correcting home improvements that may have been completed without permits
I bought my house in 2000, in Carroll County, MD, with my now ex husband. We started a basement remodel, and I had to finish it. I hired someone, but not sure if all the permits were completed. We changed the half bath to a full bath, changed a hopper window to a full window, took down wood paneling to put up new insulation and drywall, added new plugs, and recessed lighting, replaced drop ceilling etc. but I don’t have the info of who I hired to complete the work and have no idea if permits were pulled.
Move fowared several years, I hired someone to add a deck and change a window to a slider. Again, no idea if permits were pulled. At lease this time I have the guys name I used….But now I am thinking I should have been more involved in the process and feel like I want to make sure things were done correctly.
So how do I go about getting things checked out and corrected if need be. I am also concerned about paying thousands of dollars I don’t have to fix my stupid mistakes. So wanted to do this in stages if possible. I was thinking it would be wise for me to check the deck and window first, since I have the guys name I used and may have some financial recourse against him, if needed.
thanks
Kimberly
Replies
Kim
I don't think you'd have much luck with financial recourse against the remodeler. Inspection might be able to fine him double the permit costs.............you too for that matter. Here, if no permit is pulled at the beginning and inspection finds out-the "fine" is two times the original permit cost (and a certain amount of bad blood spilled between builder/inspection.
If you need to prove proper construction of the deck, that should be easy enough, perhaps just a hole to prove footing-the rest should be visible to inspect.
The window/door..........well, not so easy if they wish to know header existence and size. You'd need to open up one side of the wall at the header (or if they would be gentle enough to do it by educated guessing).
What if you went to inspection and just asked if there were any permits pulled on the property address. You're the homowner and now with an ex husband, wish to know-you weren't kept up on this in the past. After securing that info you can proceed however you think is necessary.
Best of luck.
edit: The basement would be even more invasive. Electric might entail complete viewing of new wiring, same with the plumbing (thinking drain lines under concrete as well as what's behind the walls-venting etc.)
Maybe a home inspector
Calvin had a good suggestion on asking the local building inspector about permit history. If you can talk to folks in your community and find a good home inspector, that may be another easy route. It will probably cost you around $3-400, but a good home inspection can tell you a lot about what needs to be fixed/corrected. It won't tell you everything, because some things would require some demolition to truely inspect. Most problems will become evident with time, though. If the deck isn't settling after a couple of years, it probably has footings. You can look at the fasteners and see if the deck is properly attached to the house and supported. If the plumbing was severely screwed up, you would be having leaks, clogs or poor drainage, or some symptoms of improper venting. The electrical is the only thing I can think of that could be catastophic but not show much for symptoms. In my area, if there was an electrical inspection, there should be a sticker on the main breaker panel to indicate that... Keep an eye out for musty smells or stains on the drywall, any signs of water or condensation problems. A good home inspector should be looking at all these things.
First, go to your tax office and ask for a copy of the 'property card' for your home. This will show, among other things, how your taxes are calculated, the date the house was built, ownership history, and what permits were issued.
If work was done without a permit, you'll need to ask the building department and find what needs to be done.
Forget about going after the guys who did the work. They're long gone.
Now find some licensed contractors to fix what needs fixing. It's your duty to see permits are pulled THIS time. If it's not hanging on the window, better call the city yourself - and find another contractor.
It's possible that, as Mike Holmes so often finds, that it all needs to be pulled out and redone to get it right. There are a few reasons this is so: it's just as easy to fix a big hole as a little one, guys who cheat in one area often cheat in another, the work may reveal other problems.
So why bother? Well, there is the peace of mind that comes with being sure all is right. Just as important, you're avoiding other problems down the road shbould you decide to sell, or make an insurance claim.
Yeah, I think you should first figure out what (if any) permits were pulled and which ones were missed. You can probably check the records at the courthouse, or you can go to be building inspector's office and play a "distraught female" card and probably get some sympathetic help there. (BI's vary enormously across the country -- some are hard-arses who would toss a widowed mother with six children out in the snow for not having a signature on an addendum to a permit, while others don't really care (much) whether the permits are done so long as the work is safe and sound.)
Anyway, you can call the BI's office and feel them out as to what their policies are and how hard-nosed they tend to be. At the very least they can tell you (without you having to reveal your identity or precise location) which modifications required permits and which didn't.
You should try to recall who you paid to do some of the other work, in case you need that for permits. You might look back through old bank records for checks to the guys, etc. Or, if someone was recommended, ask the person who recommended them. Get yourself some sort of a notebook and write down in there everything you learn -- who did the work when, what the BI's office said about X, etc. Also try to put together a timeline of when each bit of work was done. Having it all written down in one place will make it far less intimidating.
a different opinion
While you certainly need to know if the work is safe & well done, having the permits on file may not be an issue. Across the river in VA, where I am, most of the rural type counties are very lax on the permit issue. Very lax on the inspections, too, at times, but that's off topic.
I'd suggest finding a reputable remodeler / GC and asking them if it's considered an issue locally before you put much time / effort into trying to find out. May not be any reason to worry about it............. if the work was done properly.
As others said ... first go find out from the building department if permits had been pulled. Don't tell them the details ... just say you want to know what's been done on the house in the past (even before you purchased).
A good inspector may be worth your money. A few hundred bucks with a target of the construction work in question may give you either peace of mind or not. Maybe you know someone knowlegeable in building sciences (e.g. plumber or electrician). Maybe they can help look a little at each trade to slowly reveal problems (if any).
Wow, surprised that you had the thoughts about the first renovation and then didn't follow through on the second project. Ultimately the homeowner is on the hook for the permit. Good contractors will pull a permit themselves, but it may not be their responsibility. Never pay a contractor a final payment until the inspection is finaled.
Check for a header over the sliding door. Use a finish nail somewhere in mid span and nail through the drywall in a couple of places 6-8 inches above the rough opening. It MAY not need a header, though if not in a bearing wall (e.g. gable end wall).
Let Sleeping Dogs Lie ...
otherwise they bite.
What the county or city does not know they don't know. If you bark up that tree and their were no permits you pay the price. But if as one other posted said you can go and ask to see what permits were pulled in the pasts all the way back to initial construction, you would have your answer. But I would not tell them xyz was done and ask if a permit was pullled.
If you have not had any problems with any of the work, you are probably ok. If that is not comforting, I would hire an inspector. He will not care about any permits pulled or not in the past.
I agree
with Dudley, more or less. Having a permit doesn't mean the work performed is of good quality. And not havoing a permit doesn't mean the work is not of good quality. I do unpermitted work from time to time, and its done well. Certianly acceptable by minimum code standards, usually better.
Are there specific reasons to doubt the quality of the work done? Does the silder operate well? Seem stable and sound? Look funny?
You must a friend, family member, coworker, aquantaince that you trust about these things. Ask their opinion. Don't focus on the issue of permits.
There is an important point that I don't think has been mentioned yet. In some parts of the country you can't sell a house if it has any unpermitted work. And, of course, in most parts of the country you can't sell a house that has serious defects. So if there is any expectation of selling the house in the near future these things need to be considered.