I have a customer interested in putting in a (very) small kitchenette area in his bedroom – almost like the amenities in a hotel room. He mentioned a coffee pot, a small sink and a fridge. Total dimensions will be 6′ wide by 8′ tall.
He gave me a lot of leeway in the design and wants to see what I can propose. If you were to add a small kitchen type counter and cabinets in your bedroom what would you like to see as far as necessities, practicalities, novelties, etc. in this area (taking into account that he doesn’t drink).
thanks
Joe
Replies
It sounds like he is wanting an uber functional space - he can wake up, prep, consume what he needs to, and head out without anyone else getting in the way. When I travel and do gigs out of town having the kitchennet in the bedroom seems brilliant so I can multitask my morning activites and get out the door fast.
You might want to have him give you a walk through of how he expects to use the space. This will give you ideas of what you can use . I would suggest lots of built in and fold out items so the bedroom doesn't look like a kitchen UNTIL it gets deployed. I would also think of niceties like instant hot AND instant cold filtered water. Perhaps a drawer style dishwasher too for those cups and plates.
If he likes to catch up on the news in the morning, perhaps a built in TV/Internet browser terminal that would also be able to be hidden away - unlike the big TV at the foot of the bed - that is right next to where he would sit and drink his coffee.
Rebuilding my home in Cypress, CA
Also a CRX fanatic!
I like the idea of being able to fold everything away. I'm envisioning a standard counter and upper cabs with some kind of drop down panel to cover the counter top when not in use.
If I wanted to use a panel on the front of a fridge, do you have to buy a special fridge or will a standard fridge door work? “The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them.” – Albert Einstein
You might also want to think about waste. If he's brewing coffee, he needs a place to throw away the spent grounds and filter. A waste can in the middle of the floor doesn't cut it for a lot of people.
You might also want to think about waste
With the 6' I have to go accross, I think that would just be enough for a fridge, a garbage can and plumbing for a small sink.“The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them.” – Albert Einstein
I thought you were going to say someone wanted hooks in the ceiling and near the head board. That would be strange.
I've seen these little kitchen areas in Master suites before. Nice idea. Wake up have a little juice, have a little coffee.
Why would that be strange?
i'd like it all behind a pair of doors so i wouldn't have to look at it all the time.
Well, for bases, I'd start with an 18" wide under-counter fridge, and figure on a 15" sink next to that. The coffee maker could then go to either side of the sink on the counter. The very next cabinet after the sink base would be a tip-out trash can (or, more preferably, the Amerock slide-out that uses a standard 28 qt can, and has a nice "aroma" seal around the top). What ever was leftover would be a stack of drawers.
For uppers, I'd just use the double-slot heavy duty shelving tracks fro mthe top of the splash to the ceiling (or bottom of furr down) at 24" O.C. Then, I'd cipher up how many pieces of 12x24 & 12x36 tempered glass to get made up, and figure on about twice as many shelf supports as any first calculation came up with. I'd set mirrors between the standards to finish that wall. I'd find the bets match of wire shelving to the standards and get at least one stick of 12 x 24 to set over the sink as a 'drying' rack.
Nice set of recessed fixtures on a dimmer over the whole shebang, possibly with a small cove outlining the recess to catch strip lighting--maybe, that would depend on how light or dark the rest of the room is.
Oh, and, tres importante, I'd factor a 3" wide filler on the bases, both sides, just in case someone further along wants to put some bifolds across this cusinette.
Doesn't necessarily have to be a closet per se, but should be in a niche of sorts. Generally the hotel style has the fridge occupying part of a base cabinet, with the microwave on top or set high in the base cabinet. But I've never see a setup with a sink as well. (Though maybe I don't frequent sufficiently high-class hotels.)
I think an upper cabinet of some sort would be a good idea, for food/dish storage, even though you don't seem to see this in hotels.
The "dorm" fridges are fairly standard sizes (though there are 2-3 sizes to pick from), but the microwaves aren't. Best not to design things such that only one microwave will fit -- either have adjustable shelves or put the microwave on the counter.
Also plan a place for coffeepot, etc, with outlet appropriately close. If you don't use doors of some type on the whole thing, add some sort of "garage" for the coffee pot to put it out of sight when not in use.
Be sure to allow for good ventillation for the fridge in particular, and a reasonable amount for the microwave (which isn't quite as critical since it's not on for very long). Don't forget to account for pipe interference when planning the cabinet layout. And try to arrange it so that the coffee pot won't be directly under a upper cabinet when in use -- fire hazard and also will cause steam damage to the cabinet.
Keep in mind that outlets near the sink will need to be GFCI protected, possibly including some pre-existing ones. Could get a little sticky since you probably also need an arc detector.
And don't forget storage for trash, and possibly recycling.
Instead of a traditional countertop, you could have an 18" section that folds down in front of a 12" shelf, making a 30" top when down and a concealed nook when up. He's not going to be chopping up watermelons or thawing chickens on this thing, so you can be more flexible with the surface.
A garbage disposal will take care of the coffee grounds, you'll have to ask him if he needs a recycling bin. Heck, he might want a composting tin for the coffee grounds. I don't think a garbage needs to be very big - even small can behind a cabinet would be plenty... but something to control smell would be paramount!
Rebuilding my home in Cypress, CA
Also a CRX fanatic!
Edited 8/21/2006 5:33 pm ET by xxPaulCPxx
Yeah. Other options are a scheme to cover the sink when not in use, and using a sewing machine lift to support the coffee pot or microwave so they're normally hidden below the counter, etc. A slide shelf could also be used for the microwave, to allow it to slide back into a cabinet when not in use. Check out a Rockler catalog for all the stereo/TV/computer goodies that could be adapted here.One problem with the a 12" depth top, though, is that the fridge will be deeper.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
I have seen a few like that. What they have done is to make the kitchen area much like a closet with bi-fold doors. The doors will close off the countertop and appliances, etc.
We do these all the time.....it's usually a foyer between the bedroom and the bath / closet area.
Most of all.......make him be speific...exacting; is a better word. Make him define every whim, and why. It's rather personal so be prepared to discover his complete rigamarow.
Why the fridge, for cream? If so, there are some real cool tiny little fridges that'll fit a carton of 1/2 &1/2 and a couple of juices. In other words, a dorm sized fridge will be huge! Check out restaurant supply houses.
Does he want ice? That's a big deal. Sink to do what? Fill pot? Wash cup. Wash lots of cups? Drawer dishwasher? Does he really need a microwave?
There are a couple of very cool in the wall coffee-expresso machines that you plumb and wire. All he does is load it with a pre-made coffee pouch and put a cup below. Approx. $1,500.00 to 2,500.00 for that unit.
Also, to add to Dan's advice about air.......think a lot about noise. I would have the whole thing go away......with the flip of a door. Also, this guy will appreciate you asking about little TV's, HD or EM radio, places to charge phones and internet access.
These types of projects are a lot of fun....on paper......get every detail now. It'll be a big bummer if you have to retrofit a "new idea" in the middle of the install.
Good luck
We have a client who has such a beast in their bedroom. Wife uses it to make coffee while she primps in the morning. It is identical to a small kitchen setup in a nicer hotel: about 4 feet of counter space, small reach in fridge (for water, cream, whatnot), a few cabinets for storing tea bags, etc.
She doesn't use the space much, but it's a nice touch. Her neighbor is Bon Jovi, so that's the kind of neighborhood...
Joe
I expected something different when I opened this up but since I'm here....
I've worked in a few houses that have had kitchenetts in there master.
The common denominator in all of them was a sink, storage area and a small built in refrig. One of them had a comercial style coffee maker.
I like the idea of this, seams to be a very practical feature in a master suit.
Doug
I scanned the responses but didn't see any mention of the manufactured thing that has this all built together. We installed one in a small appartment. I think it was about 5 feet long - had a sink, range, ref all built in.
Not that this is what he would want, but it would make sense as far as being able to easily keep the option of removing it.
It's my intention to actually build this from scratch. He wants it built in and custom made. I probably could buy some of this from a vendor, but I'm comfortable with making it and the customer is willling to to pay for it.
“The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them.” – Albert Einstein
if he's a bachelor, how about a urinal?
but then again you said he was not a drinker :)
if he's a bachelor, how about a urinal?
Not a bad idea, but a little out of scope. When I was a teenager, my parents had a house with an added-on master suite. The master bath had a small room for the toilet and a urinal. It was nice. Never heard my parents argue about putting the seat down again.“The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them.” – Albert Einstein
it was more of a joke - but if the guy never wanted to leave the bedroom, why not?
J
I'd maybe give some consideration to placing a micro in there as well, you know, for those evenings when you have the urge for some popcorn and dont want to go to the big kitchen.
Doug
now you're talking....popcorn
this thread cracks me up. we were never allowed to have food outside the kitchen/breakfast room/dining room area growing up.
kind of stuck with me.
this has got to be an american thing.
yep, just what i need, the smell of microwave popcorn and toasted coffee grinds in my bedroom when i go down at night.
i have a thing about food odors so every time i am in a new home that has one of those kitchens that opens right into the vaulted "great room" with the cathedral ceiling that balconies into the second floor..........
i think about coming over to visit one night where i prepare a nice meal of blackened salmon, wild rice and boiled red beets.
and i think about how they will be enjoying that blackened salmon smell in the bedrooms for a week or two.
carpenter in transition
I like the idea of the microwave too. I think I'll add that, but I'm running out of room (I'm still trying to figure out where to put the urinal without contaminating the coffee)
How do I handle the small fridge? Do they make a fridge that can handle a mounted panel on the face? Or do I just have a regular cabinet door with a fridge inside?“The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them.” – Albert Einstein
Yes they do make a small refer that will take a panel. I did one once and was looking for the pic's of the place but cant find them right now.
Dont remember the brand but if you dont have any luck finding one let me know, I'm sure I can do a little investigating and come up with the info.
I've also did the built in refrig and thats not a bad look either.
I do recal that on the refrig that took a panel it was obvious to look at it that there was a frig there. Sometimes that's not the most ideal look.
Doug
Yes they do make a small refer that will take a panel
Probably either Wolf or Scotsman, if memory is not failing me (even if Dimension Express is not letting me log in <grrrgrrrgrrr>).
I think the purpose-built under-counter fridges look better without a cabient panel; which is a tad moot if this is covered up when not in use.
Ventilation is actually not so bad, put a braun or panasonic in the furrdown and wire it to the lights.
My recoomendation for shelf standards allows for having an MV on a nice shelf, up out of the way--but still at a nice convenient height (quibbled to the nearest 1" slot).Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
I think the purpose-built under-counter fridges look better without a cabient panel
I agree, its obvious that there is a refer there so your not really hidding it. I guess its probably more a taste issue.
Maybe if Sub-Zero comes out with one like ther 700 series refers then I'd have a change of opinions but until then..........
Ventilation is actually not so bad, put a braun or panasonic in the furrdown and wire it to the lights.
I believe that we put some sort of vent in the toe kick on one that we did, course that was one(refer) that was hidden behind a regular door.
Doug
Edited 8/23/2006 12:26 am ET by DougU
I believe that we put some sort of vent in the toe kick on one that we did, course that was one(refer) that was hidden behind a regular door.
Makes sense, however, I as thinking more of the comment about smelling coffee all night, rather than cooling the fridge (especially as the built-ins generally can accommodate their own ventilation needs (unlike building a dorm fridge or the like in).
Ok, for some reason, I'm now remembering that Monogram had an under-counter ref'r.--24" deep exact, and fitted for wood panel as a matter of course.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
Well they do make a small fridge that takes a panel, but it costs the same as my full size fridge did:
http://tinyurl.com/ldzal
Don't tell your customer. It would be a lot simpler to just move the bed into the kitchen.
No mention yet of a bread box and toaster. Make the front with tambours a bit like a rolltop desk to hide the appliances. Better still make the whole thing look like an armoire.Since the customer is not a drinker, I suppose he wouldn't want a wine fridge, nor a drawer for edible panties.;-)Do you think the shower could do double duty with a spot for a dish rack?
Make the front with tambours a bit like a rolltop desk
I met with the guy tonight and that might be a direction we're going to go. I need to find a way to transition from a 24" bottom cab to a 12" top cab and hide the countertop at the same time. “The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them.” – Albert Einstein
I need to find a way to transition from a 24" bottom cab to a 12" top cab and hide the countertop at the same time.
Might be worth some time googling "tambour suppliers" as there are several out there, in some pretty significant sizes. Many of the suppliers also have track for the tambours, too. Bring the tambour out to 24", and let the counter top edge be the difference. Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
(I'm still trying to figure out where to put the urinal without contaminating the coffee)
Tell them to make yurapeean blend coffee..
As for the rest, check out a place that sells RV parts and service. Dometic brand, (Not a typo. There is no s in the word.), for instance, makes some very good small fridges.
A good heart embiggens even the smallest person.
Here's the idea the guy likes so far. The fridge would go in the doors on the bottom left and a slide out garbage can would go under the sink.
But from my experiece with this guy, it will change a bunch before I'm done.“The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them.” – Albert Einstein
You might want to consider putting TV cabinet style slides on the accordion doors so they can be pushed back into the cabinet.And consider the effect that the steam from the coffee pot will have on the cabinet -- the underside of the top should be moisture-resistant (eg, Formica) at least, and make sure the finish of the back and the door bottoms above can stand up to some moisture.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
Also, I'd consider fixing it up so that the coffee pot and maybe the microwave are on a slide of some sort, so that they can be pulled out 6-12 inches. Otherwise it will be tricky to fill the coffee pot.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
I did the punch list on an addition a month back, it was an in-law type of setup with a bedroom, bath, living space. In the living space in the corner was a simple six foot long counter with cabinets above and below. When I installed the counter, I asked why there was going to be NO sink. And the answer was:
A second kitchen type of sink would define the addition as an apartment, and the local zoning regulations prohibit residential apartments. So ensure you won't have any conflicts with the local building/zoning dept prior to construction.
As an aside, the plumbing was roughed in the cabinet, so who knows what will happen after the CO is received.
"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul." Invictus, by Henley.
they are become'n very common here refer'd to as "morning kitchens" most fit into a recess about 26" deep 42" wide ... never seen one with doors... most are between the bedroom and master bath area....
i'm building 2 into my new place one in the master and one in the guest suite
concrete counter with small ss sink microwave and small fridge...
more for resale than for use... maybe.... strawberries... whipcream.... warm carmel... a few ice cubes....
a guy can dream can't he
p