Electrical-re: personal home
Coffee pot circuit. Breaker would trip from time to time. Reset breaker and everything ok for awhile. Last time I reset breaker, nothing happened. Breaker did not trip after resetting and circuit still dead. Question? Is the breaker bad or is what ever was causing the breaker to trip finally caused a open in the circuit or what? Any suggestions on tracking down the problem.
I guess one could say that I know enough to be dangerous. Was electricians mate in navy many, many years ago and I now design/draw residential lighting/wiring plans in my design business. Have helped wire a half dozen or so houses but know little about trouble shooting. (thought that the above might help in your response.) Thanks.
Replies
is the coffee pot the only thing on the circut???
remove everything from the circut and start the hunt....
suspect the coffee pot....
heater in the pot may have a live short and killed the breaker....
suspect the breaker....
it has tripped so many times that it is flat wore out...
suspect the circut....
bleed over from one leg to another...
faulty ground...
faulty neutral...
faulty hot...
loose wiring ( oropen circut) connection due to heat generated during tripping cycles...
start with unplugging the coffee pot and changing the breaker....
still trips??? look into the wiring???
not tripping??? put a load on that circut with another device but not the coffee pot... still good??? suspect the coffee pot...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
Thanks. This gives me what I needed. The only thing on this circuit is the outlet that the coffee pot is plugged into and a light above. I have eliminated the coffee pot. I will open up the light and duplex outlet and check that out. I would like to make as sure as possible that there is no short or open circuit that caused the original problem before replacing the breaker. I plan to disconnect/remove the breaker and check for continuity from outlet to outlet.
My thinking now is that since with the everything off or unplugged, with the breaker reset & not tripping, and the circuit still dead, it must be an open circuit or a bad breaker. Correct me if my thinking is wrong.
Again, thanks. This is the step by step that I needed.
you are correct in yur thinking....
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
What year was your house built? I'm asking because code nowadays require two kitchen small appliance circuits to serve the countertops. The smart installer wires the homerun box to a GFI, and runs the rest of the plugs on that circuit on the line side. This gives the regular duplex GFI protection, while saving money on GFI plugs. I find it hard to believe that just a light and a plug are served on that circuit. If that truly is the case, find the current draw of the coffee pot and add it to the current draw of the light (in Amps, your light will be in watts, but devide wattes by 120V to get the amp draw). That number should be 16Amps or less (80% of 15 if it is a 15 Amp breaker serving the coffee pot and light). It really isn't as confusing as it sounds. If your math checks out, than you need a new breaker. If your plug isn't a GFI, than your kitchen needs a GFI breaker.
I think you meant to say load side.
Yes I did, the sticker will have to be removed.
The house was built in 1929, but this wiring was done in 1972. I did a little bumb-out at an existing window just for a coffee center. A light and the coffee pot is all that is on it. There are three other 20 amp. circuts in the kitchen. Also 1972 therefore no GFI's.
what brand breaker/service do you have and do you have aluminum wire????
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
Sq.D All copper
move the breaker to the head of the suspect list....
are you using the coffee pot on another circut and is it doing fine...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
yes
Repeatedly tripping a breaker will eventually cause it to fail.
But one has to wonder why a coffeepot would cause a breaker to trip. Is this a standard residential coffeepot? What amperage is stamped on the breaker lever?
It's a 20 amp. breaker. Yep. A standare 12 cup by Black & Decker.
The breaker should not be tripping. Something's wrong.
The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable. --John Kenneth Galbraith
You are so right, I do have a problem. I am looking into it. Hope to have an answer today.
If you feel safe doing so, pull the bad breaker from the panel and examine the bus bar behind it (and the contacts on the breaker) for scorch marks. It may be that the breaker was making poor contact and that was causing it to trip. (The poor contact results in heating which "confuses" the breaker.)(Note that if this is the case you should probably abandon that slot in the panel, or only use it for a low-current circuit.)
The only function of economic forecasting is to make astrology look respectable. --John Kenneth Galbraith
What was the amperage on the coffee maker?
Problem solved. Of course it was the last place I checked. I installed a new breaker and checked for corrosion on the bus. I checked the light outlet, the switch outlet, the duplex outlet and everything looked OK. Finally I noticed a small hole in the bottom (cover) of the LB where it turned up into the soffit of the bump-out. The hot was burned completely into. (in two. or however you say it) and the hole in the cover. I have no idea what caused it to short. Maybe a break in the insulation and moisture would get in from time to time. Thank God for circuit breakers.
Want to thank everyone's for their input and help. Now if I just had something to sooth the aches in these old bones from all the climbing and crawling. I think I will have a Dos Equis. (or two)
Look at the wires on the receptical. One could be loose causing the problem
Get yourself a voltage detector like the one shown at this site its great for checking circuits.
http://www.amazon.com/Hioki-3120-TED-Non-Contact-Voltage-Detector/dp/B001GAEJ7I/ref=sr_1_15?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1226548954&sr=8-15
Never say anything bad about a person untill you have walked a mile in his shoes, by then you will be a mile away from him and you will have his shoes.
It's easy to find out if the breaker is dead. Simply put one probe of your volt meter on the neutral bus and the other on the screw terminal of the suspected breaker. If it is dead then you will see no voltage.
If the breaker is not the problem then you have to check the outlets on the circuit one-by-one to see if they are live. The circuit probably is daisy-chained from one outlet to another, so one broken connection, white or black, would disable all outlets downstream from it.
Check the connections on the coffee pot outlet first, then look at the ones upstream from it. Since you know which breaker controls the circuit, you can find all of the outlets by plugging a radio in each outlet in turn and listen for it to go off when you shut off the breaker.
Sorry Brucet9 yer banned, you didn't read all the posts, the guy found the short in the LB in the crawl space..annnnnnkkkk.
Try again.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
They kill Prophets, for Profits.
HeHe yer still up?Cops woke me up about the time you posted. Put my dog out and fell asleep. Didn't hear nothing. Guess the neighbor did.PS
I'm operating incognito. Been here a long time, you know me.
Ok, you have me thinkin.
Hey this is like a 60's game show.."to tell the Truth" or 'What's My line"..geezus gimme a new clue Wink.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
They kill Prophets, for Profits.
Yeah, I found it on the next page just after I posted.Won't you let me off easy just this once? Please please please!
BruceT