A buddy of mine is remodeling his bathroom, all is going well except his toilet.
He’s been having fits, trying to get it to quit leaking, a small amount of water will eventually appear on the floor, in the left rear corner of the toilet.
I went over yesterday to help him, thinking, “No problem, he’s just doing something simple wrong.”. And at first I thought I had it figured out. He’d built the floor up to a point, that he was using 3 wax rings. We got a 1/2″, and a 1/4″, flange spacers. This brought the flange level with the floor surface.
I also checked, and studied every aspect of that toilet for cracks, the tank is not leaking, also the supply line is holding tight.
When I reset the toilet, I only needed one wax ring and I could tell that was enough, as it held the toilet off the floor. I finished setting the toilet, and hooking the supply line up.
To test I flushed more water through it than would normally pass through it in 3 days. About 4 hours later he calls and says that water has shown up in the same place again.
Also, no water shows up, in the basement, under the toilet.
I figured I ask ya’ll for ideas.
It’s a Jacuzzi toilet, made in China. (Yep, I already told him that :-))
Also he doesn’t want to use food coloring, I guess he’s afraid of not being able to return it.
Any ideas will be appreciated.
Thanks.
pb
Replies
Condensation?
John
>>>"Condensation?"<<<I can't find any signs of it, but I can't totally ruled it out yet.pbView Image
If his incoming water is cold and the RH in the room is high then you have condensation on the water line or toilet tank. drip drip drip, but no visible leak
Dry that baby off real good, maybe even blow dry it. Then take a sheet of paper towel and daub methodically on tank & fittings. Source should be indicated by wet spot on towel. I use this method on compression fittings cuz' I just don't trust 'em.
Everything will be okay in the end. If it's not okay, it's not the end.
I've already done that while I was there, I really feel like everything is tight, and leak free, on the tank, and between the tank and bowl.I really wish I could talk him into using some dye of some kind.pbView Image
i recently put in a toilet from china, it had styrofoam on the inside of the tank, there was a hole cut out in the insulation for the incoming waterline, the hole did not line up just right and made a watertight seal impossible, but they put it together anyway, when i installed it i discovered it leaked, i took the water line off and had to cut the foam back from the inside of the tank to make a water tight seal
Plumberbob
This subject came up here a couple of months ago. You would never find it with a search, though.
I mentioned a toilet I installed that leaked in a way I had a hard time tracking down. It was seeping water slowly through a flaw in the glaze. I found the source when I took the bowl off and turned it upside down. As it dried, the source of the seep remained wet longer. Just like with a roof, the best time to look for the leak is as it's drying out. Once I knew where to look, I could find the source inside the bowl.
If this is the problem, there is no fix. Replace it.
Ron
I have to lean toward the answer RONBUDGEL gave, I had a smilar problem with two China specials with water oozing thru defective porcelain, I found mine by using a hair drier around the fixture.
"If all else fails, read the directions"
The first thing I would try now is to let the tank fill up and remove all of the water from the bowl. See if it leaks.
If you don't see any water, empty the tank and fill only the bowl and check for water.
Without dye, it is almost impossible to see a leak in a cracked bowl or tank.
BTW, I would suggest using a Fernco flange instead of wax rings.
It's also possible that his fill valve is allowing the water to slowly rise too high and the water is leaking out of the handle assembly before it reaches the top of the overflow tube.
I really appreciate the advice!But my buddy has give up, and took it back to Lowes. They took it back without any questions.It kinda irks me, I really wanted to figure it out. But I can't blame him, and that's probably what would have had to be done anyhow.Thanks again for all your help.pbView Image
stevebob,
Is your friend big?
Does he read there while doing his bizness?
Some of those huge guys lean back whilst reading, moving the tank a tad and breaking the seal to bowl.
I know it's over, but just a thought for your future investigations.
And, as is usual-the idea has met with no quick answers re. rez memorial.
Come monday I pursue another avenue-an alley approach. The main road has a traffic jamb.............A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
Hey Calvin,The toilet never got used for the sit down business, maybe one or two, standing uses, but mostly just straight up un-cut water. And we did have a short talk about how using the tank for a back rest is not good. The new smaller tank sits away from the wall anotu 2- 2&1/2" from the wall.And thanks for the update, if I can help let me know.pbView Image
Did Gunner drop his phone in it?
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
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Heck man! If we could'a placed him within 100 yards of the place, we might have blamed him, but he never came within 20miles of the scene.Hey! You get any snow? Mrs Bob said that it looked like ya'll did.pb
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Yeah buddy, almost 2". I was surprisd when I ventured out this AM and it was icey underneath. Mostly gone now, cept in the Northside shadows.I was gonna call ya about hooking up, but man, I am STILL fighting this damm crud, I think I got the Pnuemonia, no lie. Lost my voice yesterday, sound like Froggy on Lil rascals still today.Blame it on Gunner anyway, every thing is his fault. Just ask his wife.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
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Duane, I got "something" after my return from the birth of our grandson......week of Nov 9th. Went from that ach-ee flu type feeling to a headcold to a sore throat to a dry hacking cough which is just now letting up.
This aftn-another sore throat coming.
Beats me what this is, but it sure don't want to leave.
Could be that barnyard flu.
allllllll the animals.A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
Aye.My body hurts from coughing so hard. I hate this whatever it is, I'm gonna call it the pork chop flu, cuz it feels like my ribs are spread out on a platter.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
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Sorry, passed through your state and spit out the window.
I must have been the carrier.A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
Well, it's headed back to Ohio, I spit on the Northbounders goin back. Hey, you know we're into Salvation Army down here ( maybe) , Maumee made the local news when a Pot got swiped up there.Just sayin..is all. (G)
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
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Yessir, and they caught him the next day.
Where the kettle was set up (a huge general store-locally owned family that started out in the farming and grain storing business), The Andersons. Well seems I heard a blurb on the news that same day that they donated 2500.00 to the Army, they felt so bad that it occurred at their store.
So, the rest of the story.A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
Alls well that ends well. Good on them.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
PROUD MEMBER OF THE " I ROCKED WITH REZ" CLUB
i had that pork flu.
i swore my ribs were broke in 10 pcs. made me whimper like a girl.
i got to where i didn't care about anything except not coughing.
next year it will be the cow fluthe older i get ,
the more people tick me off
oinkment should have helped...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"
I am late into this discussion, maybe someone has mentioned this. A thin mist of talcum powder blown on to the surfaces will stick to any water leak and quickly show where it comes from and where it is going.
Thanks dude,I hadn't heard that one!I'm making a note.Thanks again,pbView Image
Just heal up Dude!No pressure, just give me some heads up when you're ready.pbView Image
Oh, I'll pester ya before ya know it..LOLI usually bounce right back, this is Bio warfare I think.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
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PROUD MEMBER OF THE " I ROCKED WITH REZ" CLUB
That's right it's all my fault. Just got off the phone with the President. Another two hour long butt chewing on how I screwed up the economy.
Anyway. I tried to call Grant this morning for a weather update. I worked in Paoli today. Another one of our guys that was passing through that area called and wanted to know if we had any trouble getting to our job? He said it was a mess over that way. I couldn't believe it. We usualy get the first wave of your weather. That's why I called Seymour. He's Mister weather. I figure he must have been in radar overload.
I went out about 9 just up the road a ways and it was snotter than slick. Rose went to Lex about the same time and 75 was bad, cars all off the road she said. By the time she got up to Lex tho' it was clear, just wet.Dunno how come we got it bad and elsewhere didn't, but I know it was your fault.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
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Like I said. I couldn't believe what the guy was telling me. Seemed totaly out of place.
Wait until I get blamed for everything wrong with the new forum next week. Old Tom T. Taunton will probably have me on the carpet Tuesday bright and early. Wish me luck.
Just puke undigested marshmallows on his shoes, it ends that stuff real quick.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
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Then if he catches the flu in the next five years that will be my fault too.
I think I figured out why this cruddy cold is hanging on. I was taking massive steroids fir my back, killed my immune system from the crud.Your fault.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
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PROUD MEMBER OF THE " I ROCKED WITH REZ" CLUB
You know since I stopped smoking ten years ago I have had about four colds, only two severe and the flu twice. A couple days here and there and there thrown in with the crud but nothing major.
Before I stopped? Monthly colds and the flu at least once a year.
I know what your gonna say. And I'm sorry I made smoking look so cool.
Edited 12/5/2009 11:16 pm ET by Gunner
thanks.mom.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
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Duane,
Ain't a Dr (but I
Duane,
Ain't a Dr (but I played one in grade school) but our immune system is in large part the colon. You may need to add a probiotic to your pill collection. Inexpensive and lots easier and cheaper than trying to eat 20 yogurts a day.
Lots of Vitamin C.
You may be well again since I just now saw this post.
Hope so
Pete
I once saw one that the fill water splashed up on the undreside of the tank lid. That eventually found it's way INSIDE the hollow lid. And after a spell of that, it would leak out a back corner when the lid filled.
I found it by taking the lid off and getting soaked feet. Then flushed it and saw the spray going up.
Strange ####
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
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Check to see if there isn't a leak in the fill valve, spraying water up against the lid. From there it drips down onto the floor.
Sometimes a leak like this will be intermittent.
When I was over there yesterday, I checked everything constantly while we were sending water through it, nothing.Anyway when I did the OP I was hoping to find out the this brand of toilet had a known flaw or defect in design, but that doesn't appear to be the case.Like I mentioned earlier, he has returned it and bought another. I'm awaiting for his report on what he bought this time and how the install went.Thanks DanpbView Image
I know I'm too late as the toilet is gone, but I had a similarly persistent leak that defied all explanation until I took the toilet out and found it had been molded from a point under the rear of the tank, which left a small hole that was then filled with caulking. It was way up underneath and I missed it the first time I looked. I asked around and found many of the lower cost toilets seem to be made this way now.
I feel kind'a sad in away, I was really wanting to track this down, and find problem.He didn't see it my way though. From his point of view, And he did check for leaks, (like a true detective), between what he'd done and what I did, plus the "picking each other apart" thing to insure that no stone was unturned. He decided it had to be the toilet's fault. Heck! Duh! But I wanted to work with my imaginary friends and pick this apart, scientifically, and rationaly, to the n'th degree! Then he could walk in there with a stack of 8x10 color glossy photos, of the said toilet. There would have been arrows and notations on each photo showing the exact problems and defects. I mean I was willing to get on the advocates bench, jump up and down, holler and scream! Eat dead, burnt lawyers who got in our way! And all kinda mean and crazy stuff to back up my buddy!,..... but he took the wind right outta my sail when he didn't see it my way!It might have kept us busy over the weekend anyway!pbView Image
He should write a really strongly worded letter to the owner of the toilet company.
I did suggest shipping it back to the manufacturer,with explosives.He didn't buy that.I hate people with practical solutions, sometimes.pbView Image
You could put food coloring in the bowl for a few days. If the leak shows no color then you could put a different color in the tank.
Since I guess no one reads the whole thread, what could be the worry of read/unread msgs when they bulldoze this forum?
A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
I do have one more clue for you to check. Last month I got three American Standard toilets for a home we were building.
One of the toilets had NFG marked on the bowl with a grease pencil in rather large letters. I never thought too much about it since there are often markings on some of these toilets. After I installed it, I had the same trouble as your buddy. After the same frustrating investigation, I found an almost invisible crack in the bowl.
Then I figured out that it was obviously a return and some plumber had properly labeled it !!
You didn't see any writing on it did you?
>>>"You didn't see any writing on it did you?"<<<No Sir, I did not.And now that you mention it, I was at his place two weeks before, I was re- doing his vents and drains for his sinks, (the rough in stuff), and helped him unload the toilet from his truck, into the walk in basement.The box looked factory intact, no dings, or signs of re-taping the box.However, I did not see the toilet out of the box, until I got back, and after he'd played with it on his own. (There could be room for error there, I guess.)pbView Image