I’m getting to the point where I’m going to have to pick out light fixtures for the spec house I’m trying to finish. Most of them are easy – Ceiling fans with light fixtures and such
The thing I’m not sure about are the closets. I could just stick in the cheap porcelain (or plastic) single bulb fixtures. But I think they’re a fire hazard, particularly if the shelves are close to the bare bulbs.
So I’m thinking about going with a simple “globe” fixture, going flourescent, or ???
Any suggestions are welcome.
Replies
You are right, you can't use a bare incandescent bulb.
If you go to codecheck.com, electrical, roughin there is a drawing showing the clearances for different fixtures. If I did it correctly this should be a direct link to it. Scroll down about a page for the closet info.
http://www.codecheck.com/eleccode.htm#anchor1140040
Edited 4/3/2002 12:24:29 PM ET by Bill Hartmann
Bill -
You said: "you can use a bare incandescent bulb."
But the page you referred to says:"No open incandescent bulb type fixtures"
Did I miss something, or did you mean to say "can't" instead of "can". I wouldn't use them regardless of codes - I just think it's a bad idea.
.
I was hoping for some suggestions as to what type of fixture works well. Is flourescent better? Or should I stick with a cheap enclosed incandescent?
Boss,
I like incandescent in a closet because you can see the colors better to pick out clothes. Nowadays those who prefer flourescents can buy a flourescent bulb that fits in the incandescent fixture, if the fixture isn't too small. So my vote would be for a slightly oversized incandescent fixture. But then, I'm just a female and houses aren't really designed for us anyway :)
aimless, whadya mean, Houses ain't designed for females?
Ifn it weren't fir U gals keepin the hearth warm, we'd still be livin' in the trees.
Yo aimless -
Actually, your post is exactly the kind of input I was after. I had no idea that incandescent lights allowed you to pivck out colors better. (My bib overalls are all the same color)
Actually, I did try to design this house with a Woman in mind. I put 2 light fixtures in each closet so they would be dark little caves. And I put some elevated shelves (with spotlights) in the family room so you women could have a place to show off your junk. I mean stuff. Big kitchen with a short wall overlooking the family room. Snack bar in the kitchen, as well as a litle nook in the kitchen cabinets for a small TV.
Kinda getting off the point, I guess. But y'all have basically convinced me to go with enclosed incandescent lights.
Now - Should I use frosted globes, or clear ones ???..........(-:
Boss,
Nice start. Have women in mind? Put a light in the shower/tub. Those who aren't into the European look will love you for it. I could go on (and on and on, my husband might say), but the finishing phase is too late for many of the things I'd like to see.
Glad I could provide constructive advice.
Amy
> Should I use frosted globes, or clear ones
Frosted, for slightly softer shadows.
-- J.S.
Boss, Aimless, Lisa, and John,
In my remodel, the type of fixture and color of bulb were most important to me.
Walk-in closets got recessed cans with incandescents. Switched by motion detectors.
Reach-in closets, the laundry room, and under cabinet kitchen lights got fluorescents with Kitchen and Bath bulbs. Commonly known as WW or Warm White.
The issue of true color drove those decisions. My dark navy blue socks cannot be distinguished from black ones with cool white fluorescents. Even incandescents are tough to tell. The warm white fluorescents do just fine. They cost a bit more, but are well worth it.
Florescents in the closet are much cooler to operate. When switched by motion detectors or door switches, you don't run the risk of inadvertently leaving the light on. I highly recommend them.
"Reach-in closets, the laundry room, and under cabinet kitchen lights got fluorescents with Kitchen and Bath bulbs. Commonly known as WW or Warm White."
K&B blubs are not the same as warm white. You need to look at the spec on the special models. Below is a link for the GE lamp catalog.
http://www.gelighting.com/na/downloads/04_flu.pdf
In the F40/F34T12 series the K&B Ultras have a CRI of 82 while the WW a CRI 52. Lots of difference.
Also see http://energyoutlet.com/res/lighting/KandB/color.html
Thanks for the info. I'll check those type of bulbs out.
> My dark navy blue socks cannot be distinguished from black ones with cool white fluorescents
We had one that worked the other way -- one of my stepdaughters had a fender bender, and she was really happy with the new paint work when she picked the car up in the daytime. The match was perfect. But that night in the supermarket parking lot, the mercury vapor light made it look like two totally different colors. Flourescents are just low pressure mercury vapor lamps with a phosphor coating on the inside that converts the UV emissions of the mercury to visible light. The two green spikes of the mercury spectrum are present in both of them. Fuji has recently introduced a motion picture film with a fourth sensitive layer that picks up just a small band around the mercury green lines, and creates a kind of built in mask to counteract them.
-- J.S.
Here's a link to a nice elementary school level explanation of spectral lines:
http://www.colorado.edu/physics/2000/quantumzone/
-- J.S.
John, good basic spectrographic basics at your link. The one basic concept that almost everyone misses when talking about color is that what they are seeing is reflected light. It is the colors of the spectrum that are absorbed that determines what we see. This is the principle used by the paint industry in color matching paint. A good color match is no dicernable color difference when viewed under three different light sources of a McBeth Booth, and a delta e of less than 0.2 in the visable light spectrum.
Dave
Boss
"Did I miss something, or did you mean to say "can't" instead of "can"."
You need to get your eyes checked. It very clearly says can't. (AFTER I EDITED IT <G>).
If you look at the chart in Codecheck you can see that you can get closer to the clothes with flourescents or recessed incandenscent.
BTW, cheap strip flourescents often have CW or WW blubs with give poor color rendition (CRI). The CFL that screw into a standard socket have CRI's of 80 or better and give good color rendition. You can get good blubs for the stip fixtures. I see that the shelf labels are now indicating CRI's.
Edited 4/3/2002 12:36:50 PM ET by Bill Hartmann
CRI's are really kinda bogus. Flourescents simply aren't black body radiators, they have the two green mercury spikes, and they'll never give you adequate color. So far, I can always tell flourescent sources from incandescent just by the quality of the light.
-- J.S.
One thing I've always thought should be in walk-in closets is an electrical outlet. It would be great to be able to set a cell phone recharger or to hang a dust buster or to be able to plug in the vacuum cleaner in the closet. Could also be used for those plug-in air fresheners, a nightlight when kids are camping out in the closet, or to plug in a clothes steamer.
I agree about the incandescent light fixture with the frosted shade. And add under-shelf lighting if there are deep built-in shelves in the closet.
"A completed home is a listed home."
Many codes (in my area) require recessed fixtures in closets. Juno makes an incandscent recessed closet that you can get with a pull chain if you desire.
To understand the codes, and likely the inspectors, point of view one has to understand the hazards involved.
A long time ago only houses were commonly wired with a porcelain pull-chain fixture directly in front of the door. Usually the closet was around 2' deep with a 12" wide shelf along the back wall. This left the bare bulb only 8" or so away from a plumb line drawn from the edge of the shelf. The problem arises from 3 things happening.
1) A standard incandescent bulb is used.
2) This bulb is accidently left on after the closet is used.
3) The shelf is overfilled with a flammable material. A large blanket, comforter or stacked linens will do nicely and this hazard only gets worse with the more flammable synthetic materials are increasingly used.
With just a bit of bad luck the stacked blankets tilt forward and contact the bulb. Incandescent lamps are better at heating than lighting. They are only about 13% efficient at producing light. The other 87% comes out as heat.
In a matter of minutes a fire starts to smolder. Being in a closet this is not noticed until the fire is well established. Sometimes it will break into the attic before anyone notices. The entire house can be engulfed in a short time. Many people have died.
The requirements of the code a meant to avoid the problem and loss of lives. Installing a fixture that is not inherently low heat, florescent, or totally enclosed at a safe distance invites disaster.
Using a screw-in type florescent bulb is an interim solution in existing situation only. Installing a plain socket type fixture and mitigating the hazard with the screw in florescent bulb is not a good solution. It will work for a time. But the florescent bulb will wear out. It is reasonable to assume that the replacement will be the more hazardous and cheaper incandescent bulb. When this happens the old problem has returned full force. Because of this most inspectors will not allow the screw-in type florescent bulbs to replace a proper fixture.
Be safe. Don't try to save pennies on this issue. The life you save could be someone you love.
4lorn1 -
You're right, of course. And you express yourself well. But if you noticed a few posts back I said: "I wouldn't use them regardless of codes"
Sorry Boss Hog. I missed the line about you not using them regardless of code. My bad.
I get a little sanguine about some electrical safety issues. One of my teachers was a fire inspector with many horror stories and slides to back them up. A series on a particularly bad fire that started in a closet made a big impression.
He used to say that everything in the code in there because someone died. That's a little strong but not by much.