We are remodeling a townhouse that was “renovated” a couple of years ago. The wiring is something to behold, not a single outlet box was grounded. Many switches and outlets were cracked and the used quite a lot of three wire # 14.
We have fixed most of the outlets and switches, but one is puzzling me. There is a ceiling outlet in the kitchen ( on the same circuit connected to a powder room ceiling light). In the ceiling box there is a white, red and black wire. The light should be controlled by a dimmer switch connecting to a red wire on one side of the switch and a black wire pigtailed to a hot lead in the switch box. The switch is not a 3 way switch as far as I can tell.
Now my dilemma, I have 120V at the ceiling between the white and the black at all times. I have 0 volts between the the white and the red at all times.( Switch on or Switch off). I am trying to figure out a way to trouble shoot the switch wiring configuration or the ceiling so the switch on the will work.
I tried changing the dimmer for a simple single pole switch and I get the same result…120V between the black and white, 0 volts between the red and white whether or not the switch is on or off.
Does anyone have any suggestions what my next steps should be to trouble shoot this circuit?
Replies
My first non electrician guess would be that it was wired for a ceiling fan to be controlled by the pull chain internal switch via the always hot wire and light controlled by wall switch if I read you correctly. I had a similar issue on a job and put them in a stack switch to control them seperately on the wall.
I will not offer any other ideas and will leave it to the dream team to provide the answers.
Sounds like the light and two three ways were wired incorrectly to start. Hot lead should go to one of the switches first not after the light fixture.
However, Rasconc has a good point there. Continuous hot to ceiling fixture sounds like someone wired a fan/light there at one time. Continuous hot to fan operation by pull chain on fan only.
There are two ways that I know of to wire a ceiling fan combo light fixture. Power can come from the panel, by cable, to the fixture location then to switch to control the light. Alternately, power can come to the switch first then to fan/light fixture. Check around at the light fixture and the switch to see which one has two cables coming into it. The unit with two cables into it is the one that receives power first. Need to find out what you have before going further.
First thing to do is to remind yourself that electrons are color-blind.
At the light box how many cables are there and what color is the wires in each cable (or conduit). And what is connected to what.
Likewise the samething at the switch box.
And what are you using to measure the voltage.
I am using an amp/volt meter to check the voltage. The wiring configuration is as follows:
Ceiling:: Single wire #14- 3 wire: White , red, Black, & ground
At the switch:
Left side:
600V dimmer attached one side to a red and the other side pigtailed to a group of black wires.( this is the one we are having problems with)
Right side:
Pot light wiring ( the other side of the ganged box). It looks like they wired each potlight separately and brought the leads back to the switch rather than going from pot light to pot light. As a result, the switch box is quite full. All the pot lights (6) are working.
All Commons ( whites ) are pigtailed together. There are 5 or six pigtailed together.
All blacks ( hot) are pigtailed together, with an separate black wire to a single pole switch.
It is interesting that someone mentioned the fan/pull chain idea. That would certainly explain the 100% hot (black lead).
Now I need to figure out , the switching between the white and red lead.
Thanks for your help
Measure between the red wire and the white wire in the switch box. Especially if you have put the switch in place of the dimmer between the red wire and the group of black wires. There should be 120 v between the red and white wires with the switch on. If not, check the black wire to white wire, as the first suspect is the black wire has slipped out of the wirenut just enough to not conduct but looks secure.If there is power on the red wire in the switch box but not in the ceiling box, look for the hidden junction box!Frank DuVal You can never make something foolproof because fools are so ingenious.
That is excellent advice. Thanks for the response.