This used to be my favorite site. It was a place where I could go and share trade secrets with my fellow craftsmen, and perhaps enjoy a little comraderie with people who know what they’re doing and know what their talking about.
But lately it’s been poluted with whiny, neophyte homeowners who happen to have the money for a house, but have no clue how to work on it. I don’t mind someone nicely asking advice, and I think most of us here are open to helping someone who really needs help.
But when some arse who has no problem paying the invoice, but gets an attitude due to his lack of experience and knowledge ( notice I didn’t say ignorance), that’s aggravating, and not the kind of topic I like to see here.
Just because someone is a computer expert, or whatever other professional, does not mean one is qualified to judge how we do our business. They would laugh if we tried to tell them what to do at their jobs.
How about a folder for homeowner inquiries only?
rg
Replies
Here Here
But let me say, If we out number them, if there just arrogant hence uninformed, let us inform them. Their anger or distrust is a reflection more of their limitations then ours. We don't have to respond but when we do a helpful calm response is best.
As a contractor, I run into this attitude often. Unfortunately they justify their stupidity by the fact that we won't work for them or call them back. That's to bad. I am in constant reflection as to my treatment of my fellow man. I want to find the good in everyone and I do. But their are those who will never get it.
Hopefully another HGTV episode will convince a few of them that they can wire 440 or roof a 12/12 pitch roof themselves. Then we can enjoy another Darwin Award story.
Sorry that wasn't nice. Time to go reflect some more.
Edited 8/1/2003 9:13:40 AM ET by Bob
Edited 8/1/2003 9:14:15 AM ET by Bob
As an educated HO who has left the trades and chosen another career path, I take issue with your arrogance and especially with the use of the word stupidity. Unfortunatly it's a two way street brother. The reputation that contractors have and the distrust that HO have for them is unfortunatly VERY deserved and earned.
I give a lot of credit to the few and belive me, VERY few of you who have earned the title of craftsman. I just finished up a $120,000 remodel on my home and the stories I could tell, but I won't. I'm sure some of my contractors have some stories about me that are just as colorful. It always takes two.
I have learned a lot from conversing with the true craftsman here at Breaktime. I have unfortunatly had to print out several of their responses and suggestions and used them to beat my local contractors! As a former tradesman I am forever grateful to the pros here who freely share their knowledge and as you put it "trade secrets" with us lowly stupid HO's. THANK YOU "Boss Hog, CAG, Luka, Piffin, Wrecked Angel, Hasbeen, Theodora, Jencar, and too many others to mention. You will never know the true value of the information you have given me and the agony you have saved me by answering my "stupid HO questions.
Experienced, but still dangerous!
DITTO
A different Bob.
"I have learned a lot from conversing with the true craftsman here at Breaktime... I am forever grateful to the pros here who freely share their knowledge and as you put it "trade secrets" with us lowly stupid HO's. THANK YOU "Boss Hog, CAG, Luka, Piffin, Wrecked Angel, Hasbeen, Theodora, Jencar, and too many others to mention. You will never know the true value of the information you have given me and the agony you have saved me by answering my "stupid HO questions."
Hear Hear! I've been adding a 1200 sq ft addition to my house. Doing most of the work myself, using contractors when I get in over my head. I've asked some dumb questions and got some good advice. more importantly by lurking, I have been better able to figure out when I'm likely to get in over my head.
I thank you all. That HO folder would get pretty massive in a hurry.
An ex-boat builder treading water!
Seems to me that's a pretty arrogant attitude.
Why put the contractors in their own folder, and let the homeowners run the board?
I'd rather let Stevie Wonder wrap my parachute.
what would be the diffents between a contractor and a HO or a concrete contractor and a Cabinet contractor. Its basicaly the same, searching for knowegles, informations, tips. yes I as a HO do not know everything about framing or cabinet but my duties as a tech, I have a lot of knowelge on concrete, soils and foundation. Its not a perfect world. Just because you have private parking under the canopy at HD does make you god. But we as peeons still want to hang we yall. maybe we can learn something by picking up your beer cans behind you.
beside wherever you go we just follow....................
Maybe we can learn something by picking up the beer cans behind you.
Can't we just get along?
Boy am I sorry for saying stupid. I only meant the few and then on both sides. Sometimes trying to be funny doesn't work here.
There are a lot of good customers as there are a lot of good contractors. We all have our stories- GET OVER IT!!
When either side shares there misfortune it sometimes creates a feeding frenzy. Neither side is right about the other. We are all the same.
If I had an education and didn;t date my sister maybe I would be a better contractor. And maybe I wouldn't need this spell checker so often. Wish they had a dumb contractor checker.
And maybe if some of you sought plastic surgery to lower that nose you would get a few of us to show up and work. We might pick up some of our own beer cans.
All this meant to be kind to all, funny ha ha.
No I don't agree to the idea of a seperate folder. I'm new here and I assumed it was all open to Fine Homebuilding lovers. There we should at least be equals and part of a bretheren.
I love you guys.
Enough from me have a great day.
I seem to be on both sides of the fence here. I have learned so much from this forum and, from time to time, something comes up that I can contribute to in some way. I am absolutely amazed at the expertise here, and especially at the willingness of the professional group represented here to disseminate FREE advise to total strangers. And with grace and courtesy most of the time. The true professionals here are straight-up guys, and have been painfully patient with the homeowners.
I'm not a contractor or trade professional, just a seasoned do-it-yourselfer. I can talk tractors, rental unit re-hab, light construction, and fences, farms, and animals. I've just placed a 24 x 32 slab for a workshop / storage building, and you can bet I'll be here with some dumb questions as construction progresses. But you can also bet that I'll be met with professionalism and courtesy.
I'm glad to be a part of all this. I think I've made some friends along the way. Don't be too intense, Ricky - just enjoy. If this were Boss Hog or Piffin or Cag or IMERC posting, I would understand that they might be getting tired of the homeowners here. But they ( and many others with just as much value ) know that they don't have to respond or even read what is posted.
Greg.
I'm assuming this is more than just a troll type thread. So I reply with the following. Ask yourself who's really being "whiney" here. Second, if a neophyte question comes up, that you feel is beneath your station in life, why not just ignore it?
GC
ricky,
I wish to quote from one of my contractor idles Mr. Mike Smith....
bite me......
Darkworks: No Guns No Butter squilla and the bling bling.
Gosh you're right! All of us stupid homeowners should just pack up and go somewhere else!! Maybe spend our time watching Trading Spaces or something. That would leave more space for the contractors who think they know everything to post notes about stupid homeowners who think they know everything.
I think the truly great pros on this site (we all know who they are) are aware that they don't know every last thing in the world, and aren't afraid to admit it.
There's always room for improvement in this board (general note: If you start your post with "I don't have any personal knowledge of this but I think...", save us all time by hitting Delete, not Post) but I think the value of this board is that you get viewpoints from everyone from contractors to homeowners to architects to lawyers.
Pete
I'm a DIY'er who's gotten more from this board than I could ever explain,and I try to give back what I can. Nobody's an expert on everything, we all have something to learn. As far as judgment of "our" work as you put it, well it's a reality that people of all walks of life make misinformed judgements about another's area of expertise every day. I and many others are here because we don't want to make them.
There are bad attitudes is all walks of life. Lumping all HO's into the same group does nothing but illustrate yours.
Mike
Folks, I'm going to close this thread to posting because similar ones in the past have gone downhill.
First, though, let me say that something like half of Fine Homebuilding's readers are not building pros. But just like the pros, these folks read the magazine (and presumably post here) because they care about building houses well. Both pros and non-pros are welcome here. Both need to respect the other.
Recently, my boss told me a profound quote. While I don't know the original source, I'm thinking of adding it to my signature here.
"Usually, the worst thing we can accuse anyone of is our own imagination."
Andy Engel, The Former Accidental Moderator