Hi All,
I went to replace a light in a basement stairwell – just a simple porcelin utility light controlled by a single switch at the top of the stairs. The fixture had 4 wires going to 4 separate terminals: a black and a brown on one side (hot side I assume) ; and
white and a “beige” on the neutral side. The fixture itself had “250 volt” imprinted next to the terminals.
I&
#39;m not sure about what to do here when I go to wire the new light in: can I simply wire the black and brown wire together on the hot side and jumper to the new fixture and then do the same to the white and beige wire on the neutral side? Sounds logical to me but I’m a little nervous about that 250 volt designation on the old fixture.
Thanks for any light 🙂 shed on this guys…
Dave
Replies
What's going on is that fixture is rated for use at up to 250 volts, but that doesn't mean it actually has 250 volts running through it...a 250 volt rating is pretty common if you look at the back side of standard light switches or outlets or porcelain receptacles (I just glanced at the two gooseneck lamps sitting here on my desk, and their sockets are both stamped 250 volts as well.)
Assuming you don't have some sort of weirdly wired house, it's almost certainly connected to regular old 120 volts.
Hi Stuart,
Thanks for the info. So why the 2 hots and 2 neutrals? And am I then OK wire nutting the hots together, the neutrals together, and then jumpering to the new fixture?Thanks again,
dave
I don't know that I've ever seen a fixture with four terminals on it like that before. Is there more than one light fixture on the same circuit? If so, maybe two of the wires are feeding 120V to this fixture and the other two are feeding 120V to the next light. If that's the case, you should be okay wire nutting the pairs together with a short pigtail for the new fixture. It would be a good idea to do a little checking with a voltmeter first to make sure what's going on.
Yes there is a 2nd light on the down at the basement landing on the same switch. I wire-nutted the two "hots" and 2 "neutrals together and the the switch controlled both lights - no circuits blew so I'm guessing I'm OK...
My house was built about 1952 but the electrician must have used his granddaddy's toolbox. There are porcelain wire nuts, some rubber and cotton insulated wiring (all that is dead) and at least one pull-chain ceiling fixture with two hot and two neutral terminals - interconnected just like recepticals, I suppose so the wiring could be strung from fixture to fixture.
HarryD
Are you in the US?
In some parts of the world 240 volts is the base voltage, but not in the US.
I don't have a standard "basement" fixture handly to look at, but I would be surprised if they are marked 250. But they might be.
And neither brown or beige wires are standard colors, but they could be old discolored wiring.
Also there should not be 4 wires connected to 4 terminals if that is all that there is.
With 2 cables there are 2 possiblilities of how this is wired.
1) one cable is power, and the other is a switch leg that runs to the switch. In that case the hot (black) would connect to one of the wires (currently the white, remarked black, but on older wiring it might be different) going to the switch. The other wire would connect to the hot side of the fixure (with is the center tab of the edison (screw) base and in current devices is colored gold or dark. The white from the power wire would connect to the other terminal on the socket, which is the shell and currently colored silver.
2. The other arrangement would be to have the SWITCHED power connect to the fixture and also another cable with in turn feeds other lights that are switched at the same time. But you never mentioned other lights. If this is the case you will see two terminals that are next to each other and connected to same part of the fixture for the hot connection and again another set for the neutral connection. That would allow the fixture to be used as a feed through like the 2 sets of screws on a receptale.
There are enough things here that don't sound right. Please give some more details.
How old is the house? Do these 4 wires come in two separate cables or conduits?
With the brown and beige is that one possible "extention cord"?
Bill, Sorry I forgot to mention the other light at the bottom of the stairwell controlled by the same switch. The house is about 20 years old, I need to check and see if the four wires come in on two separate cables - I think they do. "If this is the case you will see two terminals that are next to each other and connected to same part of the fixture for the hot connection and again another set for the neutral connection. That would allow the fixture to be used as a feed through like the 2 sets of screws on a receptale" I think that your 2nd scenario is what I have, AS I mentioned in my previous posting to the other gentleman, I took the leap and wire nutted together the black and brown, and the beige and white and then flipped the switch - the other light came on at the bottom of the stairwell. No fuses blew - I'm home free I think??Thanks again for your interest.
Dave
Just because the light is working doesn't mean all is as it should be. Test to be certain that the neither bulb socket has reversed polarity which is a potential hazard to anyone changing the bulb.
20 years old there should not be any brown or beige wiring if it was romex.There is a slight chances that conduit was run and separate wires where used and thus those colors where used, but highly unlikely.I would check to see that they was not done with extension cord wiring. Those often have off colors.I would not be surprised if the HO added the 2nd light with whatever he had.
I agree. Used to be some early romex was made with a black paint, asphaltum base?, on a woven fiber jacket. Inside some paper filler and couple of manila strings as filler and a wound pressed paper wrapping over the two or three, often if a ground is present it was undersized, conductors. The insulation was typically, for the ungrounded conductor, medium-brown with off-white spiral stripe cotton over a rubber insulation applied over a tinned copper conductor. The neutral was a white on off-white cotton again over the same insulation. Given a little dirt, poor lighting and age these woven cotton exteriors tend to look pretty much the same. On such jobs I carry a non-contact voltage checker or long reference lead to neutral in the panel for use with a meter to tell me which is hot.As far As I know, excluding some left-over holdover from an earlier time that got installed because it was handy, this type of early romex went out of use in the 50s. A similar version, same general jacket materials but with plastic insulation, as opposed to the earlier rubber, was used into the mid 60s.
I'm sure that this is a little late, but there is a REMOTE possibility that whoever had your house before was running some kind of 240 volt appliance in the basement. It is ALWAYS a good idea to meter voltage before connecting two supposed hots or two supposed neutrals. If you are uncomfortable with a meter, then just cap of the orphan wires with single wirenuts and call it a day. If you are comfortable with a meter, disconnect all the wires and have them resting outside the box exposed and not touching eachother or any metal. Turn the breaker back on and measure between the two hots, the two neutrals, one hot and one neutral, the same hot and the other neutral and so on; until you have a good idea of what is going on. If you get a reading of 240 volts between the two hots, absolutely do not connect them since they are two different legs of your house's 240 service. Further, I see no reason to connect the two supposed neutrals.