Replies

1. 
   GoldenWreckedAngle | Mar 10, 2003 10:19pm | #1

   Here's a recent discussion on SIPS.

   http://forums.taunton.com/tp-breaktime/messages?msg=27749.6

   Tons of stuff in the archives. Bottom line, make sure you use a UL certified panel. I like R-Control for reasons posted in the above thread but there are others that are also very good. Would like to hear your experience with them if you choose to use them.

   Good luck,

   Kevin Halliburton

   "One machine can do the work of fifty ordinary men. No machine can do the work of one extraordinary man." -Elbert Hubbard-

2. 
   Bruce | Mar 11, 2003 01:30am | #2

   Haven't used them ... yet ... but do some reading at

   http://www.sipweb.com and http://www.sips.org

   Formerly BEMW at The High Desert Group LLC

1. 
   RonW | Mar 11, 2003 02:05am | #3

   Hi Bruce -

   I'm in the process of finishing off a new workshop building that was built with SIPs. I designed it and it was engineered by Chaleff & Rogers, Architects who did all the panel cut drawings. You can see progress photos of the building at this thread at this discussion group:

   http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=64681&perpage=15&pagenumber=2

   The photos are on page 2 and 3 of the thread.

   The building has been quite warm without heat this winter. When it's cloudy the temperature is two or three degrees above the outside. When we only had poly sheets hanging in the doorways and it was cloudy and windy, the temp was the same inside and out. With the doors in place, it's five to ten degrees warmer. When the Sun is out, it's ten to twenty degrees warmer (this is this winter on Long Island, New York - a really cold winter here).

   With cross ventilation, it's supposed to be very comfortable in the summer; we shall see.

   Cost wise, the structure was a wash vs. stick built. I designed a home for a friend to be built with SIPs, but he chickened out (long story) and built it stick built. It will be about 15% - 20% more expensive for the space and heating costs when he's finished based on his costs so far and on projections on the heating.

   The panels are amazing and my building never ceases to amaze the subs who've worked on it and the visitors that drop in. It's quiet, snug and comfortable and I'm glad we did it this way. If you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask.

   Ron

   Edited 3/10/2003 7:08:45 PM ET by ronw

   Edited 3/10/2003 7:19:21 PM ET by ronw

1. 
   Bruce | Mar 11, 2003 04:23am | #6

   Nice job on the shop ...

   Coupla questions ... whose panels did you use, and did your eletrician do any grumbling about fishing wires?  I guess being a shop, it doesn't have the complexity of the electrical in a home ... maybe that question doesn't appply.Formerly BEMW at The High Desert Group LLC

1. 
   RonW | Mar 11, 2003 04:40am | #8

   Hi Bruce -

   The panels are from Insulspan in Michigan. They were cut by Panel Pros in Keene, New Hampshire and shipped down to us from there. The building was assembled by Peter Germano and his crew.

   The electrical system is not installed yet. On residential work I prefer using a higher, thicker base for most runs and as few inner panel chases as possible.

   We're putting in a wood floor on 2 x 4 sleepers (insulated) and covering the walls with 1/2" ACX ply. The electrical system will be run in EMT on the surface. The building will largely be used for a woodworking and model shop, replacing a shop I'm now renting.

   BTW, it helped a lot (pricewise) to design the building with the most efficient use of the panels always in mind. No real compromises had to be made in terms of the layout but we could have added to the cost with a less conservative design.

   Ron

   Edited 3/10/2003 9:42:41 PM ET by ronw

3. 
   xraypower | Mar 11, 2003 02:40am | #4

   Hi I used R-Control panels on my house and would not hesitate to use them again I would say the cost is a wash too.I used the 6'' wall and needed extension jambs for doors and windows and is  something to consider when using sips.Be glad to answer any questions.

   
   

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   Edited 3/10/2003 7:41:07 PM ET by xray

1. 
   stefs3 | Mar 11, 2003 02:55am | #5

   For what its worth.

   I have been building a log house, on which we are going to use SIPs as the roof.

   A year ago I began trying to work with a Company that provides RControl panels out of Arizona. They were quite difficult to work with. I am presently negotiating with a company in Idaho, Premier panels. We'll see how they do.

   I AM cobvinced that SIPs are the way to go because,, one, they are very strong, 2, they are easy to place, and 3. they provide great insulation.

   So, I'll keep you posted on how this plays out. My greatest concern is they are not the easiest people to work with.

   stef

4. 
   fdampier5 | Mar 11, 2003 04:39am | #7

   I am building a timberframe.. 

     I use Sips as insulation.

      Today it was 3 below when I got home from San Diego.    The 1/2 of the house that is insulated with SIPS doesn't have any heat source, just what escapes from the other part of the house.  It also has 28 foot ceilings.. lots of windows..  it's within 5degrees of the heated part of the house and once I get some weatherstripping on the entryway door and garage it should be evan warmer..

       Wiring isn't a real challenge nor is plumbing.. you just think a little differant..

       I use R- Control because they are so easy to work with and helpfull.

5. 
   GHR | Mar 11, 2003 04:44am | #9

   Moisture is a problem with SIPS. Perhaps it is a problem with all construction.

   And you need to keep the OSB dry. Build fast.

   I got the room built. How do I get outside?
1. 
   fdampier5 | Mar 11, 2003 05:10am | #10

   That's news to me!  R-control said they approved their panels for one year exposure and have had no problem with much longer.  I've been building for a year and a half and the only protection the unused panels got was a blue tarp...

     there is a little difficulty using the OSB splines that R-control sells if they've gotten wet. they swell up.. I solved that by letting them dry and then running them thru the planner to original specs.  Next time I'm gonna cut plywood splines.. much cheaper then buying premade splines.

6. 
   martagon | Mar 11, 2003 05:46am | #11

   Thanks again guys.  Thanks for link to previous discussion.  I can' t believe with all the reading I do here I missed it.  my contractor wasn't familiar with the SIPS, so I'm going to send this stuff on to him.  Sounds like something we should be considering for this construction.

   Let's see.  Frame house with  2x6's.  Apply sheathing. Spray in foam insul.  Apply vapour barrier.  Apply drywall.   Apply rigid insul on exterior to stop thermal bridgeing. Apply vertical strapping for clapboard.  Apply clapboard. 

   OR

   Put up SIPS.  Apply drywall.  Apply clapboard. 

   Hmmmmm.   This choice seems WAY too easy.  Gotta be a catch.   

   One question my contractor had was about the size of the SIPS and the height of the ceiling.  Cause we're doing the addition, the ground floor will be about 8 1/2 ft high,  the 2nd floor about 7 1/2,  so that they will match up to the old house.  How do you hang the second storey floor on to the IPS. 

   Frenchy, you're up here in this damn frozen north aren't you.  Who's your source? This winter is just too long, and too cold this year.

   
   

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   Edited 3/10/2003 10:48:55 PM ET by martagon99

1. 
   GoldenWreckedAngle | Mar 11, 2003 09:14pm | #12

   You can use overhang joist hangers, set the joists on top of the wall and in-fill between them with foam blocks or glue and screw a rim joist at the correct height on the inside of the panel and tie your joists to that. R-control sent me a book of details and a video free of charge. Covers just about everything in detail.Kevin Halliburton

   "One machine can do the work of fifty ordinary men. No machine can do the work of one extraordinary man." -Elbert Hubbard-

2. 
   s_ericks0n | Mar 14, 2003 06:49pm | #13

   I didn't see where you live, but I wanted to use SIPs for a new home in northern Illinois.  I'm convinced that SIPs could be the future of home building, but my experience was disappointing.  First, most local builders don't have experience with SIPs and are reluctant to try.  The one builder who had experience doesn't like them and won't do another.  The biggest frustration; however, is with the SIP manufacturers.  I've talked to several, and none of them have a strong support plan to help consumers get the house built.  They referred me to crews who will travel, but I was not able to get any of them to provide a bid.   If I were running a SIP company, my #1 priority would be making it easy for an owner to get a SIP home built.  I'm curious why they don't have their own crews, or a network of crews that they work with to provide a total solution, not just a component.

   Scott

1. 
   martagon | Mar 15, 2003 06:05am | #14

   Wow, thanks for another perspective.  I'm in S ontario, don't know how common they are here.