A guy at one of the yards I deal with says that there is a new APA standard that covers the type of higher-density and more water-resistant OSB products, and that Huber has competion.
Who are these other makers?
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Today the guy at the yard talked me into something called Structurwood Edge Gold from Weyerhaeuser. Well almost... after thinking about it this afternoon, I remembered a time 4 or 5 years ago - same scenario. Some other kind of OSB product that was supposed to be as good as Advantech. Well the house got very wet, and the floors were trashed... I called the salesmen back and left a message that I wanted to change my mind. BTW - Advantech is $3 more... This is part of a framing package and will be about 100 sheets.
Anyone used this Weyerhaeuser product? Here is a web page: http://www.weyerhaeuser.com/ourbusinesses/buildingproducts/structurwood/products/flooring.asp
We've used the Weyhauser product here in the NW and it's a good product. I still can't get Advantech and I really really want to try that product.
I was at JLC LIVE in Portland, OR this weekend and spent some time with the Weyhauser guys. They have some really good products that we use like the LSL stair stringer material and the http://www.trusjoist.com/PDFFiles/2120.pdf for certain applications. We have some engineering details that show a bunch of studs grouged together with some ripped for those 45 walls.
There is a bunch of really cool products that Weyhauser has coming out. Like LSL rafters :-) I can't wait.
I found the link to the rafters. http://www.trusjoist.com/PDFFiles/2080.pdf
Here is a list of products that look pretty cool http://www.trusjoist.com/EngSite/newproducts/?SubCategoryID=160&CategoryID=63
Edited 11/2/2004 7:35 pm ET by TIMUHLER
I'm in the PNW too, and I have been able to get good plywood, which I prefer.
But awhile back, I did an Advantek search and, if memory serves, there's a supplier in Canby, Oregon, just south of Portland.
I'm all the way up near Seattle (close to Bremerton) and they won't get it to us yet, but I was told that there is a new plant coming online that will supply us.
I guess my main concern about the Weyhauser OSB product is what happens if it gets rained on hard 4 or 5 times? This is where advantech excels. Matt
We used the Weyerhouser product on a job recently that got rained on a few times. There was some swelling at the joints, not terrible, but not quite an Advantech-quality performance. Not bad as a second choice, but I can't wait until we can get Advantech again.
Thanks Mike,
That's exactly the info I was looking for. Well, I almost got "sold"... Matt
I saw the roof system at JLC in Rhode Island a few weeks ago, I to was sold on the LSL's for a 9000 sq ft roof I have coming up soon, untill I priced it out!
The price for the LSL's is more than their LVL's, and there is lots of competitors of Truss Joist that sell LVL's for substantially less.
For this roof (need mostly 28 footers) I have looked at LSL's(too expensive), I joists( too much of a pain in the arse), lvl's ( still possible but expensive) & 2x12's(only every other one is straight -enough).
Untill the Lsl's come to within double the price of solid lumber, solid lumber is the way I will go.
I'm glad you shared that experience. I figured they were about double, but not more! That is insane. But what do you do sometimes? Bite the bullet I guess. I'd try and source LVLs for cheaper, but that may not be possible. Maybe I'd follow Frenchy's advice and contact a local mill about timbers :-)
Advantech is bullet and water proof from my own personal experiance using it on my additions in my house.
The secret of Zen in two words is, "Not always so"!
The best things in life are nearest: Breath in your nostrils, light in your eyes, flowers at your feet, duties at your hand, the path of right just before you. Then do not grasp at the stars, but do life's plain, common work as it comes, certain that daily duties and daily bread are the sweetest things in life.
—Robert Louis Stevenson
http://CLIFFORDRENOVATIONS.COM
I am not questioning the quality of the Advantech. I have used it.
I am looking for information on its competition.
Sorry Robert..I just didnt have any info on the compitition.just some serious "personal observations" about Ad.......so I gave it : )
BE well
andyThe secret of Zen in two words is, "Not always so"!
The best things in life are nearest: Breath in your nostrils, light in your eyes, flowers at your feet, duties at your hand, the path of right just before you. Then do not grasp at the stars, but do life's plain, common work as it comes, certain that daily duties and daily bread are the sweetest things in life.—Robert Louis Stevenson
http://CLIFFORDRENOVATIONS.COM
Well, thank you.
I will have to consider Advantech the leading product until all the provisional product reviews are in and counted.
Bob:
Re the Weyeruser OSB product that the lumber salesmen was talking me into, Structure edge Gold, (see the .2 post) the sales literature for it offeres some building code ratings, and lists it as satisfying some Canadian requirements, but I think that all deals with the strength of the porduct . I think what most of us are looking for is temporary weather resistance. Somewhere on the web site I read that the product had been out for many years, and I though that after that long a track record, if it was so great, I would have at least heard something good about it. One of my co-workers said that he had used it and it was OK, but it got wet, and had the protective coating removed by sweeping while wet with a broom - what the hey is that?
All I'm trying to say is that if Advantech floor sheathing has any real competition, where the heck is it? Seems like no one here knows of any... Maybe someone over at JLC knows something. Let us know if you find out anything... Matt
Any new news on Advantech compeditive 3/4" T&G floor sheathing? The Advantech price is way up... Matt
I used the Advantech on my own subfloor. We put it down in mid-February, it's had several snowfalls and rainfalls but it's always been cleaned off and/or squeegeed off from snow or rain within 24 hours. It won't be covered for another 3-4 weeks (timber frame process).
I don't like it. I wish there was something better. About half the joints swelled up, some badly, and a few corners are chipped off in the middle of the floor. The tongue-and-groove aspect makes replacement very difficult. I've got to sand down quite a few joints.
I won't use it again unless I can dry in the building within a week and there's decent weather predicted. I'd surmise that this stuff can handle one or two hard rains, but frankly, I expected better.
call the supplier to get the tech reps to see it. I've sen Advantech under an inch to inch and a half of ice and water for ahlt the windte without suffering
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
It happened to me too. 3 weeks under ice and water. Kept refreezing . If I had known I would have chipped it off and covered it . I wont use it again either. I can treat plywood that way. I used to spray it with diesel and it worked fine.
Tim
>> ... for ahlt the windte ...Want to back up and take another run at that?
Cannae reade de spead Germanic Tung ehah?HALF THE WINTERLOL
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Which half of a winter? One half of our winter here was pretty dry.
Ever considered Norboard as an alternate to Advantech? I am getting some samples of each to do the in-the-bucket test. The Norboard claim is that edge swell is same or less than any competition, but most importantly, if any occurs, it goes away after dry-out. This I gotta see.
The half of the winter that allowed an inch of ice and water to stay on the floor
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
I'm gonna try this structure edge gold stuff. I ordered today. It's $4 a sheet cheaper than Advantech. The lumber yard salesmen says that it has a good a warranty as A. but is not sanded as smooth on the top surface. Hard to cut all through all the BS on the web page.. We'll see if it's any good...
http://www.weyerhaeuser.com/ourbusinesses/buildingproducts/structurwood/products/flooring.asp
Matt
Edited 4/18/2005 8:03 pm ET by DIRISHINME
We've used that before and lasts through a PNW wet winter. Our lumber yard is supplying us with the Orange (or red) edged LP that has the "special" gaps in the tongue for drainage. When it rains, it actually drains like the pictures show and it has done well here. We've used it quite a bit and with all the rain we get, it has NEVER had problems.
I'd still like to try Advantech though
Yea - I had another lumber salesmen pushing an LP "enhanced" OSB product on me, but I dcecided not to go with that framing material bid for other reasons...
Matt
Norboard...Red LP.....Advantech....I Joists.....LSLs...LVLs....
Man, I'm living in the wrong part of the country! One small lumberyard, that had been in business for nearly 100 years was carrying Advantech...I used it on a small garage addition...it got rained on for 3 days straight...I squeeqed it off and it worked great...has held up fine ...that was 4 years ago. That lil lumberyard closed down ( Owner in 90s decided to call it quits) and now, the only place where I can buy Advantech is at a nearby Lowes...they "sometimes" carry it; but not all the time. There are 4 other local lumberyards in my locale...none carry it, most never ever heard of it...I had to bring them in samples and beg them to stock some...but, they still don't stock it on a regular basis...special order only, and pricey/hard to get!
I am also familiar with LVLs...we ( our steel mill carpenter shop) bought Microlams and used them as scaffold plank...16 footers which were 12 inches wide and 1-1/4 inches thick; if I remember correctly...that was 5 years ago ( I left the mill) and the price at that time was just under $70 for a few sticks, but we bought whole lifts in quantity and paid around $58 per plank.
The other above items I am familiar with, but in my area, these items are NEVER STOCKED and hardly ever sold...period! When I mention new products or tools to my local lumberyards, they think I'm crazy...talk about the stone age!
How about the rest of you guys? Are most products you read about in FHB and other sources readily available for you in your locale?
Another example....I Joists...I've seen them installed in Tennessee...saw a special order once from my lumberyard...have yet to see them in any new home built within the last 5 years in my area....people around here are definately "old school."
Anything (product) "new" has to be on the market 15 years or more before it trickles down into our lumberyards. Pex...most counter persons think it's a termite exterminator product! Talk about "home runs" and everyone thinks your'e talking about the Pittsburgh Pirate's lastest ballgame score. Schluter...what's that?...a German scientist? Shower pans...only a handful of plumbers know about it...let alone installed one. Most people and plumbers in my locale figure you don't need no stinkin shower pan...especially when building a shower in a basement with a concrete floor ...."How's it gonna leak?... (they say)..We're putting down ceramic tile!
And...ceramic tile...we got NO ceramic tile stores in the Weirton/Steubenville/Wheeling area. Oh yea...we got carpet centers that can order you in some tile...at a hefty price...but to buy tile work and/or supplies...if Lowes or Home Depot (in Pittsburgh) don't have it...you are SOL. We used to have 3 tile stores...they all closed. Today, right now...everyone in this valley is SCREAMING for ceramic tile work...yet no stores opening up...wish I had the financial backing...this is a gold mine opportunity for someone who knows this business; no lie.
Metal roofing...such as galvalume...yea, everybody knows what that product is...especially since Follansbee Steel and Wheeling Corrugating and Weirton Steel are all about 15 minutes away from where we all live...and they produce mass quantities of the stuff...but get this... I try to order some for a little 12X20 shed roof from my local lumberyard, and they quote me a price of $700! I say; " What, you got to be kidding...they reply, well we gotta ship it from a long ways off...I say;, the mill is just 10 miles down the road... they answer..."Oh no! we don't deal with these local mills...they're too tough to deal with...we buy all our stuff from the West Coast in OREGON!
Yea baby......somedays, I really hate it!
Davo
"Are most products you read about in FHB and other sources readily available for you in your locale?"
The only thing I routinely read about here that I've never seen is fiber cement siding.
Maybe this subject would be worth a thread all it's own...
Q: How many blondes does it take to play tag?
A: One.
We used the LP Top Notch HP sturdi floor. We were framing in November and December so it got rained and showed on a lot. No swelling at all. I think it was about $24 a sheet back then.
The lead carpenter on the job I'm trimming used that on his own house--he loves it. Said the same thing--same warrantee as Advantech, but the edges don't swell like they do with Advantech sometimes, edges are all pre-primed, drainage slots actually work. Only problem he had was he poured his basement floor before his roof was on, so the drainage slots left nicely spaced divots in the fresh concrete. Not exactly a problem with the product, though. Looks like good stuff.
Mike
OK - you said he used Structure edge Gold? I was just looking for *someone* who had used it other than "all the builders" my salesmen referred to... ;-) Thanks,Matt
as piff said, call the rep.My upper floor porch that I will install mahogany on has had Advatech on it for the past almost two years TOTALLY exposed to the NY elements and hasn't done a thing to it through rain inches of snow etc etc.
Good luck
Be well
a...The secret of Zen in two words is, "Not always so"!
When we meet, we say, Namaste'..it means..
I honor the place in you where the entire universe resides,
I honor the place in you of love, of light, of truth, of peace.
I honor the place within you where if you are in that place in you
and I am in that place in me, there is only one of us.
As Piff said, perhaps you had a bad lot. Or maybe it wasn't gapped properly. Either way, my expierence says Advantech weathers better than anything else although it doesn't hardly ever snow here. A good amount of rain though. Or, perhaps your expectations are unrealistic.
Anyway... any votes for any other (cheaper) products? Personally, I have no interest in using plywood. Need to order a framing package within the next 2 days. Matt
here is one that one of our local yards is selling. it's a few dollars cheaper a sheet. it is a sanded product and is quite smooth. i only have a sample of it from the rep. no experience with it as of yet.
http://www.maxxfloor.com/maxxfloor_com.html
carpenter in transition