plumbing is no problem because everything will already be there for the laundry.
It would take quite an imagination for a review board to call that a bedroom with two exterior doors and direct access to the kitchen.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Hi msykes,
would it be safe to assume that no modifications would need to be made to the system to add a powder room to a house?
Well some strange trivia to help make some odd point.....around here once your plans are stamped, anything in the world can happen in a basement.....inspector doesn't care if you have 18 bedrooms and 93 bathrooms down there but every room upstairs that contains a closet is counted towards the septic tank.
So whatever you can glean from that good luck.
Personally I'd make a simple call to the planning department and hit 'em with the question......keep it general and don't bother with an address. Something like: Hey, this is Mr. Smith and I've got a nice little manuf. home I want to put a family room on. I'm just south of you out of the city limits on a septic system. My question is, can I put a small powder room in the addition without having to increase my septic system?
If you don't like their answer, make the former powder room a second closet and make sure it always remains a closet hint hint.
Pedro the Mule - Hey why do you think they call it a "water closet"