I think I have mentioned before that 4 contractors and I get together fore cdiner on a reg basis where we discuss work issues and exchange contstruction ideas. It’s kinda like a Live BreakTime.
Anyways, last night was a dinner and only 3 of us were there – heavy work loads and GF/wife kept 2 from being available. Main discussion was wage earners and employer’s responsibilities. In a nutshell:
1. Employers expect employees to be avaiable for a min of 8+hrs/ day.
2. Employees expect to be paid for these hours.
Q. What happens when there is only 6-7 hrs that day? Does the Employee get paid for the other time to make 8 hrs? He/ she did dedicate 8 hrs of their day to the Boss/ job.
Q. At the end of the week, if 40hrs (hrs/day) were not acrued, and there is work to be done on Sat. is that overtime or reg pay shedule?
Q. Do you find workers will be more likely to do Sat work if it is a full days or a 1/2 days work?
Q. If the Employer pays for 40hrs even when this in not achieved due to scheduling or Client issues then why isn’t the Employee a sarary worker?
I see the up side for the Employee to remain a wage earner, if 40hrs are guarenteed and time over 40 is compensated, but what’s in it for the Employer? This is what I get caught on. I think an employer should pay for 40hrs if it is not the worker’s fault that the 40 cannot be realized. I have a loose agreement with my guys that they get 40 regardless of if they work less, however there are a few days where we work 9 hrs. This is still calculated as 8 unless it happens frequently. Sat. time is ALWAYS overtime pay.
Comments?
Frankie
Replies
Q. What happens when there is only 6-7 hrs that day? Does the Employee get paid for the other time to make 8 hrs? He/ she did dedicate 8 hrs of their day to the Boss/ job.
Depends on whether the employee is hourly or not, under DoL rules--or, whatever policy the employer makes.
Q. At the end of the week, if 40hrs (hrs/day) were not acrued, and there is work to be done on Sat. is that overtime or reg pay shedule?
DoL says, for "non exempt" hourly employees, o/t starts after hour 40, not day after Friday. An Employer can make a different policy, as long as it is more "generous" than DoL. A good written policy is definitely to a business owner's advantage. Suppose a contractor had a 4x9+4 work week. Technically, every hour after lunch on the four-hour day is O/T, even though it's still "friday" (if that's the 4 hour day).
Q. Do you find workers will be more likely to do Sat work if it is a full days or a 1/2 days work?
Hard call. When I was "non exempt" and it was ashort week (rainouts or whatever), a whole day could be better. While "exempt," I almost always wanted a Saturday to be as short as possible. It can be really hard to schedule Saturdays. Without a lot of warning (like on Monday), there's a perfectly natural inclination for people to plan for their personal lives on their "personal" days. As an employer, you are bound to make "reasonable accomodations" when ever you deviate from a 'normal' schedule (note, the DoL guidelines often have more in common with factory or office work, than work outdoors in weather, during seasons, etc.)
Q. If the Employer pays for 40hrs even when this in not achieved due to scheduling or Client issues then why isn't the Employee a sarary worker?
Back to DoL rules. An Employer who always pays 40 hours as policy, even to hourly, non-exempt, emplyees, will still "owe" for o/t if thode employees then work more than 40 hours in a week. Salaried employees (both exempt and non-exempt) have fairly specific definitions under DoL.
Please define exempt vs non-exempt employees, both of whom are hourly.Last night we compared, say framers to say sheetrockers. Framers are affected by weather whereas sheetrockers, not so much. A framer wakes up and knows if they are working that day once they see the weather report. Sheetrocker doesn't have that determinate. Framer also knows that if work shuts down early due to weather, they will be working longer hours within the next few days to make-up for it. Sheetrockers, due to Client or building working hour restrictions do not have this option.Then another point was brought up. Here in the Big City, many of the luxury apt bldgs have restricted hour for work. I have been in a few where the work day (noise) was from 10 - 4. EVERY workman had to be OUT of the bldg by 4, no exceptions. Figuring 1/2hr for lunch, that is a 5 1/2 hr workday, 27 1/2 hr work week. I budget the job at a rate where 27 12 hrs = 40 hrs and pay my guys for 40. Otherwise, in a job that lasts 6 - 9 months, I would loose all my guys within the first 2 weeks (payroll turn around time + job seeking time). These are rules set by the bldg board so they get to pay the true cost of doing business.This is a point where we became conflicted. If the Client (et al) creates an abreviated workday, they pay a premium. However, if the employer creates the abriviated workday, due to poor organization or maybe it costs him/ her too much to shuttle everyone to another job and start up again so the workers are sent home, why should the workers carry the brunt of the raminfications?I know this has been discussed before. I remembered another thread while driving to work. However I still have concerns. Sure, this can simply be dismissed that anyone can do whatever they want as long as it is within the law, but I don't want that to be the determinant. That's the minimum rule. I want to know what is the "norm", cost effective, or proper standard to maximize employee retention and good spirits while still making an appropriate pofit.More to think about.Frankie
Experiment with the placing of the ingredients on the plate. Try the mozzarella on the left, the tomato in the middle, the avocado on the right. Have fun. Then decide it goes tomato, mozzarella, avocado. Anything else looks stupid.
Richard E. Grant as Simon Marchmont - Posh Nosh
"Please define exempt vs non-exempt employees, both of whom are hourly."I don't think that you can have hourly paid employess that are excempt.http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/compliance/whd/fairpay/fs17a_overview.htmThere are other exceptions, but I think that these would be the most common."Executive ExemptionTo qualify for the executive employee exemption, all of the following tests must be met: * The employee must be compensated on a salary basis (as defined in the regulations) at a rate not less than $455 per week;
* The employee’s primary duty must be managing the enterprise, or managing a customarily recognized department or subdivision of the enterprise;
* The employee must customarily and regularly direct the work of at least two or more other full-time employees or their equivalent; and
* The employee must have the authority to hire or fire other employees, or the employee’s suggestions and recommendations as to the hiring, firing, advancement, promotion or any other change of status of other employees must be given particular weight.Administrative ExemptionTo qualify for the administrative employee exemption, all of the following tests must be met: * The employee must be compensated on a salary or fee basis (as defined in the regulations) at a rate not less than $455 per week;
* The employee’s primary duty must be the performance of office or non-manual work directly related to the management or general business operations of the employer or the employer’s customers; and
* The employee’s primary duty includes the exercise of discretion and independent judgment with respect to matters of significance."As to your other questions. The "law" is that you pay for the hours worked (and including time to get ready and shut down), PERIOD.It does not matter why the don't work. If they don't you don't have to pay.Now as an employer you can provide any additional payments that you feel that you need to maintain a good employee.
"I don't think that you can have hourly paid employess that are excempt"I think what constitutes hourly vs. salary is clear as mud.worked for Uncle Sam as a GS (there are also wage grade and SES)Pay is set per Annum, but paid hourly based on a 2087 hour year.all your time was charged to regular, leave (vacation or sick) or leave-wothout-pay. first 2 you got payed for, 3rd no.then you were also exempt or non-exempt, IIRC GS5 and below were requird to get overtime, above that you can get overtime, if directed, but you were allowed to volenteer your time so you weren't payed.so everyone in one sense up to grade GS-15 (perk was equivaleent to full Colonel) was paid hourly, but some are "allowed" to volenteer their time. All directed oT was required to be authorized on a form In the AF.I'm not familar enough with wage grade and SES to comment
bobl Volo, non valeo
Baloney detecter WFR
"The "law" is that you pay for the hours worked (and including time to get ready and shut down)."So, as far as the law is concerned - the Employer must pay for the time for the workers to change into their work clothes and ALSO to wash-up and change back into street clothes?I ask that they be ready to work at 8AM and be ready to go home at 4:30PM. I pay for one change. I do pay for site set-up.Time paid includes two 15 minute breaks. 1/2 hour for lunch is unpaid. Does any/ everyone pay for the manditory company 15 min breaks? Frankie
Experiment with the placing of the ingredients on the plate. Try the mozzarella on the left, the tomato in the middle, the avocado on the right. Have fun. Then decide it goes tomato, mozzarella, avocado. Anything else looks stupid.
Richard E. Grant as Simon Marchmont - Posh Nosh
Does any/ everyone pay for the manditory company 15 min breaks?
Explain that would ya please.
I dont think breaks are manditory unless you do repetative work such as assembly line work, may very from state to state, but I'm currious about your comment.
Doug
“I want to know what is the "norm", cost effective, or proper standard to maximize employee retention and good spirits while still making an appropriate pofit.â€
Okay, here goes.
Q. What happens when there is only 6-7 hrs that day? Does the Employee get paid for the other time to make 8 hrs? He/she did dedicate 8 hrs of their day to the boss/job.
I beg to differ. He/she planned on dedicating 8 hrs of their day to the boss/job. The “norm†is the employee gets paid as long as he’s kept on site. If he’s sent home due to weather conditions, generally that’s tough! If he’s paid a decent wage to begin with, he won’t go anywhere. However, if there are a drastic amount of rain days, you’ll have to find a way to keep him busy. That’s “employee retention.â€
Under the aforementioned conditions, the best schedule for outdoor work is 4 10-hour days. If it rains Monday thru Thursday, 8-10 hours of it can be made up on Friday. The one problem with this schedule is that some employees will expect to be paid overtime for anything over 8 hours. That’s not law, but it is a union standard. Whether your union or not (I’m guessing your not), it would be a good idea to get feedback from your employees before you enforce such a schedule.
Q. At the end of the week, if 40hrs (hrs/day) were not accrued, and there is work to be done on Sat. is that overtime or reg. pay schedule?
Saturdays are more often thought of as overtime than days over 8 hours. In the union, Saturday is always overtime pay (time-and-a-half), and Sundays are double time. According to law, anything over 40 hours inside a 7 day period is overtime or time-and-a-half. Where I live, non-union contractors don’t even follow the law. Non-union contractors pay straight time-all the time.
Q. Do you find workers will be more likely to do Sat work if it is a full days or a 1/2 days work?
This is complicated. It depends on these 3 things in descending order:
(1) How busy their personal schedule is.
(2) Whether and when any additional tax bracket will affect them.
(3) How far they have to drive to work.
Q. If the employer pays for 40 hrs even when this in not achieved due to scheduling or client issues, then why isn't the employee a salary worker?
I note you said: “I have a loose agreement with my guys that they get 40 regardless of if they work less, however there are a few days where we work 9 hrs. This is still calculated as 8 unless it happens frequently.â€
I don’t want to make waves, but that wouldn’t fly with me. If I felt the trade off was unfair, even slightly, I’d be gone. I wouldn’t even give you a phone call. Even if the trade off was fair, I’d still probably be gone, simply because I wouldn’t want the burden of keeping track of the hours to be sure of it. I’ve always put in an honest days work, and I’ve always expected my employers to be honest with my wages.
To make this salary arrangement work for me, it would have to be much more than a “loose agreement.†It would have to be something that was clearly fair, and that was clearly spelled out in writing. I think that some of your guys are probably upset with you right now about this, although they’re probably to afraid to admit it.
I think it’s commendable that you’re taking the time to consider your employee’s welfare.-T
" I don’t want to make waves, but that wouldn’t fly with me. If I felt the trade off was unfair, even slightly, I’d be gone. "My guess is you would be gone if the Boss didn't provide you with 40 hrs/ wk within what is permissable by nature. Jobs like the ones which only permit 5 1/2 hrs a day wouldn't even register on your radar. That's cool.But for some GCs, this 5 1/2hr day is a reality. It's something we HAVE to deal with. Paying for a full day is the only way to maintain the employee retention you mentioned.But hey, as much as most of fellow BT'ers may think so, I am NOT perfect. (HA!) I screw-up and forget to bring a key or think something will take longer and therefore do not schedule anything else that day or the supply house does not have the material we need. Is it fair for the Company/ Boss to pass that misfortune/ poor scheduling onto the the worker to bare? I don't think YOU would tolerate that.As for my rule regarding making up hours - time paid for but not worked accrues only for 2 weeks MAX, and it is only for working upto 1 hour beyond normal hours. I would never ask someone to repay time I gave them 4 months ago. Very NOT cool. I keep this to a minimum and try my best, when I use it to do it by half. If you got off 2 hours early on Monday, on Wed I may ask you to work a 9th hour. If you have a prior commitment, that's understandable. If you ALWAYS have a prior commitment, then we can go to a different accounting of hours. The knive has to cut both ways.BTW - I think my guys would tell me if they felt something isn't fair. They have in the past, though they might wait a few weeks - but by then it shows in their spirit and I call them on it.Thank you for your input. It has gotten me thinking even more.Frankie
Experiment with the placing of the ingredients on the plate. Try the mozzarella on the left, the tomato in the middle, the avocado on the right. Have fun. Then decide it goes tomato, mozzarella, avocado. Anything else looks stupid.
Richard E. Grant as Simon Marchmont - Posh Nosh
Please define exempt vs non-exempt employees, both of whom are hourly.
DoL (US Dept of Labor) defines four categories of employees.
Hourly, Non exempt (from o/t)
Hourly, Exempt
Salaried, Non exempt
Salaried, exempt
The first, and the last, on that list are the most common, by far "pay" schemes out there, and probably equally violated in the rule as in the main as not.
An Hourly, Exempt employee can make up tp 40 hours per week, but no more. This is an interesting category of employee status, which could have more application--if it were used. Certain sorts of supervisor roles would work, if the compensation per hour were sufficient for the employee. Some sorts of p/t work also would seem apt.
Salaried, Non Exempt, seems an odd duck. Particularly given how one would cipher o/t. But, if an employer had some positions for which Salaried, Exempt, was not permitted, it would make sense.
Now, the fact that DoL has made rules has almost nothing to do with how employers actually act (sad to say). This probably allows as much bad behaviour by employers as is prohibited to 'good' ones--that'life; tough on the folk in bad jobs, too.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
if we show up we get 2. if it rainout everybody get 4 (they will stay till 11) boss gives alot og vacation so everybody will get a 40 somehow. nothing to do, sweep floors, wash truck, keep busy. BUT if you have three days riding the clock and then weekend overtime job comes in. its free. nobody can make over 40 when vacation time is used.
frankie...i agree with journeyman..
if there is one thing employees know how to do , it's how to tell time
<<<I want to know what is the "norm", cost effective, or proper standard to maximize employee retention and good spirits while still making an appropriate pofit.>>>
our policy ( unwritten, but well known ) is "show up" unless the weather is so bad it's obvious we are not going to accomplish anything
once we show up , if it's raining and we can't do what i want to accomplish, we usually go to a diner for breakfast and a "safety meeting " ( tailgate talk )... by the time breakfast is over, we can make a good decision wether to go to wrok or go home.. i pay for the show up , the breakfast and the downtime..
we work 7 - 3:30... if breakfast safety meeting gets done at 9 and we call it aday... they get paid from 7 - 9
if we go to work , they get paid for the hours they work.
40 hours straight time and time & a half for anything over 40.
i don't like to schedule saturday work... i don't think it's productive adn i don't think it helps with retention and morale..
i work most saturdays.. but mostly in the office... i need those saturdays without the guys around just to play catch-up..
i figure our production based on paying for 2000 hours / man / year
but only 1600 of those are productive hours... the other 400 are downtime that i pay for .. safety meetings, lost time, tool maintenance, travel, etc...
once the job is started the clock moves to the job.... they start at the job and finish at the job
i have found that "comp time" is never a good policy... either they are on my clock and getting paid or they are notMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
The thing I learned about those rain days way back when:
When the tools are already rolled out and you decide to to wait and see if it will clear...... it will keep raining....if you roll up..... it will clear up about the time you get in the truck. Probably not altogether true, but it sure seemed like these things happened on a lot of occasions.
If employee is a full time employee, then he's entitled to 40 hours pay. If you don't use him for 40 hours, that's employer's problem, not employees.
If employee does not make himself available to work for the 40 hours, then it's his fault and he loses each hour he doesn't make himself available.
If he's short, he should make it up on Saturday. If he's got something better to do, maybe he'll be happy with one a half rather than full day. But most would prefer to work a full day if they have to work at all. If working Saturday is not part of the normal work week, then it's employees choice. If it is part of the deal, then he works if you need him to work. If he's already got his 4o done for the week, then he's on OT and you decide if you really need him that badly.
SHG
For every complex problem, there is a solution that is clear, simple, and wrong.
-H.L. Mencken
If employee is a full time employee, then he's entitled to 40 hours pay. If you don't use him for 40 hours, that's employer's problem, not employees.
Please say that is not a legal opinion.SamT
Please say that is not a legal opinion.
of course not. those you gotta pay for. :-)
O. Well. . .
In that case. . .
s.
You numbskull! Whaddaya tryin' to do?
Get us all in trouble?
Why. . .I oughter. . .
Everybody knows there ain't nobody what's "Entitled" to no 40 hour week.SamT
yeah, yeah, yeah. poor choice of words. so sue me.
When working as a lead for larger contractors I suggest to the younger carps that the first time a contractor can't keep the carps busy for 40 hours a week it's time to move on to someone else. Less than 40 hours is about as good as a short term layoff.
At least with the better outfits, 50 hours a week is the norm--5 days x 10 hrs. The money is good, it lets every keep 2 day weekends, and a lot gets done without having to slow down the pace.
Saturday or any weekend work seems to be good as an optional thing. That way the carps with more energy and less of a personal life can make a few extra bucks. If we're working 5 tens, it takes someone with lots of energy to work more.
We've never had to figure out the nit picking details of short days and whatnot. Work a bunch, pay overtime every week and be done with it.
As a multi-purpose carpenter, if it's raining there are always indoor projects, tool repairs, preplaning for upcoming projects, reading for upcoming projects, making jigs and whatnot for upcoming projects, etc. If our contractor can't keep us busy he should be farming us out temporarily to other contractors with inside work, or we'll find the guys who are better planners and work for them.
Maybe this is easier working in a climate that doesn't have a great deal of rain, but there are usually a large number of things that can be done in the rain. Heck, in some places if you can't work in the rain nothing would ever get done. Invest in some rain gear.
Cheers
I only get paid for hours worked. If the day is done at 4.5 hours, then that is what I get paid for.
Yes, I believe if I go to the jobsite, then I am entitled to a full days pay. Reality usually doesn't work out that way. I understand that there may not be enough hours in the job to pay me even if something else on the job doesn't allow me to keep working.
There is a difference between an employer that tries to schedule things on a job in an attempt to short me hours and things that just happen (like weather or delivery problems or site changes). I have worked for two employers that made every effort to short me hours on a job that is being billed out for 8 or more hours (smart employees can figure this out- really). I no longer work there.
I worked for one employer where the foreman encouraged 9+ hours of work for 8 hours pay. When I took over a residential tract project, I myself put in some 10+ hour days for 8 hours of pay. I did not like it, but it beat 0 hours because the job market was tight. I left (with help because I did not "give" enough time) but something better came along.
If I have downtime that I am being paid for, I make an effort to remember that if I need to stay the 15 minutes or so that it takes to wrap things up- it is a two way street.
My Saturdays are time and a half irregardless of hours worked during the week. I would prefer a full 8 hours, but tax wise, 6 works out just fine. I have done crane and chopper lifts that were 4 or less hours. No, I do not like to get to the site early and get less than 8 hours, but if you get pissy about it, you usually don't get any of it in the future. If I really do not want to work it, then a little white lie about previous commitments does the trick- unless I KNOW that I MUST be there to get the job done. If it is my job, then I need to be there.
Union carpenters, roofers and masons here have a Saturday make up day if a weekday gets rained out- no OT pay.
If you treat your employees fairly, then they will most likely do the same. Some employees will screw the boss under any circumstances.
If you screw them, it will cost you more than you will know.
1. Employers expect employees to be avaiable for a min of 8+hrs/ day.
Not necessarily. Guys that have worked for me will often show up and say, hey is it OK if I leave at 2:00 to go do.... which is generally OK with me. I try to encourage them to give me advance notice, but one thing I offer is flexibility. Life is not all about working... hopefully.
2. Employees expect to be paid for these hours.
I pay for hours worked, only. Not more not less.
Q. What happens when there is only 6-7 hrs that day? Does the Employee get paid for the other time to make 8 hrs? He/ she did dedicate 8 hrs of their day to the Boss/ job.
See above. If we end at 7 hours (very rare but it happens) then you get paid for 7.
Q. At the end of the week, if 40hrs (hrs/day) were not acrued, and there is work to be done on Sat. is that overtime or reg pay shedule?
You can work 40 hours in a week for me, not more unless there's a major emergency. Anything over 40 on a one-week timesheet is OT, which I do not want to pay for.
Q. Do you find workers will be more likely to do Sat work if it is a full days or a 1/2 days work?
I don't want guys working on Saturdays unless we're way behind. Sometimes it's OK as a makeup day.
Q. If the Employer pays for 40hrs even when this in not achieved due to scheduling or Client issues then why isn't the Employee a sarary worker?
I've never heard of this. Do any small residential contractors pay for hours not worked?? Doubtful...
If I'm in a situation where I don't have a steady 40 hours for someone, then they need to find something they like better. A lot of guys are working on their own houses, doing side jobs, going fishing, etc. Many or even most do not object to short days once in a while.
Down here in the land of GC's not wanting to have employees I responded to an add once, the guy said that he paid by the day. I think his pay for the day was $120, he said that if you only worked 6 hrs you still got $120, if you worked 10 hours you still got $120. I'm wondering how many days they worked 6 hours!
Doug
I read most all of the post and maintained an attitude and policy very much like your policies when we had hourly enployees. We now have a written policy for our salaried and working supervisor which furnishes truck, health insurance, vacation time, cell phone/radio and bonus incentives. I am working on a savings / retirement plan for him. All other work is accomplished by subs, and perhaps temps if needed.
He is currently enrolled in our Church' live-in Christian disciplship program, and we have laid out policies for his full time position upon completion. The program is building real character. I suffer while he is completing the prgram, but would rather him receive and live according to the spiuritual training he is receiving than have his undivided help and support now.
If our projects are current and we have time, he can take on and sell small projects. So, I guess he is a project manager / salesman He can take a lead, develope the lead and manages the project. The project is run through the company. As budget and bottom line is realized, he can make sales commision and share in profit on these small projects in addition to salary. His compensation is related to his sales skills, development and management, so we agree to figure compensation after completion. In all cases he is only required to work 40 hours, but does burn the midnight oil in my interest and to add efficiency and increase his take home.
Everyone always needs some extra money, and this can keep him from doing side jobs on the weekend. It is also a teaching opportunity for him to learn the business, bid processes, customer relations and see profit, overhead and job cost in the real world. He was / is a good, hard working carpenter and if the small project is a one day deck or similar, he can do it on Saturday and earn the labor portion of the project. Woking on Saturdays is his choice.
I take a special interest in teaching him the business. In 5 years he should be classified as an entry level custom builder.
He is happy with the arrangement and we are more like father and son. Our relationship is above the norm and fantasitc. My long term intentions are for him to inherit a portion of my assets, including a share in the company with my own children. He sometimes voluntarily cuts my grass in the late evening or on Saturday, takes out the trash, helps with a development we are trying to launch, etc. knowing he is investing in a good, giving and fair return relationship with me. He views it as preparing his future. His help with the developement will result in a free and premimum lakeside lot.
I may catch some flack from BTers, but to take up an offense for him or I would be to totally misunderstand the relationship. We are both happy as fat ticks on a hounds butt, and excited about our future. I wish a builder shared this kind of relationship with me as I progressed.
Edited 7/21/2006 8:30 pm ET by txlandlord
Shoot, I wish I shared that relationship with you! LOL....Sounds like a good deal to me hoss.... where do I sign up? And you were a framer once too, huh? So there's hope.....
View Image
Edited 7/21/2006 9:27 pm ET by dieselpig
The relationship works both ways.
Come on down...I have got 2 diesel tractors, a diesel skid loader, 2 diesel trucks and 2 - 300 gallon diesel tanks to keep em full......... dieselpig would be in hog heaven. I am looking to add a diesel bulldozer in the next year.
Me thinks all you need to add is a diesel carpenter. ;)
You seem like a stand-up guy Tex.... wish there were more of 'em in the biz.View Image
Me thinks all you need to add is a diesel carpenter. ;)
No problem....If you ever want to replace clam chowder for Mexican food....come on down. You can remain a Red Soxs fan.
You seem like a stand-up guy Tex.... wish there were more of 'em in the biz.
I have learned the value and return of giving, and thinking of others.
The developing relationship I have with this young man is paying dividends with every investment. In talking to a life insurance salesman last week, the question arises: What happens to the business if I die? My wife can not run the business, my 8 year old son and 1 year old daughter can not run the business. My 22 year old daughter is pursuing a nursing career.
I have a substantial business with a long successful history, great name and growing and sustaining future plan. My investment in him and the father son relationship that is growing stronger squarely places him in continuing the business and taking care of the wife and the othe children. The wife now runs the office and with terms and considtions considered and planned they can both sustain responsibilities thru the business. Life insurance benefits would be icing on the cake.
With this type of arrangement, I am interested in teaching him all of the tricks and secrets, and he in turn is interested in maintaing my assets and helping the business be successful as it is in future interest.
Brothers Custom Works, started by 4 Christian brothers in a Church. All are now gone and my wife and I own the company, but the name could be future prophetic in that he and my son inherit and continue the business.
dieselpig,
I stored your profile pic in my computer long ago, but can not remember which one is you. One thing I can tell is that the frame work in the pic is nice.
on the left is Brian
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
" I am not an Activist, I am, a Catalyst. I lay around and do nothing, until another ingredient is added"
Yup, I'm on the left. That's Alex to my left... he should be on my right because he's essentially my right hand.View Image
but from here he is on the right...Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!<!----><!---->
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
Ok, I am getting the pic. Who is Alex, does he have a BT handle?
Alex has worked for me since day one... just a little over three years ago. I was just starting my business and walked into Dunkin' Donuts one morning. He was behind the counter! He has fists like cinderblocks and looked like he hated his job. I asked him if he ever did any carpentry. He said "sure". So I hired him because I needed help the next day building two story PT decks on the backs of apartment buildings. He was lieing about having worked carpentry, but I figured I was pretty much lieing about having much of a business at that time. The first year was lean, but he stuck it out with me. We framed a couple good sized houses together, just me and him.
He's not on BT. His first language is Portuguese and doesn't read or write English all that well yet. Speaking is no problem, but the only words he can really read right now is stuff you find on blueprints! LOL... I pay for him to go to English classes at night in the winter though... so he's getting there.View Image
There's general practices, then there is the law - often not the same thing. Here in California, for non-exepmt (i.e. eligible for overtime) here's the rules:
In California, the general overtime provisions are that a nonexempt employee 18 years of age or older, or any minor employee 16 or 17 years of age who is not required by law to attend school and is not otherwise prohibited by law from engaging in the subject work, shall not be employed more than eight hours in any workday or more than 40 hours in any workweek unless he or she receives one and one-half times his or her regular rate of pay for all hours worked over eight hours in any workday and over 40 hours in the workweek. Eight hours of labor constitutes a day's work, and employment beyond eight hours in any workday or more than six days in any workweek is permissible provided the employee is compensated for the overtime at not less than:
Yep, more than 8/day is supposed to get OT.
Or course, since we have to keep all those bureaucrats gainfully (?) employed, they have a whole bunch of rules to define exempt employees within 17 different categories (e.g. "Industries Preparing Agricultural Products for Market, on the Farm"). The print was too fine so I stopped reading, but it looks like they allow a 4-10's alternate schedule.
Too much for my toasted brain on a Friday afternoon - I need a beer!