Last Friday the guy I have worked with 16 years and I installed a stained – glass window, supposed to be worth $300,000 – $500,000 (some special artist) as an insert into an inside frame just inside the new window we just installed. (I can’t post a pic due to security concerns).
We had the owner involved (hands on), but when he went to the lumberyard to get some special screws for the stop (he doesn’t plan to leave it with the house) we decided we needed to remove it and shim two corners about 1/8 each so it would be the same all around.
While we were in the process all of a sudden it hit me – I said, “C, this is pretty bazaar us taking this risk for 20/hour and no materials mark up!” Usually I don’t think much about that because it doesn’t have any value to me – beyond my wages. I mean I wouldn’t want it.
And usually I don’t think much about plunging a saw into a new countertop – though it COULD happen we all know (and they could tip something over on the “Antique Road Show”). But this just seemed like a “out of it” experience.
Have you guys had any jobs and thoughts like this?
Replies
Fonzie, its simple. You as a carpenter,should be already Bonded, and have insurance. The cost of the isurance is passed down to your client. If you take on a job with a half a million dollar object of art, call your isurance company, and ask them for a rider to cover the cost of the object, in case of what ever. The customer has insurance on this window, but its his insurance company, that will track you down like a dog! The cost of that rider, also becomes part of the bill to the customer. You and your buddy, do the work and get paid, and let the insurance company and client sweat it out!.............Pop
do the work and get paid, and let the insurance company and client sweat it out!
Exactly!
"All men's miseries derive from not being able to sit in a quiet room alone." Pascal
If I am involved then someone is paying a whole lot more that $20 an hour. DanT
I wouldn't take on a job working around something that expensive. It's just not worth the risk.
I know what ya mean.
I did a job for one of Bill Gates buddies.
Had some shower trim to mount on this custom imported italian marble.
Got out my sharpe ( see post 68451.9 ) & put dots where I needed holes & said call me when these have been drilled.
I cautiously avoided a job where we would trim out an existing plastered opening to turn it into a trimmed cased opening. The opening looked over a balcony at the head of a curved stair that wrapped all around a 16' Dale Chiluly glass sculpture. I'm thinking this is $250,000 or what? This work was for a good repeat customer, and I explained that though insured, I did not want to push the limits. We don't even do much install, and this would have been a favor. The HO said the glass was "no big deal" (!!?!) and we probably wouldn't have a problem. But I did back away and asked to only supply the materials, and let her find the installers. That was year ago, and I haven't heard from her since.
Several years ago I had a customer in a nice, unpretentious house filled with paintings. Carrying her new cabinets up the stairs, I noticed Picasso, Mattise and other known and notable signatures. These were not cardboard classics - they were the real things, and they were all over the house! When I went to the newly expanded Art museum here, there was a whole new wing with this nice midwestern couple's name on it, and all those paintings were now on display. These regular folks had collected for 50 years and had one of the best collections in the midwest. To talk to them, you'd think they were barely just off the farm. Very pleasant people.
Dave S
A glass art gallery downtown has some Chihuly's on display. Not sure if they're permanent or for sale.They used to be located in an area called the Short North. It's a stretch of art galleries, and every first Saturday of each month they all stay open until 9:00-10:00 at night for the posers to gather. It's a big event, actually. This glass gallery would get filled with people, and many of their displays were into the six figures. Blown glass, NASA-grade crystal, various sculptures, all highly breakable and mounted on pedestals that a 4-year-old could knock over.Wonder why they moved?
What do you mean by "NASA-grade crystal"? I don't know of any chandeliers in space.
NASA Crystal- I was at a Cape Cod Scallop festival, last late summer, when I saw these items for sale. It was cube of glass with a 3-dimension picture inside the glass cube. According to the person selling this NASA Crystal, she said, it was developed for the space progarm. What is unusual about the glass, is that it is almost flawless. The Russians sell a similar glass, but it goes by a diffrent name, of course. A two inch cube with a picture of a P-51 Mustang, sold for around 25 clams. It was very interesting paper weight....................Pop
You beat me to it. Yeah, the art gallery I'd mentioned displayed works by this artist who used the same grade of crystal. Much, much bigger pieces though. He also managed to do carvings that were then engulfed in this mass of crystal. Some of the pieces were bigger than me.were a lot more than 25 clams though . . . . ;)
Are you refering to the Riley Hawk gallerie?
"Are you refering to the Riley Hawk gallerie?"That's the one. Drive by the new location everyday now. Car seems to pull to the right when i go by (all that glass . . . just too tempting).
:)
You're talking about Swarovski crystal, right?
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
No, its not from Swarovski, which are located about 20 miles from me here in RI. They are now going into a lay-offs phase. They are having a hard time competing. So now they are starting to relocate their manufacturing to, I think Asia, as many of our jobs are at present, leaving us with the thought of banging nails or flipping hamburgers, me, I am somewhere between 60 and death, maybe I will stuff bags! Or knock out bird houses. LOL. Or make furniture, something............!
This NASA stuff, as I understand, is scrap, that is sold on the open market. Probably pays for its self and then some. ....................Pop
My next door neighbor had some interior painting done a while back. One of the painters tipped over a ladder or something, and managed to break the genuine, original-to-the-house Tiffany dining room chandelier.
Neither my neighbor or the painter were too happy about that...
My insurance co. does not offer riders for unique situations. We (most) NYC contrtactors carry $1 or $2 million in liability though.
Having stated that we are covered, we still charge more to hang a $5K chandelier than a $200 Home Depot chandelier, even though the installation is basically the same. Why? Because we are taking on a greater liability. Ever ask an insurance company to charge the same to insure a BMW as they do for a Hyundai?
In addition to this we still have the client sign a release from liability if the item costs more than $20K. They still pay a premium - because we take longer to ensure greater care in doing the work.
Better to have this headache before doing the work than after. This way you get to determine the terms and the client gets to make the decision.
F
There he goes—one of God's own prototypes—a high powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live and too rare to die.
—Hunter S. Thompson
from Fear And Loathing In Las Vegas
Dude, I am putting slate right above a door system from Germany that cost 18K per side, and there are two sides.
My HOUSE was only 30 K , my ins is 1million, the delay time for the job if we FU a door like that is months..these are patio doors that hinge and slide to open a 24' clear opening...talk about butt pucker.
I mentioned to my coworker today, we need to CYA's and shield with plywood..any farking ding would be blamed on us...so I'd say to you..CYA.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Save a few posts, fill in your Profile, we can help!
Paintings scare the heck out of me. Once upon a time while working on a punchlist shortly after the client moved in, and helping them hang things, it dawned on us that they were into art. Someone on the crew mentioned, "Those are nice prints." To which the owner proudly replied, "Those are the originals." Felt surreal actually recognizing some of them, like being in a museum. I didn't even want to work in the same part of the house as those things.
A friend's insurance picked up the $5k cost of an original 8" x10" something-or-other that looked like a highschool stick drawing when it fell off a poorly placed finish nail while triming the other side of the wall. After that, I'll always ask the owner to remove anything that is valuable from the area.
Only thing bizarre here is doing something like this for $20/hour. {:-) I thought you were putting up tents. How big was this window?
I hear ya. The window was 32 x 54 in a frame. It was a depiction of a peacock.
As a teen I once had a job repairing a porch. It involved hauling all the tools and supplies between a pair of $75k+ classic cars (back when that was a lot of money for a classic car). Very unnerving walking through there (alone) with a 32' ladder (for example). Don't think I would take that sort of risk today, and I'm not sure what the owner was thinking!
that weren't no porch, that was a bmw
How can you afford to do anything for anybody for $20/hr.? Much less handling something for a client who can obviously afford to pay you a lot more. By the time you pay your expenses(i.e. insurance, truck, tools) you must have about .50 cents left over for yourself. Your skill and knowledge not to mention the actual stuff you bring to the job is worth a lot more. I charge $47/hr. which includes profit for the business and I would definitely pad my timesheet a little for being responsible for such a valuable item. I have no trouble finding work because I do everything I can to be one of the best around and people are willing to pay for that. You need to read some of the threads on this website about how much people charge and why.
Don't let people get richer by under paying you for your work man!
Thanks dogfish for the good advice. It's easy to loose your perspective in this business I'm glad you mentioned that we aren't over priced. It helps to hear that this time of year - thanks. Fz
Edited 1/22/2006 12:52 am ET by Fonzie
Painter working across the street knocked on the door to appologize for backing into the clients car. I felt really really bad for him. A simple fender repair on that car would be more than the entire painter's van is worth.
Then he asked if she was really attached to the BMW. "BMW?" "Man, you're lucky. I thought the Jag was parked out front. The Beemer is just her crappy daily driver."