I’ve spent 13 years working in the technology industry while wishing I’d skipped college and become a tradesman (like my grandfathers). I’ve also spent the last 16 years (starting in college) doing home improvement projects on the side (mostly for family and friends). My skill/knowledge level is “advanced hobbyist”, which to a /real/ builder translates into “over-confident hack who thinks all it takes to be a builder is a truck and a miter saw”.
The IT field is a brutal place to grow old in, and the thought of spending the next 30+ years in a cubicle is horrifying. So I’m thinking of becoming (I *hate* this term…) a handyman. (“Home repair and maintenance engineer?”) The major appeal is the constant variety of jobs/jobsites/clients, as well as the challenge of self-employment. The money is (relatively) less important.
I have a good working knowledge of sales, marketing, finance, and project management. I also have a very, very deep understanding of the customers I’d be pursuing (I’ve spent over a decade working with and for them). But I have for all intents and purposes just book knowledge of the construction trades. I’ve done almost everything once or twice, but that’s just enough for me to know how much I don’t know. (And that everything is harder than it looks.)
* Is there anyone on these boards who switched careers *into* the trades, especially from cubicle culture? Has anyone ever been successful at it?
* Can you run a construction business with just subs? As much as I like doing the actual work, I have a funny feeling that I should try to focus on management/accounting/marketing/anything BUT the actual labor. Can business knowledge compensate for a lack of practical experience? (I know it’s common for people with practical experience to fail as business-owners, but I’m sort of hoping that it’s less of a problem in the other direction.)
* Should I bother? I’ve seen plenty of “I’ve been a carpenter for 13 years, but I’ve always liked to work with computers on the side, and I’d like to know how to break into the IT industry.” I’ve always thought those people were insane, but maybe it’s me.
If you just want to flame me then go for it. And I *did* look through the archives for similar threads before I posted this one. (That’s how I know I’m going to get flamed.) But if there’s anybody out there who’s experienced both construction and cubicles I would really appreciate your insight. Working for other people allows 2-3 people who don’t care about me to have nearly complete control over my future, my happiness, and my security. I want to have some control over my destiny. (So dozens of people who don’t care about me can control my destiny, but I least I have a lot more control over who those people are!)
Thanks (I hope),
J Lemme
Replies
I am a custom homebuilder and would love to comment regarding your inquiry.
I have got to go check on my granite and tile subs right now.
Check us out http://www.brotherscustomworks.com.
Later.
Sometime somewhere which I will be corrected correct is success story of the same as you.
You wont be flamed by me.
You are just what handi man big companies are looking for so look in the threads under business /hadiman or somthing like that .
Heres the deal;
Person starts out in the trades as a job or cause its cool but makes himself a hand . Later becomes a pro and moves on to working for himself with out business training . Thats the sand gap , the sinking kind. Its a big leap and a different one to business manager and owner. Then if successful its less trades and pile on the business about the trades. So that in fact is a switch of life style.
My thought is that you have more chance to get there than the tradesman. Money has always been in management , not the actual tasks of the trades . In fact money is easily lost there. I think you are on the right track and welcome to our world.
Tim
I spent 26 years in IT. Lost my job to outsourcing. I didn't like the looks (or pay) of any of the jobs that I saw advertised (and there were very, very, few of them), so I decided to turn my hobby into my career. It's a great way to ruin a hobby. That is, I don't do any work around my own place "for fun" anymore.
Basically, I am a handyman/painter/carpenter. I do all of the work myself. No crew. Occasionally, I'll bring on an electrician or a plumber. All of my work is through referrals. People like my work. If I had a crew, customers might be satisfied, but I probably wouldn't be getting the referrals that I do now.
The work is generally rewarding. Not at all like IT. However, I'm working a lot more hours every week and not earning nearly as much. Would I go back to IT? Well, I probably could be bought for the right price, but I'm having a lot more fun now. Of course there are days when I'm doing some unpleasant physical labor thinking maybe I should have looked harder for a job in the corporate world.
I could go on and on about the differences between these 2 worlds. There's no clear advantage to one over the other. I feel more useful to the world these days, but I used to be able to save enough of each paycheck that I was looking forward to early retirement. At this rate, I'll be abusing my body for a long time to come.
Choose your poison,
Don
Since we both have IT backgrounds, are the skills portable? I would think that project management, estimating (sort of), eliciting requirements, and documenting solutions are all skills that would transfer nicely. The soft stuff like interpersonal skills and interviewing techniques should be useful as well. Is this wishful thinking?A second issue revolves around dealing with other people in the industry. You work alone, but is it because working with other people is too difficult (very, very likely) or because the other people in the trades are difficult to work with? (I've never seen anything like that, but I've also never worked *with* any of them so they might have had a lot more patience with me.)Finally, how did you start out? Had you been planning on making a switch and were forced to start too soon? Did you have to start cold? How steady has the work been? How long did it take to get there?Thanks for your time!
John
My job in IT was going downhill fast. The company was operating in constant crisis mode and kept inventing ways for us to shoot ourselves in the foot. It didn't take an expert to see that there were no long term plans for success. It was more like "let's just get through this crisis and to hell with the mess that we'll face later".
It stopped being fun a long time ago.
Downsizing, downsizing and downsizing. I escaped at least 3 major force reductions. The one I didn't escape was when they brought in foreign labor to learn what we do so they could bring it back to India and do it cheaper. They asked me to train my replacement without telling me that I would be let go. They didn't have to. I knew my time there was limited.
I started making a list on my whiteboard of the things that I would rather do. I don't remember all of them, but buying a tavern, barber and painter were there. I had lost 2 jobs before this and both times I found new jobs very easily. I didn't expect the same this time. It wasn't. I looked for a while and absolutely nothing came my way. In fact, of all the places that I sent my resume, only one even bothered to tell me that they had received it.
I got the word out to my family (there's 7 brothers/sisters) and friends (I think there might be 1 of those) that I was available for painting. I chose to focus on painting at first because it required relatively little up-front investment. Anyway, they made an extra effort to find some stuff for me to do. Painting may sound easy, but when you're doing it at someone else's house, you have to arrive fully prepared. Painting work kept coming in. It still does. I enjoy painting and most jobs are never just painting anyway. When people find out that I'm also a handyman, they'll usually have me look at a bunch of other stuff for them. The keys to success are neat, clean, reliable and thorough.
Other than being methodical (I spent most of my former career as a developer), I don't find any transferrable skills. Right now, I don't want to manage a business. Maybe later when my body is too old for the demand that I'm putting on it, but right now, I'd rather be the guy who actually does the work. It's much more rewarding.
It's been about 3 years so far. I have work scheduled well into next year. That may not continue, but if I don't lower my standards, I think the referrals will continue. Most of my customers are thrilled with my work. The way I look at it, I'm not there to paint their kitchen (or whatever it happens to be), I'm there to make them happy. Usually, my customers are eager to pay me. It's a good feeling and that's what I'm in this for. It sure ain't to get rich.
As for dealing with others in the trades, I have found that they expect the same things as anybody else. Just be yourself, be honest, be eager to learn and willing to work and you will get respect. I work alone because scheduling is such a challenge. Just to choose random numbers, with 7 employees, you could afford a little down time for each one. With 2 employees, they had better be working all of the time. Since I can't always predict the duration because of the kind of work I do, scheduling is my biggest challenge right now. Sometimes I can intersperse small jobs between big ones. That gives me better flexibility. Sometimes, they're all small jobs. I like doing them, but they pay the worst.
If you're asking for advice, I would say stick with your (hopefully) good paying job for as long as possible. My life and the life of those around me was much easier back then. Try to save as much as possible and learn about running a real business (unlike me) in the meantime. If you get caught short, grab a paintbrush and start knocking on doors.
-Don
I can't thank all of you enough for your advice and support. Knowing that other people have done this successfully has given me a huge confidence boost. If you could buy a round on the Internet, I would.THANKS!!!!
"And I *did* look through the archives for similar threads before I posted this one. (That's how I know I'm going to get flamed.)"
Had to laugh when I read that. This type of question gets asked a lot, and that's generally the first thing I suggest.
I think you're the first newbie who's ever done that before he posted this kind of question. (-:
I *did* mention that I've been working with computers for a while. When I first got on the Internet the WWW didn't exist yet, and we had to walk for five miles in the snow just to retrieve our email.(And I've been lurking here for over a year, so I've seen what happens to people who aren't familiar with the local customs. *Especially* wannabe contractors.)
you can certainly do it.
I moved from a job as a chrome plater----hot, dirty, dangerous and low paying
to roofing and increasing amounts of carpentry( hot,dirty, dangerous & better paying)
Stan Foster here is by far the most successful example of switching careers that I can think of---he is a freakin' artist.
you have very real advantages doing this----you will certainly think outside the box and you will achieve things that those who "know better" would be unable to accomplish( ignorance IS bliss).
You WILL make some incredibly simple and obvious mistakes----but those can be outweighed by things you bring with you from another field. Most of what we do is pretty simple( maybe not easy---but simple)----the secret is to be paid well for it.
the most $$$$$$$ beneficial thing I brought with me from Chrome plating was the knowledge that you can take something rather simple---and convince your customers that it is the most difficult/dangerous/ beautiful thing ever----and they will pay OVER the " market rate" for it-----and stand in line to do so.
Drywall repairs????---nooooo, you are a plaster restoration craftsman!!!!
the more simple and unpleasant something is----the more you can charge for it.
you can do outrageously well at this----no reason at all you can't make more than you did in IT----If you can handle the right customers.
Very best wishes to you, stephen
>Drywall repairs????---nooooo, you are a plaster restoration craftsman!!!!<I understand what you're saying, but I would be careful with that one unless you really know the trade.It's like the time a kid I knew fresh out of highschool mowed lawns with his 20" walk behind and his junker station wagon decided to advertise himself as a 'landscaper'. You can just guess what happened.
Jer,
you are right to urge caution------especially in the scope of work,
however------when you find out you can charge over $400 to patch in a ceiling area 18"x24"----and with the miracle of durabond---it doesn't take that long----------- you start developing your ceiling skills in a hurry.
Best wishes, Stephen
Yup. I hear you. I remember when I was first starting out in the trades, I was maybe 23 and I would tell people I could do something for them and then be up late that night studying any books and materials on the subject of what I was to do the next day. I got through it and learned.
Haz, I agree. There's gold in ceiling patching!
Ten years ago I got about $1200 for a very simple ceiling patch that looked like it would affect the walls and ceilings (and the expensive wallpaper). I've considered doing it still but it just doesn't fit well with out operation. If I was focused more on that type work, I'd be gunnning for stuff like that.
blue
Yes you can do it. Do a search for Sonny Lykos. You will find a number of threads by and about this man which will give you business insight into the trades and specifically handyman work.
Thanks! I've been reading Mr. Lykos' posts here for at least a year now (and I recently started looking at JLC, where he also posts), and he seems to be describing exactly how I would like this to go. (I was even going to mention him in my initial post, but I didn't want to look like some sort of nerd/stalker.)
Thanks to everybody for the advice and support. (I'm a little disappointed that I wasn't flamed, though.)My plan is to spend the next two years doing jobs on the side so that I can build a client base, get my finances in order, and improve my planning and estimating skills. Then when my youngest child enters (free!) kindergarten I'll make my move. I just have to make sure I don't get so enamored of this idea that I forget that I still have a real job that needs to get done.If everything goes according to the plan that I haven't finished yet, I should be able to hit the ground running. (I expect it'll be more like tumbling and flailing, though.)Thanks again to everybody who's responded.
speaking of Sonny ...
just talked to Steve Merrette yesterday ... Sonny "mentored" Steve thru his career change from some sorta computer deal ... after he got laid off ... Steve made the jump ... then jumped from Philly, PA to sunny Fla ... ala ... Sonny.
Steve's busy doing smaller handyman type jobs charging a steady $65/hr and loving his new life. Said after the most recent hurricane(s) he can't drive into a condo parking lot w/o be swarmed by home owners ...
So "is it possible" ... I know of one guy ...
Jeff Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
I did (am doing?) pretty much the same thing a couple of years ago. After 30 years of engineering, I was laid off and couldn't buy another job. I had grown up around the construction business and always did my own work on my houses - and helped friends and neighbors with some of their projects. It was slow going at first, but this year has been good and I'm booked solid through Xmas.
A couple of tips, if I may -
Get all the necessary licenses, insurance, etc. Being legitimate can give customers a "warm fuzzy" and protect you from many problems. It also separates you from the jokers with an old pickup and a collection of beat up tools.
Don't be afraid to tell a prospective customer if you aren't comfortable attempting their job. I've done that from day one and it's paid off. They seem to appreciate the honesty and I often get other business from them or their friends.
Don't be ashamed of calling yourself a "handyman". There's a lot of that sort of work out there and most people are willing to pay a fair price for a good job. Some are just shopping for low prices but you'll soon learn how to spot them - and avoid them - lol.
Try to hook up with a real estate office. Most sales will involve some repair work and most of it is pretty straightforward. I usually get the inspection reports and give them a bid on the items I can handle - and give referrals for the things I can't (or don't want) to do.
Run ads on Craigslist if it's in your area. I used it for the first six months or so and got several jobs. You'll get quite a few "tire kickers", but there will be some good ones as well.
I could probably keep going, but it's time to get to work - lol.
Good luck to you.
I too, was in IT for 23 years. Took an early retirement package in 1998 from a major long distance company and went to work for a small internet company. Was laid off in 2001 due to projects drying up in the wake of the 9/11 attacks. I started painting houses and doing small jobs to make ends meet. Since then I started a part-time software consulting business which pays the bills. I still do home jobs on the weekends...for instance I recently replaced a customer's rotted exterior window trim. Another neighbor liked it so I did the same for him. That's pretty much how I generate leads. My dilemma is knowing how to price a job, but that's a learning process. I'm making less money that I did in IT but I'm much happier with my life and with much less stress. I am thankful for my corporate experience, the nice 401K, the training, etc. but I would never go back into that environment. Happy trails.
I spent ten years in Engineering, working my way up to Engineering Manager. Started with one company as a tech, worked up to tooling, then new company designing, then working with salesman and customers, then became management. I gained a lot of business skills, especially while working with the salesmen & customers.
All the while I was bringing home a nice check, and so was the wife. We were living well within our means, and I had a lot of disposable income to buy tools with. The hobby was woodworking and working on our old house, doing any projects, just about.
Big corporate guys came in and chopped heads, closed the plant. Wife pregnant. Long discussion ends up in: I'll be the one staying home with the kid, while she continues the job she loves (with great pay and benefits, and summers off).
Did a few odd jobs for friends, then people started asking, "Can you do...?"
Being an Engineer by heart, of course I said "Sure!"
I became a Handyman, got some cards, insurance, etc.
There is an endless amount of work, if you have the right skills. I happen to be able to do all the trades, from wiring in a sub-panel to gutting a bathroom to the studs and redoing it all by myself.
If you have a house, you have a list. So many customers say, "While you're at it..." which is just more sales.
My biggest problem is estimating. I've been doing this for about 5 years seriously, but the jobs are so varied that it is hard to tell how long any one will take. Fortunately, a lot of my customers trust me enough to pay me by the hour, and know they're not getting screwed. Plus, I'm getting better at estimating. There is no one right formula.
Most of the work I do is stuff that carpenters, electricians, plumbers, etc. don't want to be bothered with.
Anyway, I agree with the post that said it's a good way to ruin a hobby. My house is now like the proverbial shoemaker's kids going barefoot.
The other thing to keep in mind: you said the thought of being in a cubicle for the next 30 years horrifies you: Will you be able to crawl around basements, attics, and up & down ladders for the next 20 or 30? I'm only 41, but my knees are really feeling the switch from 10 years behind a desk to tuckpointing a chimney. My back is too.
Overall I enjoy what I do. I'm still at the stage where I'm not quite full time, keeping the flexibility to take care of the kid, which is THE best job in the world. Also, the wife has great benefits, so that's a cost I don't have to deal with.
Make sure your rates are high enough (a buck a minute) and that you markup materials. When quoting, make sure to add time in for setup and clean up. Pad your estimates to account for your inexperience at this stage. You will lose bids, but you do NOT want every job that is out there. Also, tell the client if something is too big or not within your skill set. It will pay off.
ALWAYS be honest, but remember that you're in it to make money.
Another LARGE hurdle I need to overcome is that when estimating, I look at the numbers and think, "Jeez, I wouldn't pay that!!" But remember, people are calling you for a reason. They ARE willing to pay someone $60/hour to install a toilet paper holder. They don't have the tools, the time, or the inclination, or don't want to deal with the mess. Writing a check is SO much easier.
Good luck. Sorry for the long post. Email me if you need anything.
Pete Duffy, Handyman
pete...<<<My biggest problem is estimating. I've been doing this for about 5 years seriously, but the jobs are so varied that it is hard to tell how long any one will take. Fortunately, a lot of my customers trust me enough to pay me by the hour, and know they're not getting screwed. Plus, I'm getting better at estimating. There is no one right formula.>>>
i bet your real problem is not estimating.. you're an engineer.. i bet you can break the job down real well and get all the unknowns in a little black box..
the real problem with most is that when they get done with th estimate , they look at the number and say..... damn, if i was more efficient, or i had more experience, i could do better than that..
truth is... especially in remodeling.. most can't .. but they will nudge the estimate to align with unreality.... in other words.. i bet if you went back over your estimates , you'd find that your original estimate was fine.. but you didn't have the nerve to sell the job for that number..
the thing about experience is knowing that you really do have to sell the job for your numbers...not some pie-in-the- sky number out of an estimating book
of course, as in most things ... i could be wrong
but, hey, whadda i no ?Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Mike, Have you been looking over my shoulder while I was bidding jobs.Sad to say, but you just described me to a T. My grandfather was a farmer and a carpenter, depending on the season of the year, and he used to say if you can't make a dollar, make 50 cents.I think that old saying hurt me for a while but I am getting much better at sticking to my price or staying home.I keep reminding myself that some people make it a practice to toss out the lowest price when getting quotes anyway.Those are the ones I want to work for.....Anyway, your comment was absolutely true!
>the thing about experience is knowing that you really do have to sell the job for your numbers...not some pie-in-the- sky number out of an estimating bookof course, as in most things ... i could be wrong<No, you're not wrong my friend. You have just named the #1 thorn in all our sides...even to that of the ornery customer. At least it feels good not to be alone.
I switched from being a Dilbert (15+ years as planner) to first being a framing carpenter, then a short stint as a jeweler's apprentice and now I've been working with a guy doing mostly remodeling. I like this better than a job in a cubicle working for insane, evil, or just plain stupid bosses.
I too was cubicle based for about 13 years before I took the plunge into what I should have been doing all along. I was in publishing. Had that conversation with my Dad after college about "what are you going to do with an English degree" and I said, "Be a carpenter," and after he finished laughing I said, ok, publishing. Good answer he said. Wrong answer for me, (as my last editor could definitely confirm) but that's too much boo hoo hoo for this post.
Yes you can do it and I think there's been some good advice here, particularly about being "legit" with insurance, licenses, etc. The stuff others wrote about not doing what you know you can't do is also important. Don't screw yourself--it's ugly for you and for your customer. One caveat to that is if your customer is willing to pay you to learn, go for it. I've had customers do that and it's frankly worked out great in all of the instances where we set it up. I gave them an estimate, came in pretty close on my time, and badda bing, I learned something new and got paid for it. Honest goes a long way.
Your skills from the IT world will help with big proposals, but your biggest hurdle is to not overthink things. It's only trim, man. If it's a big project, then go do your scenarios, proposals, cost estimates, blah blah blah, but if you're doing handyman work, just get busy--do it quick, do it well and leave the place cleaner than when you arrived.
Under promise and over deliver. Every time. And if you can't do that, just do what you say you'll do for the price you say you'll do.
AND DON'T FORGET ABOUT CHANGE ORDERS. In your truck, keep a dozen blank copies of Change Order Agreements, so when Susie Homeowner says, "Gosh, I really would love it if you could also paint the base molding too...", you've got a form to fill out, for her to sign and all is good when it's time to get paid. I cannot tell you HOW LONG it took me to learn to do that.
Some people are natural business people. I am not. I would much prefer doing the work rather than getting it, coordinating it, etc. Thus after working for myself on and off, I've signed up with a good crew. It works for me because of my interest. You may be different.
If you do get a "crew", and you want to be the guy running it, then get some one who will be your lead/foreman that you trust and that you pay handsomely (preferably tied to the profibility of the business). He/she will be what sets your business apart from other jack-leg carpentry crews, i.e. you have someone who gives a damn on the job site. I worked for a great company that had a guy like that and he was a god-send. He was also an butt head at times. But that's his job.
What you said about waiting a year sounds really smart. Minimize your need for income during the first year of business because you'll likely want to invest more into the business. Take this year to get to know as many contractors as possible and what they do well (or don't do well...). Walk on to job sites, be friendly, don't get in their way, (bring beer on a Friday...). These crews will be good to know about in case you get in over your head or better yet, have a big job you'd like to sub out.
Good luck and email me if you'd like a longer version of all of this (ha ha...but I'm serious...).
Tim
After I gave you those pointers this morning, I thought of another that's possibly the most important of all.
When you get ready to make the big jump, find yourself a good accoutant and have him/her help you set up a good book keeping system and figure out your billing rate. Don't be surprised to find that you need to bill at $50 - $60 per hour to make it work financially.
I would also strongly recommend that you get Quicken or Quickbooks (or something similar) and learn to use it well. I set up business accounts and run virtually everything through my business credit card or ATM. Once a month, I download my bank statements into Quickbooks. Sure makes things easier. - lol
Once a month, I download my bank statements into Quickbooks. Sure makes things easier. - lol
Could you elaborate?
I want to know how to do that.
blue
If your bank has online banking, any way to check your statements online, this is a standard feature. Chances are you do - they're all pushing people to do this online because it saves them in paperwork. To find it just go to the bank website (http://www.wellsfargo.com or whateever) and they'll almost always have a link somewhere to sign up.From there, when you view your statement online there will be a link to download it in a number of formats but quickbooks is the standard one. Quickbooks will have some way to import the data, I'm not set up in QB yet so I can't tell you were to find it.-sp.s. Also, ex-IT person moving into the trades though I had a landscape business 8 years ago so it's more like a return trip for me.
Thanks Storme. I'm already set up with my online banking, but I hadn't used it yet. I'll look for that upload feature.
blue
I'm using Quickbooks Pro Edition 2004 and have my business accounts (credit card and checking) with Bank of America. When it's time to do the bookwork, I open Quickbooks and start the Banking Navigator. Click on Online Banking and follow the instructions. If I remember correctly, I had to get things set up with the bank before I could do this.
When I click on Online Banking, I get into the B of A website and can download whatever statements I need - up to a few months back.
There's more to it than I can easily describe here so you might need to talk to your bank (or a Quickbooks guru) to get the details. If you have an accoutant or book keeper they may be able to help you.
I do virtually everything with either my credit card or ATM (I've written a total of 28 paper checks in the two years I've been in business). When I download the bank statements, all I have to do is assign the transaction to the appropriate catagory (materials, tools, owner draws, etc) and I'm done.
Go for it.
If you throw yourself in at the deep end its quite amazing how fast you can be up and running.
2 years ago my former employer got abusive and demading one time too many. 10 minutes later I was self employed.
There were times when I have wondered just how to get the money to pay a bill, but it always came through. Now I have more work than I know what to do with. I just called a mate and asked if he could take some of it, I got that much.
Read lots, be very very nice to the customer, clean up after yourself, take your shoes off at the door ( women like that ), return calls..........price wont be the biggest factor after that.
I learned fast that what looked like an astronomical number for a job would actually be very reasonable for the customer. NEVER back down on a price.
So far, no nightmare customers, never been screwed.
Best of luck to you
Whatever it was.................I didnt do it.
>Can you run a construction business with just subs? As much as I like doing the actual work, I have a funny feeling that I should try to focus on management/accounting/marketing/anything BUT the actual labor. Can business knowledge compensate for a lack of practical experience? (I know it's common for people with practical experience to fail as business-owners, but I'm sort of hoping that it's less of a problem in the other direction.)<
That's the one. You're fine, just do it.
J - Great post - very well thought out, well written, and insightful!
I'm approaching retirement from a high tech career and pondering a lot of the same things ('over-confident hack' fits me perfectly). I concluded that moving into the trades in almost any capacity would still leave me working for others - granted, you get to pick your customers, but as you can see from the endless horror stories on here, you can't avoid getting bad ones now and then. I decided that the best approach - for me - would be to buy, renovate and sell homes - acting as my own GC, doing as much work as possible, and being my own customer. It takes some upfront cash and the ability to support negative cash flow, (and the ability to fund expensive OJT) but it leaves you working for far fewer people. I think my real bosses are myself, DW, and the building inspector - nobody else gets to tell me what to do.
Good luck in whatever you decide to do. The collapse of the IT employment sector is tragic - I know a LOT of people affected.
Bill -
"Flipping" houses can be very lucrative but it can also cost you your shirt - lol. It takes a lot of discipline to set (and stick to) a budget to purchase and fix a house for resale. Overspending can push your resale price beyond what the market will bear and you may find yourself stuck with a house you can't sell for what it's worth.
Also, make sure you completely understand the tax implications of "flipping". Dear old uncle Sam will want his slice of the pie and you don't want to see your profit disappear into the black hole we call the IRS.
Here in CA, everybody thinks flipping is a fast track to wealth and even the fixer-uppers get top dollar. A few years ago, I went with a guy to look at a house that had been reposessed by the bank. The place was a real train wreck. Broken windows and doors, termites, dry rot, leaky roof, and lots of illegal modifications.
There were 10-12 people there and as we walked around listing the problems, I noticed that several of them were following us and frantically scribbling notes every time we said anything. I felt like a freaking tour guide!! If I remember correctly, I told the guy that it would take at least $75,000 just to get the place back to move-in condition - and even more to make it "nice".
I never found out who got the place, but I heard that it sold for around $5000 under the comparable prices for the neighborhood.
Hey JP, good luck!
I'm in a similar boat, I had a landscape business 8 years ago, quit that because I got burnt out on it, have been doing techie work for the last few and am now ready to return to the trades. Just submitted my first full proposal for $18k and the first words from the client were: 'Oh, that's not so bad!' in the course of discussing the proposal she mentioned some other things she wanted and now it's up to $28k, I'll find out in the next few if I have a client but it's looking good. Wish me luck!
The comment about 'good way to ruin a hobby' is dead on and very relevant. Make sure you figure out how to keep enjoying the work, I didn't and ended up burning out. Now that I'm diving in again I'm realizing that part of the reason I quit was that I was always running scared, faking it too much and sometimes getting it wrong. If you have any engineering cojones at all, it will drive you crazy to build something and realize later you did it wrong.
I also employed my friends and when they stopped showing up for work I had to decide whether they were employees or friends, I opted for friends but boy did it suck. Another thing I did wrong was not really cultivating or evaluating subs properly, going with people I knew instead of really good subs, find a great carpenter and ask them who they use.
The big thing that's changed in the last eight though is that the internet has arrived and you can research things up the kazoo, call the manufacturers, ask questions of the excellent people on this board, find obscure tools and widgets, etc. etc. I highly recommend spending *way* more time on this board and generally surfing than may seem wise. It's made all the difference in my confidence to know that even if I haven't done something in 8 years that I'm using the right materials for the right job in the right way.
So here are some things I've gleaned that will save you many hours of research:
Subscribe to FHB and JLC. Buy access to the JLC library and check out their many excellent articles.
Go get 'Running a successful construction Company' by David Gerstel
Jerrald Hayes, of this board has a highly regarded spreadsheet that can help you figure out your overhead and billing rate. Read his post in this thread: http://tinyurl.com/crr9
Quickbooks for construction accounting seems to be the way folks are going, I'm not set up yet.
Tools:
Dewalt miter saws
Bosch routers
Thomas compressors
Hitachi framing and coil siding nail guns (finish too?)
Festool jigsaw (actually Festool everything but very expensive way to go)
Eurekazone EZ-Guide Smart guide system with a circular saw instead of a table saw (haven't used, heard people gush about it)
All generally get the nod for best in class, lots of other good tools too of course. I'm not an expert so others here might want to comment on this list but I've been following discussions for the last year or so. Drills? dunno, I have a Bosch so I haven't been paying attention. Cordless tools, same deal.
Great catalogs:
Lee Valley
Enco (metal working)
Northern Tool
Jamestown Distributors (Boat building)
Grizzly Industrial (wood shop)
Finally, you mention knowing your clients, that's really a key advantage, I have the same advantage and it matters hugely. You'll do fine on this alone because you'll have the professional conduct thing down, something which is sadly missing in the trades. Always call people back and you're already ahead of the game.