I am thinking about having one installed on a San Francisco house; anyone have any practice advice or experience? Particularly “avoids” or “thinkabouts” in regards to brands, installations, etc?
Thanks
NotaClue
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Seattle area DIY - old bowling ball on a perch above and off to the side of the gasmeter, attached with eyebolt to piece of aircraft cable over pulley down to lever bolted to the normal gas valve just before the meter.
Thats not nice!
What's wierd is that I think he's serious.
However, I am more likely to go with a more typically packaged and manufactured solution.
NotaClue
I think he's serious
Quite serious:
Gravity has never failed, simplicity has the best reliability.
spring loaded contraptions, peumatic contrivances, etc are not as fail-safe as something based on simple gravity. Heck, use 2 bowling balls (or window weight, etc) for five 9's reliability.
Plus, the gas company valve was installed by the gas company so is grandfathered. In CA, after 2002 shutoff valves -edit (earthquake shutoff valves)- have to be on the customer side of the meter - purely political??, never researched the Why of that ruling, assumed it was the gas companies objections. Upstream sure is more fail safe due to the mass of the meter itself!
Edited 11/20/2005 2:30 pm ET by junkhound
bump, any other opinions, still wonder about the 2002 CA ruling/regs??
If the shutoff was before the meter, then the customer could shut off the meter, bypass it and so on...
But I like your approach.
~Peter
There already is a stopcock valve on the high pressure side ahead of both the meter and the regulator. So there's no extra advantage to a potential gas thief from having a seismic valve.
-- J.S.
> still wonder about the 2002 CA ruling/regs??
That started here in LA in 1999. My place was still a rental at that time, so I had to hire a licensed plumbing company to do the earthquake valve. They put it between the regulator and the meter, which I think is the best place. But they effed up the install and failed inspection over and over again. Finally, the gas company got sufficiently P.O'd to require that their guys do all seismic valves, and to put them after the meter.
So, clearly, it's all my fault. ;-)
-- J.S.
>>Plus, the gas company valve was installed by the gas company so is grandfathered. In CA, after 2002 shutoff valves -edit (earthquake shutoff valves)- have to be on the customer side of the meter - purely political??, never researched the Why of that ruling, assumed it was the gas companies objections. Upstream sure is more fail safe due to the mass of the meter itself!Could it be like elctrical service: the supplier is responsible up to a designated point: e.g. the meter? (Weatherhead for electric - and I forget the exact point on underground serices.)
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Sojourners: Christians for Justice and Peace
FWIW in MO the consumer was responsible from the connection at the main, althouth the meter was in stalled at the house.However, there started to be a problem with deteriating gaslines and the PSC mandated that the gas companies tested the service lines every few years and had a program to replace them.They also added a fee to pay for doing that.
Pardon me, MO (Missouri?) has earthquake codes and recommends automatic gas shut off valves?
NotaClue
Yes. Missouri.And the state has no code at all.I am in the western part of the state (Kansas City area) and AFAIK none of the cities have any earthquake requirments.But I believe that some do in the SE part of the state, in the New Madreas Fault area. But I have no idea about any requirements for gas line protection.But my comment was about where the gas co responsibility stopped adn the customers started.
Sorry; of course; I had completely forgotten about the New Madrid Fault...
http://quake.ualr.edu/public/nmfz.htm
Interesting to think about what's going to happen there the next time it lets go, since there's been very little prep for it...
NotAClue
Here in Michigan anything over 10psi we put an excess flow valve at the main, plastic service of course. no earthquakes here, this also helps if contractor hits service while digging.
> old bowling ball on a perch above and off to the side of the gasmeter, attached with eyebolt to piece of aircraft cable over pulley down to lever bolted to the normal gas valve just before the meter.
That's not too far from how ours actually work. They consist of a chamber with gas flowing through it from top to bottom. There's a valve seat on that bottom outlet, and a big steel bearing ball perched on a little shelf to one side of the chamber. Give it a good shake, and the ball falls from the shelf to the valve seat. There's also a plunger that you can push in from one side to put the ball back up.
They're called "Safe-T-Quake", maybe they have a web site....
Edit: it's http://www.stq.com, but it doesn't work at the moment.
This one does work:
http://www.earthquakestore.com/order_safetquake.html
-- J.S.
Edited 11/22/2005 7:05 pm ET by JohnSprung
Thanks for the history John, figured it was due to gas company being miffed about something.
I used to sell those starting in 96'
That one was the best design simple gravity + it had a sight glass so you could see the ball on the inside to see if it was tripped.
I haven't seen one with a sight glass to check the ball position. But the plumbing supply and earthquake supply vendors usually have a cut-away demonstrator on the counter. Something to play with while you wait for your number.....
-- J.S.
hey look at what I posted to Notaclue
http://forums.taunton.com/tp-breaktime/messages?msg=66071.18
That sounds like the best idea--simply gravity ball model with a sight window.
I'll head over to a plumbing supply store and ask to look at a couple.
In San Francisco, we take earthquakes very seriously.
After watching New Orleans, and coming to the distinct impression that if it really hits the fan here, NO ONE IS COMING TO HELP US...most people I know are taking them even more seriously.
NotaClue
This isn't the one I used to sell but it looks damn close.
The vertical model one.
http://www.gasvalvedoctor.com/valve.htm
Oh here is the one I used to sell---- I guess it's been a while it's dicontinued saf T quake
http://www.earthquakestore.com/gas_shut_off_valves_1.html
These are now required in the city of Los Angeles when an existing home is sold. So I would assume on new construction also. We needed to get an approved installer to do the work. In LA I believe the installers are self inspecting. Just make sure it is one you can re set yourself in the event of a accidental trippage or earthquake.
Good advice. We put one on a customer's home and a little while later the owner whacked it with a wheelbarrow as he rolled it down the side of the house. The plumber had to go reset it. The owner said he barely touched it.