Hey, all –
The other day the switch to the bathroom light failed. I told my wife I would replace it. She told me there was an old vent fan in the ceiling that had simply been wallpapered (ceilingpapered?) over. She wanted to install a new one and get it to work. She installed a new fan; I’m trying to get it to work.
Coming into the switch box are a red wire, a black wire, a white wire, and a bare wire.
As one would expect, red and black are both hot. White is not. Bare is obviously the ground. (In fact, it was attached to a screw in the back of the box. I guess I’ll probably reattach it to that.)
To make everything work off a single switch, I could pigtail the red and the black to one side of the switch and attach the white to the other side. But is there any way to make the fan and the light work off different switches?
DETAILS AND DISCLAIMERS:
The switch I removed was a double with one switch taped over — presumably when the original fan broke. That’s why I think it should be possible to have each run on a separate switch.
I bought a new double with two single-pole switches. Two screws on one side, connected; two screws on the other side, not connected; one ground screw.
And no, I didn’t note how the old switch was hooked up. I didn’t know about the fan at that point. (I assumed someone used a double switch for only the light because they didn’t happen to have a single switch on hand. That would be coinsistent with the level of remodeling expertise I’ve found elsewhere in the house.)
It’s an 1870 house with many remodels, but I have reason to believe the fan was installed in the past ten years or so. As for the light and switch box, your guess is as good as mine.
When I say the switch failed, I mean that when you flipped it on, the light flickered for several seconds, accompanied by a faint crackling sound from the switch. Then the light (and the sound) went out. This happened just about every time I flipped the switch on. I thought it was a loose connection inside the box, but found none.
I am not an electrician, but I have many years’ experience with stage lighting. I can wire a switch, a plug, etc.
I tried hiring an electrician. Most didn’t even return my call. A few returned my call and then said no when they found out how small the job was. One said he’d come to look at it and give an estimate (?), but never did. I’ve given up on this route.
Replies
first thing......DO NOT SPLICE THE RED AND BLACK TOGHTHER....until you determine which one is the Sw leg for the existing light...........or is the white the Sw leg ?
is there only one cable at the switch?
Maddog -"first thing......DO NOT SPLICE THE RED AND BLACK TOGHTHER....until you determine which one is the Sw leg for the existing light...........or is the white the Sw leg ?"Oh, if only I knew."is there only one cable at the switch?"Yes. All four wires are part of the one and only cable that comes in the back of the box.
Oh NO you tried to splice two different hots ???Follow Bill Hartmanns' advice as he is more capable of explaining things..if that 4 wire comes from the light , you might be able to convert one hot into a Sw leg there...... just cut and cap the hot side
If there is only the ONE cable then power has to come to the box with the light and the 3-wire cable is a switch leg.
I am starting off assume a single unit for lgith and fan.
at the unit you will have an income power cable with hot and neutral (and ground). The white wire in the switch leg cable will be the supply wire. Remark it as being hot by putting black tape on each end.
The switch leg white will connect to the hot from the supply cable at the unit. At the switch it will connect to the common side of the double switch. Connect the back to the other side of the one switch and the red to the other one.
At the unit then the switch leg light will connect to the light hot and the red will connect to the fan hot. And the supply cable neutral will connect to the fan and light neutral(s).
If you have separate units then wire it like I said to the light box. Then run a 2 wire cable from the ligth to the fan.
Bill H -"If there is only the ONE cable then power has to come to the box with the light and the 3-wire cable is a switch leg."That's what I figured. And I assumed one hot came from the light and one from the fan, but I guess I don't really know that."I am starting off assume a single unit for lgith and fan."Sorry, I should have been more clear. The fan is in the newer (relatively), back part of the bathroom, which has a 7-foot ceiling. Makes for easy installation.The light is in the older, front part of the bathroom -- which I think was originally the hall closet of the house -- and which has an 8 1/2-foot ceiling.(For what it's worth, the switch box is in the old part, too.)This is just one of the reasons I don't want to fish wires -- I'll run them off the same switch first.
What's really important: Where were the wires routed when you pulled
the switch away from the box? The way you describe the wires is the
way one would wire a 3-way switch setup, ie, the light was controlled
by two switches.
I'd pull the light from its box and see how its wired. Often you can
dope out what's going on by pulling the fixtures and switches out
and looking at the wiring. I'll bet the light has the 12/3 (with red)
coming into its box, with maybe the red or black going on to the fan.
I'm guessing - pull the fixtures! An if you actually pull 'em, write
down where everything was connected...
I just re-read your post. If she installed a new fan, pull it down too
so you can see all the wires.
And, finally, both the red and black being hot makes sense if the
fan has power at its other leg, and the light has power at its other
leg. You'd turn on one or the other by GROUNDING (to white) the
black or red. Its absolutely not kosher, but I bet its what's going on.
You could verify this by connecting red or black to white through ####100W bulb. If the 100W glows a bit and the lights come on, thats lights.
If the 100w glows just s little and the fan runs, that's fan.