During a kitchen rehab, I was pulling out an old wall cabinet and scratched the side of the client’s brand new fridge. Didn’t think it was too bad at first, but then while trying to touch up, realized they were scratches instead of just marring from the cabinet finish.
Client is upset and wants me to replace the $1,200 fridge. Ouch. But, I goofed. But client is not open to any other solution, such as a full pantry cabinet or a panel to match the new cabinets. Too bad.
Scratches are light, with some slight creases. But it WAS a brand new appliance.
t/u paint on the scratches helps, but catching the light just right makes them visible. The scratches are on the right side, but unfortunately in this install, the RH side is exposed. If the RH side were against the wall, there would be no problem.
Chicago area. Make me an offer. White Kitchenaid, side by side with ice/water dispenser 25 cu. ft. (KNSI25WH Model#)
Also, wondering what most of you might think about having to replace this. I’ve so far had people tell me to tell her to pound sand or come up with a reasonable alternative. What would you do? (other than moving it out of the way before demolition, duh!)
Thanks.
Pete Duffy, Handyman
Replies
Pete,
See if they place you got it from will take it back. Of course they won't give you a full refund, but some places will take damaged goods back and resell them as such for a discount.
Already went to the appliace store where it was purchased. Nice guy there, but the best he could do (other than let me use his appliance cleaner and paint for free, and a little sympathy) was give me the same deal he gave them, and they bought a package and I'm buying only a fridge. Tried to see if he had a floor model I couold swap with, but no luck.Pete Duffy, Handyman
well, how would you feel if it was your house or how would your wife feel
Yeah, I (and the wife) would be upset, but would also be willing to negotiate something. BTW, this happens to be a neighbor, and I'm working for 10% less than I normally charge, trying to keep the costs down for them.
I would be willing to have a new cabinet installed or a panel cover it, or a cash incentive or something.
At first they wanted me off the job right away after that. Then while trying to strip some drywall themselves, they called me back about 4 hours later and wanted me to continue. So I am.
I know the right thing to do is to replace it, and I am. And I'm not grumbling too much about it, just the way it was handled. I don't like taking that much cash out of my pocket, but I know it will come back to me eventually.Pete Duffy, Handyman
>>Also, wondering what most of you might think about having to replace this. I've so far had people tell me to tell her to pound sand or come up with a reasonable alternative. What would you do?
I am pretty sure you know the right answer.. it is just not what you want to hear (isn't it always that way).
The tough part is actually DOING what is right. Now suck it up and do what is right.
Yeah, yeah. Would you lend me some $$, about a grand?
Just blowing off some steam here to get it out of my system.Pete Duffy, Handyman
Anybody in the area do surface repair? Look in the yellow pages under appliance refinishing. Should be able to get it finished to look brand new. Might have to throw a few C-notes @ the homeowner as a discount. I have items fixed all the time before move in , and nobody is the wiser. To bad in your case the homeowner knows what happened.
Ouch!
How big was/is the job? Does it mean you'll have to do the whole job for free? What kind of a dent does it put in you?
Put the ref on Craigslist. You should get 75% for it. Everyone uses this to get deals so be prepared.
http://chicago.craigslist.org
Can you install a side panel so it almost look like it's a built-in?
F.
Thanks Frankie. Never used Craigslist before.
A side panel would be fine, except client wants a new fridge instead.Pete Duffy, Handyman
Pete, this may be a shot in the dark...but....
Any chance you can sit on this for a few days? If there's still some time left on the job I mean. Sometimes folks like to freak out and hear themselves being assertive when the proverbial shiit hits the fan then after a day or two they cool out a bit. Sort of feel foolish for being so uncooperative over an honest mistake. Could work in your favor if they decide it's not such a big deal afterall.
I could be completely out of my mind though....wouldn't be the first time.
dieselpig - great idea!
Some cool down time would serve everyone well. Then bring in a sheet of plywood to show what the ref. would look like as a built-in. I know she wants a new one in mint condition but after a few days she might be a bit more understanding.
BTW, did you provide the appliances/ ref? Did you charge a % above cost for this - and I don't mean for installation? If it was new, why was it on-site during demolition? Had they been using it or was it there so they could think the kitchen was almost done - even though you were just starting?
F.
Those were my thoughts. We require the HO to get everything like draperey, art, furniture, etc out of the work area before beginning or to allow me to disclaim respoinsibility for it, even though we take drastic steps to protect it.
he is cutting them a discount 'cause they are neighbors, and letting them buy their own materials ( appliances at least) to help them out, disregarding the fact that the profit/markup is where the money comes from for the occasaionall occourance of this kind.
Pete - learn some more about standard business practices from this.
My liability insurance is a thousand bucks deductable, but I doubt I would make a claim on something this close. The rates would probably go up. This comes out of 'contingency' fund
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Piff-
I understand the business practice of marking up materials. However, my business is mostly as a handyman, and materials usually are negligible for most of my work. Most of my jobs are small, with the occasional bathroom or kitchen rehab. A $2,000 job is a big one for me. (no, I don't do a bathroom or kitchen for 2k!) So materials markup don't really amount to much, although they do help. Usually instead of a %age, I add a set amount as a delivery charge, which works out better.
This kitchen job (or partial job) is something I came in at the middle. She had already ordered cabinets, and the new stove & fridge were already installed. Basically I'm working for an hourly rate. I gave her an estimate (not a firm bid, I know you like to differentiate, and rightly so) and she is doing some of the work herself. I had her cover the floors, but I just goofed by not getting the fridge out of the way. The cabinet that was beside it was wedged in tighter than I thought.
The stove is now in her living room. No way I'll chance that, not even dust.
New neighbor, trying to help out, and hopefully get more referrals and business, which I know will come through.
Life is one big learning process.Pete Duffy, Handyman
For one thing she is the GC and that makes her ultimately responsible for the damage. She is running the project from the get-go and should have made more of an effort to protect her new appliances like not putting them in the immediate work zone.
If you were GC you would have a contingency fund built into your cost of doing business that would cover your liability, your liability insurance premiums and work related warrantee issues. People need to understand the difference when they hire someone by the hour.
All that aside, most resonable people would be happy to trade the scratch for a side ref. panel and a 24" deep cabinet above
All good points.
F.
I understand what you're saying about markup on materials, but Piffin is right. Part of doing business is charging enough to absorb the occasional accident or faulty part and being able to smile about it. When people ask me if they can supply materials, I explain to them that my markup (10%)covers my risk in handling and installing the item. They usually understand that. You're getting burned on this job because first you did it at less than your usual price, and now yo have to shell out of pocket for it.
Don't feel bad, I think we all charge to little sometimes. But learn from this.
Some handyman specialists recommend a 100% markup since they don't handle that much materials. Pete's system might in actuality reflect that, I don't know, but the point others have made is that the HO is acting as GC so she should accept some of the risk.
OTOH, a GC who has an employee who damages goods regularly would definitely fire him. This one sits somewhere in between, I think.
On of my plumbers has taken to charging a 15% fee on estimated value of all owner supplied materials and fixtures. Too many of them have a higher failure rate and guess who the insurance companies come after? a small leak can do a lot of damage in a few days. He figures the fee barely covers his insurance and headaches on those jobs but it discourages a lot of HO 'participation'
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
I do the same kind of work as you and I can only say that I truly feel for you. Thanks for posting because it helps to remember to watch out for what can go wrong. It might be worth it to contact the mfr directly although I doubt you will get very far unless they could hook you up with a dealer who really needed to move the same model.
john
I guess it mostly depends on how much money they owe you for work completed to date and how much you enjoy a fight. From a legal viewpoint, I think it's pretty clear they haven't incurred $1200 in damages, because the refrigerator still works. But that's not very useful if you end up spending thousands of dollars in legal fees to establish it in a court of law.
Personally, I would do everything in my power to get out of doing the job. Think of it as a sign from Ghod that you picked the wrong client, and be grateful you found out sooner than later.
If you are still serious, I will check w/my brother first thing in the morning. McHenry area, they are this close to getting a new fridge.
Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with Grey Poupon, a pitcher of Strawberry Daiquiri and 50lbs of CM's chocolates (it's been a long week).
I wonder if the appliance manufacturer would sell you a new case for the unit. The dealer where it came from should be able to find out.
Should be cheaper than a whole new unit.
The truly greedy are those who would take, by legislative or judicial fiat, the money and property of those who have earned it. [George Gilder]
Good idea and worth checking out. But from what I have seen they are foamed in place so there would be no way to replace it.
But having it "proffesionally" fixed is a good idea. The body shop or check for office furniture and appliacne refinishers in the phone books.
They work on site.
And he is not responsible for replacing with a new one. One repairing it.
This may be a stupid idea, and more trouble than it's worth, but could you get an autobody shop to fix it--or you yourself could put bondo on and repaint (spray) that side with the proper paint--maybe manufacturer has it (or appliance paint from hardware store?)?
Swing by your local auto body repair shop. I have heard of them fixing things like this before.
1.) Move it to your garage
2.) plug it in
3.) stock it with good beer
4.) send us all your address
Hi Pete,
From what you wrote in that thread it seems the customer is getting/asking too much. You said they practically threw you out, enraged...and were set on carrying out the work themselves.
That would have been a time to just forget about them. I believe they were getting emotionally ready to not pay any future bill ( since you owe the 1.200 $....)
Only when they found out they were inept/unable to perform they called you...again.
Use/communicate common sense: She was at risk/you were at risk. You should split the damage. I would offer my client 150 $ max. to live with the damage alt. your proposed solution (built in), alt. a repair-job.
Do it while you are still needed.
If you had made a scratch into their car...would you buy a new one?
Never discount your prices, nobody believes in your generosity anyway.
Regular price or gift...nothing in between. Some of my pestiest customers have been friends of friends, until I told them there are no rebates, discounts...It would leave everybody with the feeling: If he can give 10% - he will give 35% to the next guy. Of course you can quote 130 % and give anybody 25% off...but that is for other businesses.
And a job that you arrive in midway...with the customer helping...
best of luck,
Mathias M. Raulf http://www.raulfcarpenters.com
I agree with several other posters. Unless you had scratched my fridge through to the insulation, affecting the function, I would not expect a whole new fridge. If it can't be fixed like new, I would expect some financial recompense for the damage, but certainly not the entire cost - she paid more for the motor than she did for the carcass. Plus, I think she could be yanking your chain about it being a new fridge. I checked out the Kitchenaid web site and there is not a side-by-side (or any other) fridge with this model number listed. Either their web site is out of date or her fridge is. Is it possible that she would try and get you to buy her a new fridge to replace one that is a year or two old? Lastly, I wouldn't worry about getting references from her if I were you. Once she sent you off the job that's a pretty sure thing that she isn't going to be mentioning you kindly to her friends.
So while you did goof, I think she is being completely unreasonable. But then I'm just a homeowner, so take my advice for what you paid for it.
I just got off the phone with Kitchenaid (800-422-1230) and they said this model # does not resemble anything current or past. We even inverted some of the numbers according to the keyboard. Check it again and either go to the website.
http://www.kitchenaid.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/CategoryDisplay?cgmenbr=136&cgrfnbr=28578&catname=Refrigerators
and see if you could find it. Please let us know the results.
Man, I have too much free time.
F.
i think I would just walk, say goodby and leave her hanging.
OOPS! Wrong model #. That's what I get for trusting my memory.
Correct Model# is KSRI25FNWHPete Duffy, Handyman
Pete,
Call a couple moving companies and see if they can give you a reference or two for outfits that do cosmetic repairs on dinged appliances. As required, they can sand/bondo/prime and paint with paint that matches the manufacturer's original color.
You don't owe them a new fridge, and you don't have to eat the damaged one. You just need to bring it back to looking sorta purdy.
ABT does have that model number for sale at that price...so it seems that she is telling the truth and it is new.
This is such a tough call. I would check into scratch repair first (perhaps even calling ABT for references). Then I would try to sell it on Craig's List.
Most homeowners wouldn't know how to protect an appliance and a refridgerator is a bit large to move around a house easily (especially with doors). My dad used to call this kind of thing "tuition"...try to pay it once, learn from it and move on. I would tell the next client that:
The homeowner didn't handle the problem well. And that isn't someone I would want to do work for. But if you depend on work around the neighborhood, you can always say that you did the best you could by the homeowner, no matter what she says. That goes a long way with other folks.