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Trying to decide which is the best window for the money
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Replies
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Not Norco.
I have had limited experience with Pella,
but, not Norco.
*the best window for the money is Andersen... but you could do a and get an argument
*Time for the much talked about, and highly resisted... FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTION link.
*I have to say Norco. More bang for yur buck. TLE, what don't you like about NORCO?
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I am making custom 9x5 insulated barn doors that will be 4" thick. Any recommendations for heavy duty hinges or clever process of fabrication?
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What kind of Pella are you talking about. It is my understanding that there are different levels. The Pella Pro which I have a
i little
bit of experience with aren't so hot in my book, but I understand that the higher line Pellas are fine.
Don't know if Norco has different lines or not.
Rich Beckman
*Mark, post that topic elsewheres.
*I have a friend who actually works for Norco. He recently built a home and put Weathershield windows in his house. He told me once that in his opinion he would never use Anderson or Pella windows. He also liked Marvin windows as I recall. You could ask 10 people about windows and get 10 different answers though.
*Every window company I have used, were liked by myself and customer....Andersen, Pella, Marvin, Hurd, Crestline....All still doing their job on my past projects.....Velux skylights too...near the stream,ajps...window selection is part of the budget and design process...Most customers will prefer name or price.
*Out of four buildings that we used Norco windows, three of them needed service work with-in 18 months. Mostly it was fogging between the glass panes, with the occasional gripe about how stiff the double hungs worked.Norco was very prompt about replacing the glazing, but you still need to install them and pacify your customer.I'm about to replace two more glass panels on a dentist office I built 10 years ago ( I have replaced 5 other glass panel in this same building since I built it ). I realize this is way past any reasonable warranty period, but this customer has been very good about reccomending me to other potential clients and I have done a number of other jobs for him.I have come to the point that I will reccomend nothing but Andersen windows. Although you might be paying extra for the name, if there is any future problems, the customer will never think that you tried to use anything but the best window and won't be as likely to hold it against you for the inconvience of warranty work.
*Y'know, George, I think you're right...Sysop?Easterly, Steve
*TLE...( post #4.1).. i gotta agree with you.. after 25 years in the business.. i been left holding the bag so far by marvin, Weathershield, peachtree, and pella..so, i'll sell them anything they want , but i'll give them the benefit of my experience.. i've had Andersen come thru and replace sliding door panels 20 years later, and the distributor handled the whole thing.... measure, order, deliver..all we had to do was install..this on a job , where we didn't do the work.. and they didn't sell the units...but Andersen still took care of it ...Weathershield , to their credit , did take care of problems, but it wasn't in a timely fashion.. so the good will of the warranty replacement was lost in the convoluted process...also, i spent so much time communicating with their distributor, with faxes and diagrams...and the replacements were still wrong, had to be done over... and no compensation for my lost time....the best windows in the world are just junk if you can't get service and satisfaction.....here's one: an old customer of mine has a house facing the ocean... she's had three windows , double -hung, with insulated glass, Andersen.. the inner glass in three windows on the ocean side, have mysteriously broken..., no one in the room, no bats, or birds (they have motion detectors).. the distributor.. a different one thae the other examples, replaced teh sash, no charge, and called Andersen to come have a look...one phone call..i don't know how this will turn out , but they've already gone the extra mile....Andersen is the only one i have confidence in selling where i know i got someone watching my back....
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I have difficulty understanding this! I had Weathershield windows put into my new home 21 years ago. All glass was replaced once and about half was replaced a second time. A couple windows needed repacement a third time before I threw the whole works out and replaced them with Pella. No more fogged windows (so far), no more having to go outside to push windows closed with a broomstick, no more wind whistling through the bedroom, no more cold drafts, etc. We bought the higher level of Pellas -- not the ProLine cheapies. Much higher quality than the Weathershields they replaced.
jim evers
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I had Anderson windows in my last house. In the first 3 years, I had one skylight pane and one casement window pane break (probably just bad luck). Both times I begged an Anderson window rep to order and replace the sash for several weeks to no avail. I finally bought new sashes and replaced them myself. I have never used Anderson windows since. Hard to say if he was just a lousy service rep but once you get a bad taste in your mouth, you never go back.
*Amen brother Jim...
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In the 20 years I was in the retail lumber business, Andersen was hands down the most customer oriented window company to associate with. Back in the 70's Andersen had their "welded" glass and eventually went to their "organic" glass in the early 80's. I've gone back on rotted sashes with both Andersen and Crestline in the earlier days in addition to fogged glass. Pella has 3 main lines of windows 1. Proline 2. Designer Series 3. Architect Series. The Proline series are made about 30 miles from the main plant in Pella, Iowa and have fewer sizes and limited glass options to choose from. The Designer and Architect Series have dozens or glass options, slim-shade options, colors , et.al. My biggest challenge was explaining to consumers about window sweating and relative humidity in the house. My only big gripe with Andersen was the way they shipped extension jambs loose and the need to use their special window stool. Andersen was also one of the last hold-outs on making their double-hung windows [narroline] tilt for cleaning. Alot of people wern't that crazy about viynl grilles either.
*Did a remodel on an older house 8 years ago using INTERNATIONAL WINDOWS -double pane sliding type. No problems as of yet,open/close like new.
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I used Norco windows for years. In the last 2 years, I eased over to Caradco. I replaced too much fogged glass and I do believe that they solved the problems, but I liked the boot glazing available on the Caradco and if you break a glass...it happens...about four screws and easy to replace...no restaining and repainting the sash....I've also used Andersen per customer requests and I do think that it's a nice product but way overpriced.....and Pella just doesn't do anything for me.
Good luck, John
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Anderson, Anderson, Anderson.
*Hey, I'd like to put in a good word for Loewen windows. They are a company out of Canada thatflat out puts Andersen, Pella, Kolbe&Kolbe and Norco to shame--really. Take a look.
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I'll second the Loewen vote. Just put them in a house last week and they are real nice, heavy duty units. It doesn't hurt that I got them for cost, since we don't yet have a distributor in our area. So, the rep cut out the dist's cost. They would have cost the same as a Marvin or Hurd. Plus, they use Douglas Fir while many of the others use Ponderosa Pine. Boy do they look nice.
Matt
*dj... where are you? one of the big yards just picked up Lowens .. how did they compare to say Andersen tilt-wash... clad Units?pricing?
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Does anybody have experience with the Marvin Integrity windows? I kinda like the looks of their jambs. Also, hear that Andersen is buying up several millwork distributors and many smaller lumberyards/home centers will not have access to Andersen windows anymore. Wonder how that will affect the above average service Andersen has provided in the past?
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Scott,
I priced out the Integrity line on the house we put the Loewen windows in. I liked the window, although it's intended to (per Marvin rep) to be a window that will go head to head with Anderson. You don't get many options with the window, which is how they keep the price in check on it. But, it is a good window. I would go with it over a vinyl clad Anderson window any day. I went with Loewen because of a few reasons, one being I got them at the same price as the Integrity's would have cost me.
Matt
*I thought they were a pretty good window and have installed several homes with the Integrity line. My concerns are still interior condensation and the bottom of the window. Hardware is very good. Only knocks are that the selection is limited somewhat by color and sizes and having to special order custom windows to match from Marvin's other lines. My other concern was how to paint the inside and where to stop, again if they have the right color it is fine. But if they have the color you want and sizes too, they are good and very aggressively priced. As for Andersen buying up millwork distributors, that is probably for the good as much as I am familiar with the situation. Some of the millwork distributors are just begging to be bought and run while they can on the recent good times.As for me, my customers drive the decisions, and selling Andersen is always easy, easier than Marvin and with the co-op advertising they put out, it's hard to pull away.Didn't say much about Pella, .......I'm thinking.......Oh let Home Depot, (big boxes) install'em and see if you make any money on that, but I do admire their fortitude on going on the renewal bandwagon.As for any of the above mentioned I wish they would either eliminate or build in a complete weather flashing kit and eliminate the petty bickering that occasionally comes up on warranty. Use a Velum skylight and the flashing kit and never a arguement. And if any one of them would eliminate the veneers that hide and morph the finger joints that telegraph every once in a while and just say what it is and don't pull any fast ones. Is it paint grade or not and we will install it as per spec.......b How about it Window Manufacturers ?...............
*Ment to have Velux instead of Velum, never again us spell check, never, never, never...........
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I am under the impression that the Integrity's sill is a spin off from the sills on Marvin's main line patio door line. The moisture problem on the interior, do you mean condensation on the surface of the window or on the inside the window frame. I know that the Integrity is made of fibreglass and is hollow inside. They do seem competitive with Pella Proline and Crestline Crestclads. At least they don't have the string balances on the jambs. I always use 2x6 exterior walls and just can't get overly motivated about wrestling with the installation of Andersen's loose extention jambs on a 6-9/16 wall. Andersen's post-sale support has always been hard to beat though.
*Are Loewen windows a regional brand window? Unfamiliar with the brand. Scott
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They are out of Canada. Been in business since 1928 or something or other. I learned of them 3-4 yrs ago while attending a Timberframe show. They have reps in the US, but I think this market is still light for them in terms of sales. I think their US office is in Chicago, but again they have reps all across the US. Maybe some of our Canadian BT'ers can tell us more about the brand and it's market share in Canada?
Matt
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FYI: Lowen is advertised in the timber frame publications. Building a home in the Fall and am leaning towards them. Frank
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Matthew - did you say Douglas Fir? That pine is my pet peave with all those wood window companies. Do they have a website?
*Traco, anyone? Used in the Empire State Building, and a few other impressive structures I can't think of right now. Will be installing my first Traco with in a few weeks. Replacement window, will let ya know how it felt. Jeff
*Trimmer Jim, why are you so peeved about the use of doug fir?Curious...blue
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I am a superintendent on a large project using Anderson windows and doors. I have had a problem with the windows sagging which leads to the lock not operating properly. The Anderson rep(Reed Mill work in Washington) tried to fix the problem using a shim under the bottom pivot, this solved the problem on about 75% while leaving a super stiff lock operation on the rest. I have also ran into a problem with the two out swing patio doors that we installed. They continually need to be re-adjusted as the hinges do not have a locking allen nut (all of the in swing units use a locking alien nut to keep the adjustable hinges from moving). Their hardware is easy to install and operates nicely. The hinges and tri point are not available in any finish except greenish zinc. I have also had problems with the vinyl finish being scrachted during the construction process. I prefer the Pella windows and doors, mostly due to the tougher aluminum clading.
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I love Doug Fir. What I don't like is that pine most of the wood window companies use.
*There is a big ad on page 57 in the current "Houses" issue for Loewen. I'm assuming it's the same company. <ahref="http://www.loewen.com/">Loewen Windows
*I wish Andersens were really that good, they are a local company and I've sold them equipment in the past. My own house is full of them and none of the larger pane windows lasted more then 12 years before they fogged over. The rep said that he would stop out, (three diferant reps) Maybe if you buy lots of windows you get the attention you need but as for me, give me decent windows that don't fail over some promise and a warrentee. They are 20 years old now and my view of the lake is snow white unless I open the da** things. I realize that things change but someone really has to convince me that the problem has been corrected and won't occur in the future before I spend money with them.
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Ferenchy,
Other than lumber quality I think there have been major improvements in building materials over the past 20-25 years I have been associated with construction. If your Andersens are 20 years old you may have the older style welded glass. [there isn't a metal strip seperating the glass panes, the Andersen logo will be acid etched in the lower left corner and you will be able to see a "bb" size hole where the dry gas was injected between the panes during manufacturing] I'm fairly certain that Andersen had a "replacement policy" back then rather than a written warranty. Scott
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Trying to decide which is the best window for the money