Okay, so here it is- I am about to purchase two new framing nailers for my crew. They’ve begged and pleaded and finally, after some bribes, I have accepted the inevitable. I had two VERY old Hitachi’s and they still work, on days when the sun shines and its 70 degrees with a light wind out of the west/southwest. Which is next to never. These guys, I include myself, are hard on tools and things eventually just go kaput. I have read the reviews but I want the word from people who use these things day in and day out, because they are the best reviwers. So give me your thoughts. Stick, coil, no matter- just light, solid, DEPENDABLE, balanced, able to be fixed relatively easily by the guy who drops it off the 3rd floor deck or the shop, and able to shoot 16 framers all day in the worst conditions for weeks. I just read this and its a lot to ask! Well anyway, I would love to hear about anybody’s faves or stay-away-froms. thanks!
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My own personal favorite is the Hitachi, but I'm no framer
Hopefully Deiselpig or TimUhler will stop by and give their picks as they frame all day everyday.
Deisel has mentioned a speacial magazine for the Hitachi, but I can't find the link for it at the moment.
Not too much to ask at all. I ask the same out of my framer's every day. Get some new Hitachi's bro. Your old ones got you this far... no good reason to change now. I've got 5 or 6 of them in both coil and stick. (Stick or coil is just a matter of preference... we use both). The Hitachi's just work. Period. No frills, no cheesy tricks to break off. All they need is a bit of oil in the morning and maybe a new set of rings every year or so. And as you already know... they take a beating.
The MAX Superframer is a nice gun too, but you'll find it to be slow if you're used to the Hitachis. Same goes for Bostitch IMO. I own one each of those two brands as well.
If you do decide to buy Hitachi's make sure you get the ones with the adjustable depth of drive. They have two models of stick framers, one with ADD and one without. The model #'s are escaping me right now, but for a couple bucks more it's nice to have the adjustment capability.
I do frame for a living and I will just second every thing that diesel pig said in his reply. I have 11 hitachi NR83A's of varying vintages with the oldest just turning 20 years this month. They are rock solid nailers and THE nailer of choice in most of the tracts in lovely sunny So Cal. If I was buying a new one I would get the one with the depth control also. I believe it is model NR83A2.
I gotta put my vote for the Paslode Powermaster Plus.
Now Ive used about every framing gun around EXCEPT the Hitachi but my experience from using other Hitachi tools is that they look alot more comfortable than they feel.
Ive put about 10 years behind Paslodes guns and Ive seen them take some vicious abuse and still come out firing day after day.
Matt
I've been framing for 12 years and have also used lots of different guns and I must say I give my vote to the Paslode. I Also clean and fix my own guns and the Paslode are easy to maintain and work on if need be.
Either Paslode or Hitatchi...depends on if you wanna shoot clip heads or full round heads. Both are tough guns.Jason Pharez Construction
Framing & Exterior Remodeling
Bostich has a new framming gun that is lighter than any other so Ive heard.
Bostich is the only dealer here that will service what they sell and they are doing an out standing job. In my area they are #1 over all and kick butt on their service. If my gun breaks down to day , Ive got a free loaner Monday at no charge while my gun is in their shop. They dont keep anything over a week. Every store stocks Bostich, so here the choice is simple.
Tim
I would go with the Hitachi NR83A2 for a stick nailer or an NV83A2 for coil framer. Testing the nailers, it is just clear that Hitachi is the best designed gun on the market. Max is close, but it shoots too slowly for me and the Makita guns (stick and coil) are very nice guns.
We've switched over to coil framers and wouldn't think about going back to stick. There are very few situations where I'd prefer a stick nailer and I can't even think of them off hand. By the way, the coil Hitachi framers work very well for siding. We shot 7d gavl. coil siding nails with no jamming.
Interesting to here that the MAX framers are "slow". I've had two of the Hitachi NR83's and, being from Cali', that's THE standard (for good reason). The Hitachi's balanced and they are very fast. Since the two guns (Hitachi's) I've owned were stolen and garage-fired I still need to replace it, but finishwork is my main-stay and it's been on the back burner. I LOVE the builds of the MAX guns and was thinking that would be the next buy for a framer-gun. The reveiws have been very favorable on them....BUT after hearing that they act slower than the Hitachi's, I think I'll stick with them....they are a PROVEN winner....for MANY YEARS.
we have two of the Bostich N88 stick with the dual noses so we can switch to connector nails as needed ( we build in a 110 mph zone )
we don't frame as much as tim or brian, but these guns are pretty foolproof and have an easy depth-of-drive adjustment
very light ( titanium ) .. lot's of power for LVL's... and shoot everything from 6d to 16d
i think one is 3 years old and the other about 2Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Mike,
Have you used those guns to shoot a 16d? We did and man alive that kicks differently than 10 or 12ds. Those are huge nails too.
yes.. the 16d was our go-to framing nail until you guys convinced me to drop back to a 10d or 12d
when you were raised on 16's & 8's it's hard to switch..
ok.. now i'm going to let you in on a little secret... i threw all my bump triggers away.. we use only sequential trip... chasing young dudes around on shiner patrol was driving me nuts..
anyways.. the cycle rate is not an issue with usMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Thanks for the more indepth explain in the speed dept.. On the kick item...did either gun (MAX vs. Hitachi) recoil more than the other at all noticably? I'm very familiar with the Hitachi action....wondering on the MAX.
Edited 1/29/2006 6:23 pm ET by zorrosdens
Mike, I don't use the bump fire that frequently even though it's available on our tools. I'm pretty anal about nail location and bump firing does't normally lead to well placed nails.
I guess some of us old guys think alike....
blue
i guess we do.. and more and more every day... so, gues thta means you'll be voting dem in '08 ?Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
so, gues thta means you'll be voting dem in '08
I was as close as I ever have been in 04 and I have a lot to be unhappy with today. If they trot out another plastic moron with poor political skills, they still won't get my vote though!
blue
When we tested stick nailers for JLC, we put the Max at the top of the list. I forget now if it was 1, 2 or 3, but it was in the top 3. We bought one after the test and it has been a very dependable gun. The depth of drive works really well. If I use a Hitachi and then switch over to the Max, that is when the difference in speed is noticeable. Most guys would be very happy with the gun, but I tend to move as quickly as possible when I'm framing (you know, its good cardio :-)) and the Max doesn't cyle as quickly. It's not a problem nailing sheathing, but nailing framing together, like top plates or something where you shoot nails pretty quickly.
The Makita is a good gun as well. Feels really solid and was right up there with Hitachi for speed. I just don't like a rear loading magazine.
The Max trim guns seem really cool. Our trim guy bought the 23ga pinner at JLC LIVE in December. It is like a toy :-)
Tim,
Does the slightly slower speed of the Max guns also apply to their High Pressure Nailers or are they in a totally different category?
No that doesn't apply to the coil nailer (high pressure). Man, now you've got me drooling again :-) There just isn't anything wrong with that gun excepth the lack of belt hook.
I don't know though if that compressor would keep up with all the guns they claim it would. Over at JLC there is a guy, Bjourn, who bought the kit. He goes by the title B.C.&NY or something. You could search "Bjourn high pressure" and find him pretty quick.
Paslode all the way! Mine get dropped on concrete, in the mud and the sand, and they're still right on, for years. I even get those idiots who want to use them to sledge top plates into alignment.
Hitachi's good if you like getting pelted with little bits o' plastic EVERY SINGLE TIME!
Hitachi's good if you like getting pelted with little bits o' plastic EVERY SINGLE TIME!
And paslode's are good if you like clips of nails that fall apart in the rain. Or if you live in an area that allows clipped head nails. Or are too wimpy to handle a little bit of plastic flying around. Or don't shoot coil nails.........
C'mon dude.... both are great guns. You didn't think you could bash a tried and true battle tested classic like the Hitachi 83's and get away with it, did ya? View Image
I have used Senco, Bostich and Paslode. I just bought a new Paslode Powermaster Plus, sure the Bostich is lighter but there is tooooo much plastic (they call it resin impregnated) for my needs. I used a pals Paslode for a few weeks before I decided on mine. I also used offset head nails, no clipped head.
The two new Paslode stick nailers I just bought say Roundrive on the side of the guns and shoot full round headed nails as well as clipped headed nails. Any opinions on the Bostich Coil framing gun seen it at MYNARDS for $250 out the door. Shoots 16d down to 8d I believe.
i use a bostistch coil framer. cant remember the model# but it works ok. the only two drawbacks are you have to switch out the triggers to go from automatic firing to single shot. thats a drawback because no matter how much i pay attention, they still like to double tap. also, ive been having trouble with their ringshank 8d nail heads sheering off for no appearent reason.not alot, maybe 1 per coil but still annoying and with enough frequency to make me wonder about their strength.
Now I should not really get involved in this but ....Hitachi is the guns of choice for all my trim nailers never have any complications with them to me they are the gun of choice as for framing nailers I own a dwalt nailer it spends time in the repair shop and I only frame 2 houses a year and trim the rest of the year ..have a paslode nailer as well I have put about 500 in repairs per year...use a bostitch now and again seem's to be a great gun ..but if I were a hard core framer I think I would buy the Hitachi guns ..just because the are a rock solid and made me lot's of money and put on much trim...
bought a spot nails gun about ten years ago it was about 30 years old when I bought it or older and that gun won't die it is old faithful when you talk about flying plastic you need full on body armour.
A. Here in NC Paslode supplies us with FULL head nail and a slightly modified Powermaster to use them.
B. The paper collations no longer melt in the rain. Maybe some wonder-glue, I dunno.
C. The wuss card isn't gonna work. On the other hand, I did write back pretty quick. Still, if you say you don't mind getting pelted with itty bitty chunks o' plastic, you should try a day with a Paslode. Just try it. The Hitachi will seem Chinese by comparison.
I was just playing around dude. I was just trying to illustrate how silly it sounds to rip on a good tool just cuz it's not the one you like. You don't have to put down a fantastic tool like Hitachi framers to make your favorite choice look better. The Paslode Powermasters speak for themselves as do the Hitachi's. There can be more than one good choice guy.
BTW, nice screen name. ;)View Image
All......SENCO ...801 XP, senco been building them for 50yr's. Anyone know if they are still being built in the U.S. ?
How long did you use the Hitachi NR83A before you switched to Paslode?
Pig, I used Paslodes almost exclusively during my tenure as a framing employee, and I even had a lot of bad luck with some Hitatchi products.
Upon recommendation from Tim, Brian, and others here (and on JLC) I switched to Hitatchi, and I don't regret it a bit. The new models with ADD are so very easy to use and so consistent, and I don't need a wrench to change depths.
If I ever was in a locale that stocked only Paslode eqpt. and nails I would not have a prob going back--they are the best CH guns, IMO. But I wouldn't want to part with the Green guns, either.Jason Pharez Construction
Framing & Exterior Remodeling
I'm a Framing Contractor in the mountains of Utah, warm summers cold winters, does'nt matter the Hitatchi NR 83a is by far the best on the market, also the easiest to get nails for!!
If you really want some new tools get some new hitachis.
If you really want to save some money, get those old ones rebuilt. New o rings will probably make them fire like new.
I've used and abused sencos, paslodes and hitachis. I've tossed out working bostich and hiltis and have used a few others that I didn't like at all.
I buy hitachis for framing. Only hitachis.
I also get all tools serviced free. My service guy trys to sell only tools that he won't have work on much because remember, all service is free.
I like paslode staplers, but the hitachis are more reliable in winter.
Yeah- i've done that-twice now- and i don't think i have the patience for Hitachi's slow as molasses customer service to get their act together. Love the tools, but the cs is the worst! I'm gonna keep the two i have and still use, but it would be nice to have two more to swap in or out so my old ones don't have to work so hard. Checked out the new ones and man have the prices gone up since i bought those. How about Makita's framing nailers- saw one and liked it- light as anything- but only been out a few years.
Why do you need CS for a rebuild? You can buy the O-ring kits online and do it yourself. It's pretty easy even if you've never done it before. Other than a bent magazine, there's not much that can go wrong with the Hitachi stick guns. Maybe a broken driver, but that's pretty much routine maintenence from time to time.
But if you really want new ones, look around some more. I can get Hitachi stick nailers reconditioned for $219 if I'm patient. That's a freaking steal. The reconditioned tools usually look brand new and come with the exact same warranty as new. I always try to buy reconditioned before new with tools. It's a no-brainer. My tools stay shiny for about a day and a half anyway, so why not cut to the chase, right?View Image
Where do you find recons?
I guess I'm lucky. The tool guy fixes everything when he comes to drop off our nails. He can rebuild a Hitachi stick nailer in five or ten minutes.
blue
Blue,
My tool/nail store (NewHampshire Tool Outlet) stocks the reconditioned Hitachi's from time to time. They usually get two or three huge batches a year and they sell out of them in about a week each time.View Image
But if you really want new ones, look around some more. I can get Hitachi stick nailers reconditioned for $219 if I'm patient. That's a freaking steal. The reconditioned tools usually look brand new and come with the exact same warranty as new. I always try to buy reconditioned before new with tools. It's a no-brainer. My tools stay shiny for about a day and a half anyway, so why not cut to the chase, right?
If the my deal on the coil gun hadn't materialized, I might have had you pick me up one of your recon sticks. But I was happy with the $244 price tag on my new Hitachi coil. It should last me years and years.
Saturday I was putting blocking in between ceiling joists. Pop...pop... pop...pop, move on to the next one. For this slow moving muddler, that Hitachi is a kick in the pants.jt8
"Take your life in your own hands, and what happens? A terrible thing: no one to blame." -- Erica Mann Jong
We Use paslode power master nail guns. Also the reson for using the paslode is
We have their cordless nail gun. And it easer to by one type of framing nail.for both guns than a whole of bunch diffrent framing nails.
Max new powerlite???
Anyone used it yet?I do a lot of diving and in shooting the breeze one day we actually had this idea.Pressure is inversely proportionate to volume (air) so, the higher the pressure-the smaller the size of the container for same quantity of air.
higher pressure, smaller piston and expansion chamber=smaller, lighter gun with same if not better power.
Hmmm!! dropped the ball on that one i guessI use a 30 cuft."pony" bottle from diving with Apex regulator to the low pressure primary port(125 psi. output), a second dialable regulator on that port to a 12 ft hose for my pinner and finish guns. Gauge and reg. in a cradle with OMS built "rock cage"nd in a nice rolling cart with tank, nails guns, and hand tools for finish work.
No compressor or hoses running all over the place and no compressor noise. just roll from place to place in the house.You know you want one....he, he, heLand of the boring 4/12 hip roofs...
Edited 2/12/2006 3:33 pm by LEMONJELLO
Hey, La Mon Ja Lo, are you saying you trim without a compressor? All your diving talk confused me....I don't like water.
If so, how long do you go on your 30gallons of air before refilling. How much pressure does your bottle contain?
blue
actually 30 cuft. of air at 3000 psiregulator steps down to 125psi2nd regulator fine tunes for trimwork60-100 psi.Tank lasts a good 3-4, 2500sqft houses with doors, base, crown, window trim etc..-need to be a certified diver for fills
-have a certified regulator tech do the setup+I divemaster for a dive shop so i never pay for fills
!!! I don't recommend for Framing, siding or roofing !!!
(too much volume, causes condensation in the regulator)
I've had this setup for about 7 years and works fine as long as you stick to trim gunsI will post a pic if i can figure out how to make pics smaller for webLand of the boring 4/12 hip roofs...
You're the first guy to pronounce it right !Land of the boring 4/12 hip roofs...