Hello, I have a question on door width, in this situation the hall is 3′-6″, shaped like a “T” with 5 doors in the hall, 3-beds, 1-bath, 1-study. 2 of the bedroom doors are on the 3′-6″ end of the hall. The plan calls for 2′-6″ doors with 3-1/2″ casing. I thought 2′-6″ was a little small for bedroom doors, but if I go to 2′-8″ doors the total width with casing only leaves about 1-1/4″ between the trim and the adjoining wall. I really do not want to reduce trim size, and at the same time would like the 2′-8″ doors. Would this look crowded or is a 2′-6″ door okay for a bedroom?
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"Would this look crowded or is a 2'-6" door okay for a bedroom?"
What are you building, a home, or a museum? It might look crowded, but it's a lot more practical. Faced with similar choices, I'd choose function over form more often than not. Go with the wider door.
2/6 bedroom doors are common on all the homes I have built, lived in, or seen plans of.
On the other hand, I have seen occasions where the casings come closer to the adjoining walls than your 1-1/4". Prepaint the casings, and prepaint the wall sections adjacent the door, to ease the painter's pain later. You won't get smooth final coats in there at finish time, but at least they won't be bare.
During framing, the trim you are using will require at least the width of 2 full studs (1.5 + 1.5 = 3") on each side of a door. So, unless you want to rip the trim, for a door at the end of a hall, a 2-6 door will require 30" + 2" + 6" = 38" and a 2-8 door will require 32" + 2" + 6" = 40". (the 2" is for the jambs). Therefore you can easily fit your 2-8 doors and trim in a 42" wide hall. Disclaimer - here in NC we actually most commonly use 3.25" trim (445), so the rule of thumb is for that size trim. 2-6 bedroom doors are the norm for lower to low-mid priced homes although some of the national builders use 2-6 even on their mid priced homes - mid priced being $450k and I'm not talking NY or Calif. Judging by your screen name - go for the 2-8. One small caveat is that if you have a casing that comes very close to the adjacent perpendicular wall, if the wall is not plumb it will really show. Also, the framer needs to center up the openings on the 42" wall. The 1.25" clearence you site is plenty.
One thing that is missing from your Q is weather you are talking about framed sizes or finished sizes (with sheetrock applied). I was assuming framed sizes.
Edited 8/28/2005 8:54 pm ET by Matt
LOL Matt, Yes I am a Bigman, 6'-3" 290 lbs, and thanks guys for the input, I will use the 2'-8" doors and wide trim.
Good choice - I just helped some friends move in over the weekend, and some of their furniture just made it in through the narrow door openings. Every inch of extra width helps.
Dusty and Lefty, and sore
Use the extra width, you'll know why when you move furniture in. My house has a 2/6 door at the top of the cellar stairs, and three other doors between it and the outside that are 2/8. Well, I didn't catch it until the couch was all the way at the top of the stairs and me wedged behind it, and realized that it fit through the first three but not the fourth. Had to go all the way back down, around the house and up through the back door.
I designed my new house with 3/0 doors everywhere that they were practical (bedrooms, stairs, and even the master bath). Tough for you to retrofit doors to existing construction, but always make them wider than the "minimum".
Yes I am a Bigman
<G>, it's not your dimensions, it's that "must have" (50% off at the antique emporium--see, we saved money) armoire that's 30.675 deep & 40.778 wide and 79.75 tall that just has to go into the room which requires the maximum amout of 90º turns, but has no room for them . . .
Or, it's the bunkbed set that will go in, turned up on one end, but you wind up taking the door, and the trim, and the casings off (and still need a bit of candlewax . . . )
Even if you have to flush the trim to the "capturing" walls, the wider door almost always pays off. I've busted enough knuckles & retrimmed enough doors to almost always specify 3-0 doors for bedrooms. But, that's me. Extending the trim to the wall can help eliminate that tapered wedge of "shoulda been straight" wall that makes the door look like it's hung crooked. This can be a pain, with some styles of trim, but the results can really be worth it.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
On my current job, i designed an extra dormer in so we could have a window large enough for egress and getting sheetrock in to the attic third floor.Then the lady ordered a queen size bed for that room. Won't go around the corner and up the stairs and won't go through the window. I think she's exchanging it for a segmented king size.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
The accessibility issue was the very first thing that came to mind when I started the floor plan for my house. Every floor has a large entrance/exit. Every room has at least a 3/0 opening, with the exception of two bathrooms. The basement is a walkout with a double 3/0 door. The main floor has a 6/0 french inswing and the MBR has a 5/0 french inswing. The second floor doesn't have direct access but is open to the main floor over a balcony, allowing anything up to a grand piano to be moved upstairs. Not that we want that to happen....
I have been asked to help move family and friends more times than I care to think about, and something always gets stuck. It's nice to be able to move a king mattress or a huge armoire into a room without wrecking the trim or the furniture.
Won't go around the corner and up the stairs and won't go through the window
Ugh, bad flashbacks of helping people move . . .
Sofa beds unfolding on the stairs halfway up . . .
LoL! I still have a sofasleeper that would not go up the stairs of the old fourplex . . . Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
In our last house, the interior designers brought in furniture to place so they could "get the feel of it" while chosiong drapes and rugs and paints - all before it was finished - by a long shot. Then they took it all out to storage again.One monster sofa went up over the balcony deck to get in the upper bedroom. The door hadn't been hung yet, but we set that jamb the following monday. The sofa stayed in there through all the painting and carpeting! I hung it from the wall the day teh carpet layers came in.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Even in the grand houses I work on, with 4.5" and wider casings, I often see the casing come closer to the wall corner than that. it has never seemed too tight to me and I have nevedr heard a negative comment on it. Only when the casing needs to be trimmed in the edge of the pattern does it look odd.
Welcome to the
Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
What Piffin said.
1 1/4" ain't small.
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
wife told ya so hunh?
I think everyone else is slipping ...
took someone long enough!
Jeff Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
I got here late.
it's the new politicaly correct BT I tell ya.
"it's the new politicaly correct BT I tell ya"
damn shame too.
this place used to be good for a few laughs ....
Jeff Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
The only problem with narrow reveals is when the walls aren't plumb. A 1 1/4" reveal is fine- when it tapers from 1 1/4" to 7/8" (not that unusual in older homes, or cheap new homes) it looks like crap.
Bob
good point!not that we ever see that kind of thing...;)
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Here in LA, code requires interior doors, except for closet doors, to be 32" or wider. So, go with the wider doors. You'll be set if LA ever expands enough to take over your city. ;-)
-- J.S.
>>
Here in LA, code requires interior doors, except for closet doors, to be 32" or wider.
<<
Does that include bathrooms too? I guess you never know when you are gonna have to move a fridge, washer, or sofa into the necessary room...
While wider doors are nice I see no reason they should be required. Personally, I think 2-6 are adequate for safety purposes on sleeping rooms. 2-0 or 2-4 for bathrooms. That kind of building code does nothing but raise the price of homes such that people with modest incomes will never be able to afford to buy. Between that kind of thing and the extremely long waits for very expensive permits I've heard about in LA, I guess it is just their way of controlling growth. Either that or increase the population of the homeless! My guess for average cost per sq ft of housing in LA would be $400. On the other hand I see no reason why people who sweep floors or cut grass for a living shouldn't live in cardboard boxes or in a 83 Dodge... ;-)
Hi Cap'n;
I represented an architect that had been in business for about 50 years. One day I went in to his office and he was on a walker, had fallen and broken a hip. In the course of conversation, we got to talking about his situation.
He said he would never design another narrow hallway or put another 32" door in a residence again. Seems when he came home from the hospital in the wheelchair, he had a dickens of a time getting around his own place.
I never forgot that. It's too easy to get hurt, and between that and furniture moving, I go for 36" doors every time. Unfortunately, most of us don't get to design it - we just have to put up what somebody else designs and there are a lot of people that feel 32" doors are wide enough. (Why is it that they are never carrying the furniture with me?)
Don
The problem is that it raises the square footage of the home so the buyer not only ends up paying for the wider doors but the square footage to go with it. While in an idea society we would design all private residences to accommodate the maybe 2% of the population who aren't fully mobile, reality is something different.
As far as moving furniture, hire someone... In another thread I just said "everyone thinks they know how to paint (and do a good job)". Moving comes into that category too. The entry to mid level home buyers I deal with often want every pin head sized imperfection out of the interior paint job - which is fine. Then, come move in time, I see a U-haul truck and a bunch of pickups. I'll go back a few weeks later for a punch item and see 30% of the walls in the house dinged up - some badly. Yea.... that makes sense!!
Edited 8/30/2005 7:20 am ET by Matt
As far as moving furniture, hire someone...
I've been a pro mover.
Wasn't that much smarter then as now--still came across some places that needed a miracle instead of a lot of experience as as strong back lifting heavy loads.
The seven foot sofa in the 39" square end of a hall way just sometimes won't go into that room through the 6-8 doorway or through the very elegant 2-0 windows that we don't have a forklift to get to anyway . . .
I much prefered commercial moving to residential.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
Unfortunately, most of us don't get to design it - we just have to put up what somebody else designs and there are a lot of people that feel 32" doors are wide enough.
Yeah, and that 38" wide (framed) hallway, too <ugh>.
The one that dead-ends into three doors (left, right, and center) 20-something feet long, and a 39" square rightangle turn into every one of those doors. Just so incredibly fun to get the rool of carpet into those rooms, too . . .
Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
Not sure what the IRC says, but the old CABO code I built to in NJ and CT required minimum 2/8 doors into all spaces greater than 10 sq. ft., regardless of use. I would assume that the IRC mirrors CABO in this.Andy Engel
Senior editor, Fine Woodworking magazine
An updated profile is a happy profile.
Other people can talk about how to expand the destiny of mankind. I just want to talk about how to fix a motorcycle. I think that what I have to say has more lasting value. --Robert M. Pirsig
None of this matters in geological time.
2-4 for a bathroom is bad.
2-0 is criminal.
Nothing like fighting a doorway to use the can.
Let's see, lead in with a shoulder and twist slightly then wince as you bang your hand on the doorknob.
as Buddha said to the hotdog vendor .... "make me one with everything"
I didn't think your can was that wide, LOL
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
When we in NC used CABO the minimum bedroom door was 2-6. Keep in mind that NC, like many other states, I'm guessing, modifies the model code they adopt. Strangely, once we went to IRC2000 there is no minimum requirement for bedroom door sizes... If I'm wrong on the later, someone tell me the chapter/paragraph number but I'm 95% sure.
That said, I've never built a home with smaller than 2-6 bedroom doors, and further the 2-4 bedroom doors someone mentioned above are ridiculous, but stand my ground that requiring 2-8 for bathrooms and closets is ridiculous over-regulation. So much for affordable housing...
BTW - a few hours ago a street woman came by my job site and asked if she could have the scrap plywood (OSB) out of the trash, and also asked for the nails laying around on the ground... think about it.
Edited 8/30/2005 9:55 pm ET by Matt
Oh, you and I aren't in disagreement about the over-regulation. In fact, I'd argue against residential building codes, period. I think they do little but cause expense and offer false security. It's just more of a slide toward relying on government when we should rely on ourselves.
That said, the cost of a 2/8 door over a 2/6 is minimal.
AndyAndy Engel
Senior editor, Fine Woodworking magazine
An updated profile is a happy profile.
Other people can talk about how to expand the destiny of mankind. I just want to talk about how to fix a motorcycle. I think that what I have to say has more lasting value. --Robert M. Pirsig
None of this matters in geological time.
Matt,
There is a benefit to the larger doors on the closets - it's easier to get to the stuff inside.
I'm with you all on the over regulation, but we created that monster and he ain't going away until the next revolution.
Don
I don't mind putting wide doors on bathrooms. But to put a limit on closet door size also puts a limit on closet size. I see nothing wrong with a door 20" wide if it's on a space that's 16" x 20" and just perfect for stashing a vacuum cleaner. If you can't make a closet out of it, what do you do with that leftover nook?
-- J.S.
does nothing but raise the price of homes such
I want to remember that LA Co "got out in front" on the issue of barrier free/ADA, which can only use a 2-8 door. That's a minimum size, too--far too typical of "good intentions" code.
In real life, barrier free is more than wider doors. A bunch more.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
> Does that include bathrooms too?
As I read the code, yes. I designed mine that way. Having nothing against big doors, I figured why even raise the issue.
-- J.S.
In NJ Fire Code mandates 32" doors for bedrooms, baths, walk-in closets, and anywhere else that you "go through" the doorway.
Moved from a 1955 home (w/ 28" bdrm doors and 24" bath doors) to an 1852 home with 36" doors throughout.just four months ago. Went back to old house last week and hit my elbows twice going through doors. How quickly we adjust.
My elbows recommend 32's min.