Take a look first (I didn’t include the pics in this message ’cause some folks still have dial up.)
Answer comes in the next message. BTW, this is in a basement. The house was originally all-electric. Img_0129sgr.jpg is an overview of the installation
Img_0120sg.jpg a close up next at the draft bonnet
IMG_0001sg.jpg is how the unit looks in the “showroom.”
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You might be tripped up by the easy apparent answer: "you can't side vent a natural ("atmospheric") gas appliance through a side wall."
Or maybe you fell for "you can't vent an atmospheric gas appliance through a plastic vent because the (measured 550 degree flue gases are a tad too hot for the plastic designed for maybe a couple of hundred.")
Sharp folks might mention the lack of an inspection sticker, but actual inspection of water heater installations is rare in these parts.
The melted plastic? Well shoot, who really cares if those 550 degree flue gases backdraft into the house?
Nope: the real problem is that the installer for the big box store (who shall go unnamed - the owners' parents who were there might have been wrong about who installed it a couple of weeks ago) didn't put his company's sticker on the unit so all the world could assess the quality of his work.
For the record, I turned that sucker off.
(BTW, I stopped by that big box today and at least the plumbing specialist on the floor knew the that the installation was all wrong.)
Edited 6/18/2005 12:42 pm ET by Bob Walker
sposed to have a certain amount of copper coming off the water heater,dont remember how much
at least here that is
In the US, or your new home, Canada?
Wd, luv ya, but leave it in the tavern - give him all the hell ya want there -
"there's enough for everyone"
Sorry...just couldn't resist!
OK. I'm not a plumber, but I'll bite: Water connections should both be flex, The flue for the gas should exit the structure. The 3rd photo looks like somebody hacked the plastic flange....?
Water pipe connection rules vary: in my area flex is OK at the tank, as well as solid copper.No plastic, though, for 18"As you see, the flue issues were what I was focusing on.I'd say this is the second most dangerous water heater installation I've ever seen. The worst was a gas water heater with no flue, but an open basement window for "venting"
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Sojourners: Christians for Justice and Peace
About a year ago I was installing a deck and a truck and trailer showed up at the home. Guy gets out with a helper and a water heater. I ask if I can help him he shows me a work order to install the water heater from Lowes. I was a little disapointed as we install water heaters but ok, here is the basement entrance.
Guy is gone in an hour. I'm impressed as I consider myself a good, quick installer and an hour is pretty good. Being nosey I go down and check it out. No permit, no inspection, no required pressure tank, no valves, no di-electic unions or nipples (required here) and no pipe running to the ground from the T&P valve.
I shop at Lowes, know most of the people there. I go to the contracted labor area and tell them. They turn pale. Start hustling the phones to find another guy. Say they won't use the "new" guy again. I tell the homeowner what I found and did. They thank me and sheepishly admit the reason they didn't ask me is they needed to use their Lowes card so they could pay me. Nice I guess since I got paid but man what a possible liability. DanT
So is notching of the bottom of the joist to clear the flue pipe an issue?
You don't show a picture ... was the t&p ok?
And specifically what was wrong with the flue?
I'm sorry, I thought you wanted it done the right way.
A natural (atmospheric) draft water heater has to have metal flue - that plastic stiuff is only allowed where the flue gases have been significantly diluted with room air and thus cooled way dow.I hadn't thought aboput the clearance issue - with a gas appliance designed for plastic flues, there is no required clearance.I suspect the plastic flue would melt long before the wood would catch fire, however.The minor notching of the joist (especially so close to the foundation) won't cause any problems.
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Sojourners: Christians for Justice and Peace
"A natural (atmospheric) draft water heater has to have metal flue - that plastic stiuff is only allowed where the flue gases have been significantly diluted with room air and thus cooled way dow."I could not tell, but that appeared to be a clear plastic flex with is kind of "heavy duty" used for dust collection systems. And not the light weight white plastic flex dryer vent.But in any case is any flex plastic approved, even for low temp appliance venting (ie, where PVC duct is approved)?
>>I could not tell, but that appeared to be a clear plastic flex with is kind of "heavy duty" used for dust collection systems. And not the light weight white plastic flex dryer vent.>>But in any case is any flex plastic approved, even for low temp appliance venting (ie, where PVC duct is approved)?It's a black plastic flex which I see on most side draft water heater installations in my area, and have been told by building officials is approved for some appliances because of the low temps of the diluted flue gases.Manufactuirers are now specing schedule 40.
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Sojourners: Christians for Justice and Peace
Hard to tell from the picture, but it looks like they have that gas pipe sprung over as well. Wonder what the force on the pipe is doing to the gas valve?