Typical 1987 Split level. 2×4 walls. Trussed roof.
Question is how to determine for sure if the trusses are bearing on the outside walls making the center wall that the wife wants modified non-load bearing?
The trusses are 5/12 pitch trusses spanning 24 feet from front wall to back wall. No scissor or anything fancy. Frames in 2x4s. The wall separating the kitchen from Living room runs perpendicular to the trusses at the center of the bottom cord. Are all trusses designed to spread the load to the tails? I assume that it is safe to proceed but want to be sure. No loads above other than the roof load.
Replies
Is the center wall continuous from one end of the house to the other, broken up only with doorways? Then my bet is that it is load bearing.
"Put your creed in your deed." Emerson
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
It shouldn't be. If they were using it as load bearing there was no reason to use trusses at all for only a 24' wide house. It is easy to span 12' stick framing. Why would you even think it is?
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My thought is that if there is a continuous wall down thye center of the house, with headers over each door or opening, it's there for a reason. For a 2 floor house I would suspect that wall is there so the second floor joists don't have to be full width, or rated to span the width of the house."Put your creed in your deed." Emerson
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
If you can stick your head up in the attic space and take a photo or two of one truss, then post them, you'll get more accurate answers.
Trusses nowadays are designed to send the roof load to exterior walls. Chances are, your trusses are doing the same. However, over time the house could have settled enough to where that partition is actually carrying a significant load. Pictures would help, and even a floor plan might help. Also, how close is the interior wall to an exterior one? Are there any joints with gusset plates in the bottom chords?
Even if that wall carries a load, alterations to that wall aren't out of the question. What type of alterations are you considering? If anything, we might ask the right questions for Boss.
No gusset plates in bottom chord. The wall that divides the two rooms and runs perpendicular to the bottom chords has one wide doorway (7') opening from the LR into the DR. The wall splits the bottom cord exactly in half (12' on each side) I will try to get a picture this weekend. As for floorplan. Picture a rectangle 24' wide by 22' long. The recatangle is split down the middle of the 24' dimension to make two rooms 12' wide by 22' long. The trusses span the 24' dimension. The truss is of ordinary design. There is a vertical piece from the peak to the bottom cord. Then two angled pieces from the bottom chord to the top chords- 1 one each side. Like an inverted "W"Like I said- I'll try to get a picture this weekend. I thought about checking the opening with a stud finder to see if there is a header in there. And I know that even if it is load bearing, I can do this. But the design (and execution) is MUCH easier for DIY if there is no load to engineer for. Don't want to remove the wall entirely, just open the kitchen to the living room. So I could always design it with a bulkhead and columns for support.Edited 10/30/2008 8:38 pm ET by frontiercc2
Edited 10/30/2008 8:41 pm ET by frontiercc2
It doesn't sound like it is LB. But, just assume that it is for now. If the ceiling isn't textured, just shore it up with temporary studs. There isn't even a reason to get crazy with the fasteners, especially if you use 2x6's. Fasten the top plate ever so often, and shoot a couple of screws in each stud. With a 2x6, 24" spacing would be just fine. Make sure you extend the shoring several feet past the wall that is getting moved. Or, you could go stud by stud, until you get to your header, and shore several trusses past where your header goes. There are many ways to do it, and none of them are that hard. If you like what you do, you might actually have a little fun doing it.
Go wild, 24 feet wide, that wall is just a partition.
Have a good day.
Cliffy
ditto
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Is there a header at the 7 foot opening?
I have a similar layout. No loadbearing by inside walls. Totally freespan. If the attic is used for storage, etc. then bottom chord is beefed up. Does't sound like the attic is used. Designed up a garage where client wanted to use attic. If used it needs to support the junk stored there, and flooring weight and your weight. You don't have a problem pulling your wall. One house with an unused attic that has a lightly framed ceiling (cut roof) was improved considerably by running 3/8 all thread from custom attachment (nuts welded to nailing strap) to similar attachment in ceiling joists. It was just to improve structure because we had to have people up there for additional wiring, etc. Tyr
Without getting someone in there to look at it, just put a header in and you will be safe. If not pay someone to come out and look. It will cost you to pay someone probably the same amount you would spend in material to put a header in.
Joe Carola
If it is a truss, a real and honest to goodness truss, then any of the walls and or partitions below should not be load bearing. A 24'-0" span is not a long span at all for a truss and I can't see any reason for any intermediate supports. Just make sure it is a truss.
I got your email this morning with the picture in it. I created a new profile so I could get in here today and post.
And I have a few questions.
I have never seen a 24' long truss with only one web joint on the bottom chord. The picture you sent me was of a 20' truss, and it's commom with a truss of that span. A 24' truss would typically have webs that looked like a "W".
What kind of live loads for snow do you typically have in Maryland?
Can you take a look in the attic and give me an idea what size plate is on the heel of the truss? (On the end, out at the wall) It will likely be about 3" by 5" or so.
I don't recall ever seing a 24' span roof truss that was NOT designed for a clear span. But stranger things have happened. So hearing what your loading requirements are and the plate size at the heel will give me some clues.
Boss-Just climbed down out of the attic. The trusses do indeed look just like the drawing I sent you. The plate at the center of the bottom chord is 5" by 6". I can't really get out to the eaves to see the heel plate. With the shallow roof pitch, I don't fit.It appears that the bottom chord is continuous, but hard to tell while holding a flashlight and standing on my head. Very dark up there so I could not get a picture~the camera didn't cooperate.The trusses on my recent addition were spec'd for 30psf Live Load for the top chords. The Dead load spec'd on the drawings is 10psf. I assume the trusses in question were designed for the same live and dead loads.
Ron has been banned from the site.
Do what Joe the framer told you, and you can't go wrong!
When in doubt, header it out.............;-)
Joe Carola
Bingo!!!!!!!>G<
Trusses often do not bear on interior partition walls. In California such partition walls must be framed a little shorter than the outside walls or have 1x4 instead of 2x4 for the cap plate. Presumably the same rules apply in most areas.
Can you slide something between the trusses and cap plate of that center wall? If so, it is not bearing any load. If it were load bearing, the truss cords should be toe nailed to the cap plate of the wall, same as the outside walls. If you find truss clips connecting the wall to trusses for lateral stability,
http://www.strongtie.com/products/categories/t_clips.html
then it is definitely not a load bearing wall.