What is the best way to sound proof a wall to the outside having French doors and windows to the outside.This is a 6th floor condo w/ a great deal of outside city noise,mostly traffic.The walls are metal studs–6 inch.
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close the doors and windowa with masonry and insulate over that with foam
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No?
How 'bout heavy lined wool tapestries for drapes?
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Double up the doors and windows. One set of Frencies opening in, one set opening out.
Thanks,Dan. I cover that w/ the client. Budd G.
don't overlook pulling off the inside trim and foaming up the gap between the ruff opening and the window or door. works well and is cheap to do
Hey Budd.
If you try it.
Let me know how it works out
I'm cururiousGord
OK, I'll do that. Budd G.
Soundproofing is possible, but you would have to live in a bunker.
Controling sound transmission through light framed walls especially traffic, is nigh impossible. Low level sound reverberates the entire structure, floors, cielings, glass.
Lowering the decible transfer of your exterior walls is possible. There is a sound barrier drywall product made in Seattle called Quietrock. I am not personally familiar with the product as it is not available in Canada.
http://www.quietsolution.com/Products/Construction___Building/QuietRock/quietrock.html
Gord
It depends on how much noise is through the windows versus the walls and holes. There is significant noise reduction in some frequencies with the laminated glass sold mostly for hurricane and security applications. Most window manufacturers offering hurricane glass have data on sound on their Web sites.
Thanks!!!!! Budd G.
There are three words to consider when dealing with sound performance of any material – density, density, density. Then there is a little thing called the Mass Density Equation that applies specifically to sound attenuation:
1. Each time the frequency of a measurement or the mass per unit of a single layer partition is doubled, the transmission loss is increased by 6db.
2. To increase the sound transmission loss of a partition by 12db, at all frequencies, the mass per unit area must be increased by a factor of four.
3. An increase of sound transmission loss to 18db requires that the mass per unit area of the partition be increased by a factor of eight.)…
Windows, doors, walls are all rated as to their ability to deaden or attenuate sound based on something called an STC or Sound Transmission Class. STC is an average of an objects ability to attenuate sound across the entire sound frequency spectrum. STC does not provide specific frequency-deadening information which may be what is needed if you want to block a specific type of unwanted noise; for example traffic noise.
As humans we are born with the ability to hear from approximately 20 to 20,000 hertz. Hertz, or Hz, is how sound frequency is measured. By the time we are teenagers we have generally lost the ability to hear above about 13,000hz which as I remember is something mother always warned us about - "stop or you'll go deaf" - or was it "stop or you'll go blind"? I always get those confused.
Anyway, traffic noise is generally a low frequency sound, and unfortunately, low frequencies are much harder to attenuate (opposite of amplify) or block than are higher frequencies...consider how often you hear the bass sounds from the neighborhood kid's car stereo and not the higher pitch tunes when he is coming down the street.
When considering windows, for example, there are generally three options available for maximum possible sound attenuation.
First is laminated glass.
Second is a wider airspace between the lites.
Third is different thickness lites within the IGU or Insulating Glass Unit.
Fourth would be a combination of all three.
Airport windows, as an example, may have laminated glass on both sides of an IGU in an aluminum frame and with a maximum airspace between the lites. In an airport the primary concern is sound attenuation and energy efficiency is secondary. I mention this because the width of the airspace and the choice of window framing material affects both sound and energy efficiency.
Some folks will suggest triple pane glass for its sound deadening ability, and while triple pane may be a slight improvement over standard double pane at lower frequencies due to the additional density of the extra lite, overall there is no difference in STC rating between triple and double pane provided that the overall airspace between the panes is constant between the two constructions. In other words, consider a triple pane with two 1/4" airspaces and a dual pane with a single 1/2" airspace...both using 1/8" glass...the STC will be identical if the IGU's are the same dimensions.
Using one thicker (3/16") and one thinner (1/16") lite in an IG construction may also help deaden sound because each lite is "transparent" to a different frequency and each lite will then attenuate the frequency that the other lite "passed".
And, as always, the quality of the construction and especially the installation - if dealing with windows and doors - cannot be overstated!
Airport windows, as an example, may have laminated glass on both sides of an IGU in an aluminum frame and with a maximum airspace between the lites. In an airport the primary concern is sound attenuation and energy efficiency is secondary. I mention this because the width of the airspace and the choice of window framing material affects both sound and energy efficiency.
I stayed at the Hyatt that's right in the middle of the DFW airport once. 'amazing windows: you could look outside at a big jet taking off right outside, but barely hear it.
The windows were very thick, and dark, and non-openable.
WOW!b Thanks for the great explanation. Budd G.
Six words: You forgot damping, damping, damping.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
You are absolutely correct, especially since I discussed laminated glass as a possible option.
I probably should have used density (or mass), damping, and stiffness as the three words to consider...good catch!
Yeah, I became aware of the importance of damping when I was testing rubbers for the Air Force.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
*laughing*
There is NO WAY I am touching that one!
Thanks. Think I'll try the really good window manufacturers and get the 2 thicknesses and 1/2" gap/space . Budd G.
Buddgood,
Go for the widest possible airspace that you can fit in the pocket...1/2" is much better than 1/4" for example, but when dealing with sound attenuation getting to a 1" gap may result in a significant improvement.
Obviously a 1" (or greater - even better) gap is not always feasible, but if it is available and if you can fit it in the location then it should make a difference.
I am also reemphasising that TIGHT counts. A loose construction or poor installation will negate any gain in sound blocking performance of the materials involved.
Thanks again Oberon.
Budd,
Others have given good info on the windows. You can make a large impact on the walls by laminating another layer of 5/8" drywall to what is there now, using Green Glue between the layers of drywall. See http://www.audioalloy.com/ for details. This will add both mass and damping to the walls. Both are needed.
Laminated glass acts as a damper on the panes, since the plastic layer is soft and absorbs vibration, like the Green Glue does.
Anal detailing is essential in any acoustic project. Search the archives here; there have been a number of good threads. Let us know how it went after you do it.
Bill
I've received some terrific advice all around and some great web sites to go to. Thanks everyone. Budd G.
Thanks,Bill. When we finish in a month or two,I'll let everyone know the results.Am researching ahead before we actually get to that part of the job. Budd G.