Newbie DIY question:
I called up the local lumber store, Gray Lumber, here in Tacoma and ordered 3/4″ 4×8 T&G plywood sheathing and other lumber. I got a written quotation including UDLX sheet.
The yard delivers 47 5/8″ net coverage plywood with a receipt that says 4×8 UDLX plywood, which matched the quotation. I did not check the stamp on the sheet at time of delivery. They did come up short 10 pieces of lumber which i did notice. The sheet was really well covered with plastic and staples. I use the stuff for a 16′ wide by 22′ long subfloor, making the unplanned adjustment to cover the full 16′ width with a glued and nailed strip at the side. Not that neat, but no big deal…
A few days later I call the sales guy to order some more stuff and right away asked about the 47 5/8 net width sheet. At first he tells me that this is standard and all sheet is under width and to space it to obtain 48″ net coverage. I mention the APA marking method for “sized for spacing” and that i’d expect the sheet to be space 1/8″ in the width direction. He says he’ll call me back.
He calls back and says that i should have started my layout to account for the under width, which he says i’m supposed to do anyhow. I say i’m not so sure about that since the sheet is run perpendicular to the joists and could start with a corner of a sheet in the corner of the structure. But i’m not sure and would like to learn more if he has the time. He says he’ll call back.
He calls back and says it’s all 47 5/8″ wide these days because everyone is using OSB. I stay away from that. He says i should have ordered full width sheets but that they are more expensive. I point out to him that i did order 4×8 sheet. I did not point out to him that i paid more than 28$/sheet, which is more than the “big box” stores sell “full width” sheet for here in town.
I say i’d like to learn more because he’s now telling me how many years he has been in the business and recommends to me that i go to some job sites to learn about current tract home subfloor practice.
i’m sure i must have made some sort of mistake…just not sure what. He says he’ll call me back.
He does. Says they ran out of full width 4×8 UDLX and that the order entry skew is the same for both the net 47 5/8″ wide and the 48″ wide sheet and that i can talk to the owners about it since they are the ones that put in the skews. He also says i can bring it back. Now i’m wondering what the heck this guy is trying to say, but i’m sure i’ve worn out his patience… Really nice guy though and i think i learned something, just not sure what.
So, from the professionals (and skilled DYI’ers) out there, anyone care to point out what the heck I did wrong here? I searched and found no discussions on the site here regarding sheet dimensions.
Anyone ever get sold 47 5/8″ net coverage 4’x8′ plywood? What is it for? Why would anyone want less than 48″ net coverage? Just nit picking?
Replies
Was the ply made by Hoquiam Plywood Co? Sounds like their product. My own house was the same. It really pisssed off the guys laying the subfloor. Cost them more in the long run becasue they then had a 7 sheets missing a toungued edge.
Funny you asked about Grey lumber, there prices are pretty good, Terrific if you comapre them to the local lumber companies on the Coast
Migraine,
You hit that one on the head. Hoquiam is the mill...outstanding call. Not great stuff, but okay. A few sheets were marked "ungraded" which I used for shim/fill where needed. I suppose i could have taken those back as they had obvious defects, but i'm not big on returns.
Thanks for the infomation/comment.
Never heard of "full coverage" T&G plywood. Is it really available?
My wife works in a plant where they make plywood. They make 48" wide sheets, then cut the T&G profile on it, resulting in a coverage of about 47 1/2".
We always run the long axis of the sheets perpendicular to the joists as this gives a stiffer floor. Also, obviously a T&G joint does not do much good on top of a joist, as the edges of both sheets are fully supported already. The T&G helps prevent soft spots and squeaks where sheets join in the spaces between joists.
As to what you did wrong? I think you just need to know that this product does not cover a full 48" per sheet. Maybe trust your lumber salesman a bit less, as he did not seem to be very knowledgable on the subject
Floor dimensions are sometimes based on the 48" module, so you will sometimes end up a few inches short on one end of the subfloor. You then have to decide whether it is wortwhile to buy eneough T&G to finish the run, or if the wall covers the joint you might just fill in the space with scraps, as they are really only needed to shim the wall.
To repeat, is 48" coverage T&G really available.
Goldenboy,
I checked only at the Depot and Lowe's and they both have ONLY have 48" net coverage 3/4" T&G. The face measures 47 7/8". 1-1/8" that i have used recently also measures 47 7/8" on the face and 48" net coverage. I might be spoiled by the buyers at the "big box" stores, which makes me feel a little queasy. But maybe they have it because all of their plywood has an APA stamp...well, no help there either. Maybe APA has a standard on width.
Some Code require (and reputable text on the topic suggest) running the subfloor grain direction perpendicular to the joist direction as you point out. I've seen 2x4 put on its side under the joints that don't fall on joists. This adds strength to the diaphram but is not necesary either....but should quiet the floor for those who can still hear.
So, yes, 48" net coverage sheet is available...I'd imagine at about 1% less in cost! I really don't think it is an issue and as you point out, just so long as one plans for it. I did not, but, didn't suffer either. Just felt another mild sting in the life of a weekend DIY'er.
Thanks for the input
I've layed a lot of subfloor and, like you, I prefer plywood. I've never heard of T & G that didn't give full coverage, but it doesn't surprise me, I guess.
I worked in a plywood mill here on the PNW years ago: When plywood is layed up, the rough sheets are approximately 52" X 98" to 100" to allow for final trimming/sizing. The T & G I've always used is 96" X just under 49" (including the tongue), giving full coverage.
So, if nothing else, you've given me something to watch out for.....I would be livid!
I'm not livid...but i think my sales guys may be...and i just couldn't stop wondering if i was seeing the next bump down in dimensions before my very eyes. Curiousity can kill a DY'er/Salesguy relationship...
You know, that more I think about this and read through the thread again, the more I think that you bring up a valid question. I don't get it either now that I think about it. I just assumed that it started out at 4x8 and finished smaller after milling. But you bring up a good point about the availability of "full coverage" sheets as well.
Since I handle about a gazillion sheets of this stuff a year, you'd think I would have put more thought into it. I don't know what the "right" answer is, but I'm curious to find out now that you bring it up.View Image
Not a problem that I see..what would suck is if the sheets were shy on the 8' length( where the joists are).
Next time save a few braincells and figgure the the sheetage from the center out, if it falls less than 1/2 sheet on the edges add the width to the full face value and split that by 2 to achieve a larger useable pc on the edges...
basically, if you can't afford a drop on a subfloor edge..well..add a spline.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Next thing you know they'll be making 2x4's that are only 1 1/2" wide.
Seriously though, like pretty much all other building stock nowadays, it's nominal vs. dimensional. The rough product starts out at the size you're buying (dimensional) and when it's "finished" (milled, planed, grooved, whatever) you get a nominal size product. For sheet goods, they start out at 4x8 and then the T&G is milled in, resulting in the lesser coverage. Some sheetgoods actually start out even smaller then 4x8 as they are sized for proper spacing.
That they would begin downsizing from what has been a dimensional standard for years is, IMO, absolute B.S.
Manufacturing has a responsibility to the end user.
notchman...... i've been using T&G ply ( 3/4) since 1973...
every single sheet is 96 x 47 5/8...
and it ain't a REGIONAL difference
the OP's lumber salesman didn't now d*ck about plywood or layoutMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
While at the local yard this AM, I did a little investigating: Some folks on this board have only seen 47 5/8" width; some (like me) 48" and some, like the OP, both.
Well, checking with a tape, ALL the 3/4", both OSB and plywood and the 1 1/8 plywood T & G subfloor was full span 48" (49" to point of the tongue in Both of my local yards).
My contractor sales guy informs me that the 47 5/8" stuff is called "scant" and the local yards here only carry full span.
Reason? Too easy for some new guy loading orders and partial orders in the yard to mix the scant with the full width.
SO, to the bird who thought this was a stupid thread, say you're laying the subfloor in a house like the last I built with a footprint of 80' X 72' and you find, halfway down a course, halfway across the floor, that suddenly the sheets are slightly narrower or slightly wider....so you've got to replace the mix with like and kind or fiddle around with an adjustment to compensate for the difference.
Now granted, whatever width one uses is pretty immaterial as long as it's consistent.
I suppose the scant dimension gives the manufacturing plants an additional option for using up excess 4' X 8' panels that would otherwise go for sheathing or whatever.
If you deal with a yard that sells both scant and full, a double check on deliveries might save you from Mr. Murphy.
once again.. just when i thought i knew something , i find the extent of my ignorance is just too vast..
or at least , half vastMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Make that two of us.
make that three of us
Hmmm. I guess the down sizing hasn't hit the market place in the area yet. 48" net coverage width is really still available widely in the market here...in fact so far that is all i have found beside the 47-5/8" stock that i used.
I think it is okay, just a little odd.
You seem to be pretty savvy: Take that DYI sticker off your forehead and replace it with something like "harda$$" or something.
(I'm still livid thinking about the affect this oddball sizing might have).
What's to be gained for the manufacturer shaving 3/8" off a sheet except for the ability to unload an oversupply of 3/4 CDX or some other shopgrade.
Buyer beware!
I saw some shenadegans pulled from time to time in the plant I worked in. Maybe this is just one of those....and you were the victim.
Don't be livid! I think you might have figured it out though. Overstocked CDX milled to be T&G to be sold to the unwary DIY'er or just a standard mill practice using one size for both CDX and T&G. Shop grade? What is that? Now what would be the difference between CDX turned T&G and UDLX besides size? It has a smooth side like underlayment. And it's marked 48" which would be the span rating as floor sheathing, it's marked "underlayment" which I think implies sheathing/underlayment combination...strength? any help????
The Ply subfloor I get is like a B/C grade plug-and-touch sanded, 7 ply....pretty decent stuff, really.
I've encountered some stuff in the past that was basically CDX and had a lot of surface defects.....but even that crap, which I sent back, was full width.
Yeah, and after that they'll come up with 1/2" ply wood that's only 15/32 thick.
If ignorance is bliss why aren't more people
happy?
Chris, the fist sheet of t&g that I laid about 30 years ago was 47 5/8" net. I've laid miles of those sheets. I've never seen one that was 48"
Don't fret, the houses are still standing.
blue
Huh? Well then, they must be 47 5/8" wide and i still can't use a tape. Funny stuff though...
Come on....got to be a few more opinions on the typical width of 4x8 T&G plywood!
Blue,Same here. Never seen a sheat of t&g 48" either. Always 47-5/8".Joe Carola
Got it! So the standard is 47 5/8" width and being the currious DIY'er I am, went off wondering in the wrong direction when the sales guy tried to field a bad question. What an odd dimension.
Thanks!
Like blueeyeddevil, I've never seen or heard of T&G ply that had a 48" net face. It's just one of those things you learn to deal with.
You weren't born yesterday?
Too bad, we could have worked on developing that personality of yours.
The fact thatthe sales guy came back to you with half a dozen different answers, tells you that he didn't know Dick about his product.The fact that he did keep returning your calls tells you he is still a good guy to deal with if you know how to use him
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Piffin,
Thanks for that. He is a GOOD guy and i need to make sure and unravel him (i think he got angry since i held out for a solvent answer).
Subtitles like variable full face and scant face, which have little bearing on the task at hand, just get interesting as historical, regional, or economical side notes like the origin of a good colloquialism. But i don't idle well.
ALL of the T&G OSB that i' saw in my quick look was FULL 48".
I'm suprised to read all these responces from guys who seem toget 48" net coverage. I'm like you - in 35 years or so of doing this, I have never seen T&G sheet goods with full 48" net
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Yeah well.....that's just cause you probably insist on using "Made in USA" tape measures.
If you use one from Taiwan, and pull it hard enough, you canl get 48" coverage.
;-)
Heck, use fish ruler and one sheet will cover the entire house.
If ignorance is bliss why aren't more people
happy?
Heck, use fish ruler and one sheet will cover the entire house.
How'd you know I had a fish ruler?
You been readin' my mail?? :)
"Citius, Altius, Fortius"
Don't know if this was mentioned yet, but T&G gives 47 5/8 coverage. If hook your tape on the grooved edge & measure all the way to the edge of the tongue, you will see that you get 48".
If you want full 48" coverage, you can't use T&G.
Been there and done that. Yes t&g ply does come with 47 5/8" inch coverage, and it also comes with 48 inch cover! All due respect to blue and mike but I've found it's a regional thing, (local lumber yards)and you need to request "full face" for the 48" coverage. If you don't request full face you get "scant face" which is milled out of a 48" inch peice and gives a coverage of around 47.5 ". In other areas the yards only sell full face sheets and it's not a big deal. Being a west coaster like notchman, i think it might be a west coast thing.
Chalk it up to your lumber yard and what the've always done and move on or ask for full face or change yards.just my 2 cents worth.
Holy shid, I'm pizzed!
I can't believe i waisted 3 minuits of my life reading this thread!
What, you ain't learning anything?
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Sure Have!
Learned that some people can get worked up over a dilemma that can be solved by getting some scrap out of the burn barrel.
Ya but this answers the question?
Measure twice and where's the rest of my board.
And I always thought I had to stretch the ruler.
I don't figure the OP is all that worked up - just trying to understand the situation. What suprised me is that the sales guy spent so much time on it instead of just saying, "That's the wau it comes, a 2x4 ain't 2" x 4" either" and let it go.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
You just need a board stretcher.
interesting... our ply has always comes from national mills... matter of fact nothing comes into New England from the region...there are no plywood mills here
and for the last 6-7 years we've used nothing but Advantech... which has always been 47 5/8".. they market nationaly
Pulte has been here for at least 10 years and i buy out of the same lumber chain that they do.. and we both get the same ply.. 47 5/8... they're a national builder
so ... you tell me.. why would they sell 47 5/8 here if they could beat the competiton by selling 48 full face ?
i'll tell you this , i will be asking the lumber buyer what the deal is
Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Edited 3/10/2006 6:08 am ET by MikeSmith
level,
I've had the same experience. Like Mike Smith, most of the stock have used in the past 18 months or so has been Advantech (47 5/8") so I haven't thought much about it in a while. But just this past January I got some nice 7 ply T&G on a job and it was a full 48". The reason I recall is that since we didn't bother to check we snapped the line for our first course at 47 1/2" out of habit and had to go back and rip a hair off the tongue before we put walls up.
I guess the reason that I haven't put that much thought into is that I don't see what the big deal is anyway. I guess it's a little shifty if the manufacturers could give us full coverage but are pinching that 3/8" out of our pockets. But I still don't think it's an outrage like some folks seem to think it is. But I am still mildly curious to know why it is that way it is.
FWIW, I'm in New England so I don't think it's a regional thing. Like Mike Smith said, the lumber yards I use get their stock from all over the place, I see stock from Canada, Eastern Europe, and most everywhere in between.
View Image
Edited 3/10/2006 7:06 am ET by dieselpig
thanks for the level headed response. really not a problem for me at all. just a curiousity and a twist in the ever sensitive relationship with the lumber yard sales guy. i think he knew the difference but was just sensitive about the topic or my questions.
I really didn't understand why the sheathing came up short of 16'!
scant face. full face. lesson learned.
I read this thread before work today, and then went out to lay a 24' wide x 32' long floor. There was already 24 sheets of 3/4 T&G on the job. I was thinking 'just my luck, this stuff is going to be 47-5/8" wide, and I'll have 285-3/4" of face coverage and not the 288" I need. How annoying that would be--I'd need to buy 4 more sheets for just the 2-1/4" of tongues I'd need, or buy one sheet and mill tongues onto a bunch of rips.
Luckily, the stuff was a full 48" on the face. Made my day. I'm not far from you and I'm sure your yard could use the same supplier that mine does. There's no name on mine, just the APA stamp.
David,
No way they deliver the scant face to the island! But I'm guessing you'll be happy to specify 48" next time or at least get them both quoted.
Chris.
I'm thinking that my lumberyard is too smart to supply scant face. I've actually never seen it here or in CA when I lived there. Seems like a terrible idea, really. Buildings are often in 4' increments.
I'm starting to think my lumber yard is not good at all. Of 6 16' DF #2, 2x4s, 3 of them were 1-3/8 to 1-1/4 thick instead of 1-1/2. I thought that was just a joke, not something i would see. I don't care to take purchases back.
I guess i'll need to survey the 20' 2x10s pretty well! I'm guessing most of you guys survey your lumber anyhow before you cut...maybe that's what's meant by "measure twice cut once."
Made framing the walls to uniform height a real PITA for a DYI'er like me.
Sad to say maybe I need to order the bulk of my lumber from one of the chain stores. same price or lower, but probably legitimate dimensional lumber.
You can generally expect a few duds in a load. Thin lumber is rare but not unheard of. If you get deliveries, inspect them right on the truck and if you don't want it, send him back for a different batch. They will learn quick not to pull low grade material for you.
"Measure twice but once" is a different thing. It has to do with "I cut this twice and it's still too short."
Chris, I'm starting to think you're one of those homeowners that don't understand that they are dealing with imperfect materials, want rock bottom prices and perfect lumber on every order.
Maybe you should study the standards that are set for grading your particular lumber. If you wanted a higher percentage of higher grade lumber, you should have specified it.
You're idea to order from the big boxes to get better lumber is quite hilarious- thanks for the laugh.
I'm glad I'm not your lumber salesperson. I wouldn't mind if you came in honestly looking for answers but it's obvious that you only want to whine.
blue
Yeah, true. But again i was honesty surprised once again about dimensions. i'm learning a lot about "dimensional" lumber. Makes me realize that a real framer/carpenter is doing a lot of work to make a straight wall.
In my line of work 1/2" plate means 1/2" (-.01" +.04") at the edges of the plate as it comes off the rolls. Obviously lumber has different standards. I find in interesting to stop into lumber stores in various places in the country when i travel to see what is for sale and for how much. For example, the pine in the yard in Alabama...looks great!
The big box snipe is intended to be funny. I still can't buy much at those places because of the business approach of those companies.
Funny you should mention the grading rules. It's best I DON'T know them because then in would start inspecting the lumber and sending lots of it back. I only think about sending back lumber and sheet that doesn't have a grade stamp AND is bad.
I'm very interested in price of materials, but, for me it is not as important as my time and that of those who help me (including you, to some extent..thanks.).
You are correct...I don't know what is reasonable for lumber dimensions...but you guys are giving me a great idea of what to expect. I fourtunately have competent friends who occasionally help (and laugh at me heartily). But in truth, when i get caught 1/4" short on the height of a wall when squaring it up, due to thin 2x4s, I'm wanting to figure it out. (Good) Pros are not going to miss a beat is what i'm thinking....I laugh, catch the claw in the forehead, and then curse. Then try to figure it out. And gain more respect for the trade.
It is very nice to hear regional chatter about what is and is not typical for lumber. yes i whine! But i do all right for a weekend warrior homeowner/DIY'er...with help from my friends for sure.
Cheers.
The last whine was lame for sure.
good reply to blue.. he'd probably let you hang at coffee break... i know i would
lumber is lumber.... grade stamps are grade stamps.... it still comes out of trees..most of which are juvenile nowadays..
any lift will have a certain percentage of culls
if you don't want culls, you have to go to the lumber yard and load them yourself..no way a driver / loader is going to get it as good as you can / will..
even so, i'm usually impressed at how good the lumber is that they deliver.. it looks like someone took the time to discard the bad onesMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
I think the biggest difference is that an experienced carp would notice the cull and without even thinking put it in the scrap/blocking/whatever pile rather than use it as a top or bottom plate. That 1 3/8" would stick out like it was painted red.
Gotta say I haven't seen anything quite that bad, but quality of lumber just ain't gonna get better as the trees get younger and grow faster.
Chris, you obviously are a good natured fellow, so I'll give you a tiny lesson about lumber standards.
Grading lumber is a rather unscientific artform. It would be impossible to create a finite scale and therefore the industry standard allows for 20% of the lumber sold in one grade classification to be substandard.
Put into simple terms, two out of every ten pieces of lumber can be over/undersized, crooked, too many knots, etc. Seasoned professionals use these substandard pieces in areas of the frame that can accomodate the defects without affecting the final product. It's a necessary technique to efficently use our resources.
To eliminate the possibility of you having to soil your project with substandard pieces, you'll have to order 20% more lumber and then absorb the cost of the culls.
It is my belief that every competent carpenter/builder should do their fair share at using the substandard materials in applications that make sense for them, instead of sending them back. If you'll do that, I'll enroll you into my "Saving the Owls" club.
blue
Thanks for the lesson. I'm tracking down WWPA standards for ....reading material.
My situation may complicate the 20% culls situation. I'm already using about 50% recycled 2x4s, 4x12s, 4x12s and 2x10s. It is difficult for me to haul and store too much material at once due limited storage space at the site and to the logistics of getting to my site (200' vertical elevation loss on sandy trail or boat ride). so i'll boat around the 4x8 sheets and joists that I need for the first floor of the project, supplementing the new with the old that i save from the existing structure. so i'm already mixing and matching sizes due to the age of the materials (turn of the century to 70s, to new). i'm not lobbying for the Owl Certificate...i'm just following the spirit of the law here regarding repair and maintenance versus new construction and too lazy to haul all new materials. Plus most of the old stuff, even the old hemlock, is better than most of the new material in that it is much less prone to spliting, etc. The rest is kindling.
Using old rafters for studs and plates is tough due to the bow from being 2x4 rafters (bowed!). But it works..
Not the ideal first real home improvement job. I first built a larger garage (accessible by road), so thought i'd learned a little something.
Learning more. Definitely having fun.
Not even thinking about giving up my day job.
>>"I'm already using about 50% recycled 2x4s, 4x12s, 4x12s and 2x10s. "
Hey Chris -- interesting thread.
Anyway, you might want to check with your BI about recycling framing lumber. Some won't go for it. If not, use it where it doesn't affect strength of the frame (blocking for cabs, towel bars, drywall backer in the corners, etc., lots of places to put it so it won't go to waste even if you can't use it for frame).
Also, I've seen old 4x12 milled down for stair treads. If your place is kind of rustic, might be a nice touch.
"A job well done is its own reward. Now would you prefer to make the final payment by cash, check or Master Card?"
Edited 3/14/2006 9:17 am ET by philarenewal
Yeah, even as a DIYer I try to take the bad with the good. There are cases where I need just two good 2x4s, in which case I'll sort through the pile a bit, but if I need a dozen pieces, and I know that some will be cut into cripples or some such, I'll take a few that aren't so pretty. Also, depending on the project I'll look for straight ones or take ones not so straight.
I get a little irritated when someone sorts through a pile to find ten perfect pieces, and you know the guy's probably just building a garden shed.
If ignorance is bliss why aren't more people
happy?
Kudos to you DanH!
I've often slipped in bad stock too, knowing that I could use it wisely someplace. Thanks for being a good steward.
blue
I use left over roof and wall sheeting for drywall backer would that qualify for "Saving the Owls Club"?
Yes Doodabug, you are now an official member of the Saving the Owls club!
blue
I am honored and humbled.
As someone who has presented himself here as a frugal business man, if you're buying 20% overage, you're wasting money, because the grade books and industry standards range from 2 % to 7% (the tighter specs are for Structural select and above) for off spec.
In reality, in my neck of the woods, it's usually lower than that if you, as a consumer, pay attention over time, to the specific mills that consistently follow the grade rules and ship good product.
In your defense, I built a kit log home a couple of years ago and the white pine framing lumber came from Canada. That was the worst stuff I've ever seen in my life....maybe that's what you're getting.
Sometimes 20% isn't enough around here. I've started to order Seneca select grade studs thats how bad my lumber is getting around here. I get sent 2x12's split down it's entire length and 2x4's good for only hockey sticks, LVL's that are 3/4 of and inch oversized in height and thickness. Fact is a house only needs so much blocking after I sort through some of my deliveries I've got 1 header and four studs, a lifetime supply of blocking, and a bunch of hockey sticks for us to play with on our ice covered decks.
HI Chrisjohns. In answer to your question, 3/4 T&G U/L does come in both Full Face and Scant Face widths. Scant is typically 47 5/8" across the face of the underlayment and Full is a full 48" across the face. I have 15 years of pro sales experience in the Portland Oregon market and have sold both products. Scant face is typically sold to residential contractors and Full face is usually sold to commercial contractors. Full Face usually costs the retailer about $50-$100 more per thousand square feet, and is not a common stock item. It is usually shipped direct to jobsite or warehoused for the customer, shipped as needed. You are getting a total 48" wide sheet when you pay for the scant face, and you are paying for an oversized sheet when you buy the Full face. If you are decking 100,000 square feet on a commercial project and need to lay out materials per an engineers specs which may include additional perpendicular and parallel blocking at even centers, the 48" net is important. In decking the typical residence this is not a concern and the vendor to remain competitive will choose to stock the lesser expensive product.
Hope this helps!
Thanks Hammer.
Our market here is a little different (from the consumer's standpoint) since the sheet costs the same whether it is full 48 or not, IF you shop around.
for my little 16x22-8 floor, the net cost (for this DIY'er) is one sheet and a little confusion, and an hour stripping in the subfloor holiday. ...and the hour peering into the eye of the devil here!
I'd have paid for full face if i'd know the difference.
This site is loaded with good story and information for those who like opinion and written experience.
1H,
That's a false economy, if I ever heard one.
Let's say I'm building a 4000 foot (Easy numbers) house on two floors. I have to buy 7 sheets extra to cover the shortage. Then I have to remember to put the tongue south on the first floor and groove south on the second floor. Then, I have to rip each of those 7 sheets twice and throw away the middles.
Just to save $200-$400 in materials? Oops! I had to buy 7 extra sheets out of that savings, too.
Uuuuhh, is the supplier figuring 31.25 sheets of scant face to a thousand for that price or is he thinking 31.496/1000?
It's pretty good math for somebody. ($1.60 -$3.20)/sheet extra cost for 0.8% more material. Thats $6.25 -$12.50 a squre foot or $200 - $400 for 32sqft of material!!!SamT
Probably no big deal if you're gonna come out "odd" anyway, but for a structure that's a dead-on 4-foot multiple certainly a PITA.But I can understand from the mill's standpoint that you're set up to produce one size product, and the "scant 4" sheets are just run through a router after manufacturer, vs having to reset everything to produce 49" product.
If ignorance is bliss why aren't more people
happy?
here's what you do....
unload all the sheets from the stack...
...soak each sheet with water until it is completely soaked....that might make it "stretch" to get the 3/8" you need...
:)
knowledge without experience is just information.... Mark Twain
http://www.cobrajem.com
Hey newbie ...
I for one never new there was a difference ...
have no idea what I've been working with!
as a remodeler, even when it's a big addition ... I'm thunking it's not been enough for me to notice.
Now I gotta go check with a tape in hand.
You are not alone.
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa