I am occasionaly amazed by some of the things I see.
We’re slow so I am tiling a small bath with one window and one door. On the second floor keep in mind!
The one carpenter that hasn’t been laid off yet comes up to trim out and apply MDF wainscotting.
So out of the corner of my eye I am watching him trim out the door and window.
First he cuts a (one) leg and nails it on, then the head and then another leg. He repeats this whole operation for the door.
Six trips up and down the stairs! And the reveals are all over the place.
I would have measured and cut both heads. Reveals are now determined.
With me on my trip up, I would also have four legs; mitered and long. Install heads, mark legs (turned upside down with points on the floor), return to saw, cut four legs, go upstairs and install. Two trips, tops, three.
Done.
Try to introduce a new technique to this guy and you would think you were asking him to change religions or political parties.
“This is the way I’ve always done it.”
Have you a better idea than mine? I’ll give it a try.
Eric
Replies
I would have carried up my little chop saw and my little shop vac.
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
Top floor of a tiny cape, 5x7 bath makes it a bit tight, but thanks for the thought. I'm not against trying it![email protected]
I'd have taken my time looking at the opening for squareplumblevel, measured everything up stairs, adding on the desired reveal, then cut it all downstairs.
One trip.
usually.
Then two more for my miscuts!
;-)
"Research is what I'm doing when I don't know what I'm doing..."
Then two more for my miscuts!
Then were even![email protected]
I see a lot of you say you mark the reveals then measure to the mark.
Curious?
If you know the reveal is 3/16 (EG) then why not measure to the egde of the jamb, then add the reveals?
That way no marks on stain grade? No marking."Research is what I'm doing when I don't know what I'm doing..."
I agree with not marking stain grade....but anytime you leave a reveal to be added (in your head) afterwards, you open yourself up to error.
It's also nice to get the visual. 3/16" is likely a most common reveal. But with certain styles of casings, or for various instances, 1/8" might be better....or even 1/4". Being able to "see" exactly what the reveal will be, is often of benefit.
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
Pp, Qq
This is an interesting thread...........I never mark reveals.
Do the math it keeps your mind sharp. I always measure inside to inside and add a good 5/16.
That will give me nice 5/32 reveals. Width of a nickel as I was taught.
That's one reason I do the heads first. I can always knock the head casing over to one side or another if I discover that it needs to be tweeked when I get the leg up to it.
[email protected]
When I'm doing stain grade, I'll make my reveal marks about a 64th" heavy.
When I nail on the casing, I just cover the marks.
BTW, I only put a few short lines to mark the reveals. I mark where the miters are, and then one or two down the jamb legs. I eyeball the rest. I do this on both paint and stain grade.
I'm a bit surprised that nobody has mentioned pre-assembling their casing. I've found that it works perfectly for me, but to each his own. Pre-assembly works great with a pair or two of Jim Chestnut's Clam Clamps, but can be done other ways as well. I actually stole this idea from Gary Katz's website but it works quite well. I keep a dozen or so scraps of waxed plywood cut dead square about 12" x 12". I measure the finished opening, paying close attention to the squareness of the upper corners - test pieces would work great here. Next, I mark my reveals with a gauge block and measure for my head and leg casings. After cutting, the head casing gets a plywood square spring-clamped to each end, flush with the top of the casing and tip of the miter. I dry fit the miter, apply a liberal amount of glue, and assemble, clamping the leg casing in the same fashion. A quick swipe with a wet tooth brush removes the squeeze out and the water gets chased away with a blast of compressed air. The wax keeps the glue from bonding to the plywood - BAD!!! I like to tack the miter with two 18g brads after assembly and that's it. I rack them against the wall to dry for a few minutes while I assemble the remaining casings and install in reverse order. I leave the plywood backing in place until I get the casing into place and then tack the entire unit into place. Might not work for everyone, but it works great for me. Would I do it every single time in every single situation? Not necessarily, but it does work well in a pinch if you're set up for it. Biscuits or splines can be cut in as well for a stronger miter but I don't lose sleep if I forgot the boat anchor, I mean biscuit jointer at the shop.
I've done that, too. I trimmed an entire house using bisquits in the miters, and clamping the trim assemblies with the Clam Clamps.
But I find those clamps only work well with the heavier, thicker casings. Regular colonial casing I just glue, nail, and clamp for a few minutes with the Collins clamps.
I neglected to mention the Collins Clamps, but yes, they work great in this application too.
Yeah, it's funny the way some people think. I learned long ago that when I am at work, time is money. Sad but true. If we are going to earn a living wage, we have to crank out the work, like it or not.
Yet this fact of life just seems to go over some people's head. I had a guy working for me once who seemed to go out of his way to drag things out. Once he had a little cut to make, a chisel would be nice but he could've pulled it off with the utility knife in his tool bags. But no, he has to go and find his chisel. And then he disappears. Where did he go? Turns out he had to hone his chisel.
Turns out he had to hone his chisel.
What? No cigarette?[email protected]
Didn't smoke.
if I can't take my little saw with me ... I'll make testers.
scrap's cut at 45 .... then a set at 44 and a set at 46.
I do the same with crown ...
just remember to mark them.
then ... walk around and take notes.
but I fot my little chop on many a small bath floor. I even have a small box fan for the small window ... then vac it up with that small shop van.
nail it on with the little gun, flex eel hose hooked up to the small compressor ...
it's ... a small world after all ...
it's ...
OK. enough of that nonsense.
Jeff
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
My guys do nonsense like that all too often. Frequently, the reason is they are afraid to tell me that the don't have a pencil.
We also have a cheap little 8 1/2" chop saw that makes it to some jobs where there's only a couple of cuts and the trim is small.
Ho
1. Check P, L, & S.
2. Mark reveals
3. Measure from the marks
4. Write down the measurements
5. Cut
6. Install
Tell your guy that he can run around the block at lunch time if he needs the exercise.
Jim
The awful thing is that beauty is mysterious as well as terrible. God and the devil are fighting there, and the battlefield is the heart of man.
- Fyodor Dostoyevski
I cut the opposing miters one one leg and the head.
Then test fit. If they need tuning, I use my block plane from my apron.
I then nail the leg, mark the other side of the head and the other leg, and cut them, fit and nail them.
I do take the time to see if the jambs are square before I start cutting, especially if I didn't set them. I'll also cut for all the windows or doors in a room at one time, so I'm not climbing stairs all day. I mark the backs of the casing as to location.
I always just mark the reveal at the head for the legs, install them, then
measure for the head cut and install that last. I always plane the back of both
miters on the legs a bit , then fine tune the head if i need to. I would say
theres just as many ways to do this as there are carpenters out there but I
think with this its only about 10- 12 different ways.
As long as the miters fit, and the reveals look good, there is no wrong way.
Ida done it like you suggest.
But that's cause I'm lazy and hate repetetive trips up and down the stairs.
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
Pp, Qq
JD is younger.
I'd have called you for the measurements and made one trip.A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
I think you might be observing the result of an hourly workers mentality, esp. one that might be thinking he needs to make the job last long enough to get to the next project.
Sure, he knows he could do it in less time, but what's his incentive for doing so? Run out of work and he'll be laid off like the others...