I am an owner-GC reviewing my lumberyard’s prices on the takeoff for the first phase: posts, drop beams, flush beams, joists, hardware (gobs of Simpson hardware), and deck. Can anyone point me to an online resource to help me see if his prices are reasonable?
In particular, I’m wondering about his pricing for treated PSL beams. I would have thought these would be only a little more expensive per unit volume than a high-grade plywood.
4×8 3/4″ T&G Advantech (2 cu. ft of lumber): ~$31
3 1/2″ x 16″ x 1′ PSL Treated (0.389 cu. ft of lumber): ~$34
So my cost per cu ft for the PSL is 5.6x the cost of the Advantech!
Is that what I need to expect? Are treated PSL beams such a low-volume material that I have to pay such a hefty premium? Or is there some other reason?
Replies
I believe PSL technology is owned by Weyerhaueser and therefore they can charge what they want. They are also limiting production of the product and are not making it easy for yards to sell the stuff.
The treated PSL is through the roof. Comparing plywood to PSL is an apples and oranges comparison.
Good luck on your project.
Bruce
Here in the twin cities (MN), a 5-1/4"x5-1/4"x10' treated is about $200.00 and untreated is about $115.00 so I'm guessing treating this stuff is quite expensive.
About 3-4 years ago we used a 14' treated PSL beam about the size you described (might have been 5-1/2" wide) and I think it was close to a grand............ so close to $75/ft. I don't know what the beam prices are now.
Three 2x12x14's with vycor on the top is about 100.00/material.....big difference in price!
I like to use the treated PSL posts instead of treated pine for short posts (less than 12") on decks and porches because they don't crack and split.
GB
last years price in march
5 1/4 x 11 7/8 31.98/foot
5 1/4 x 14 37.20/foot
This was quantity pricing -3000 feet plus.
No way to compare advantech and PSL pressure treated beams- two different animals Try pricing Simpson stainless hardware- hope you are sitting down.
Greg in Connecticut
That was quite imaginative to compare the cu ft price of plywood (OSB) to PSL beams.... :-)
The way to check pricing is to get another yard to price the lumber package for you. You will probably find one yard to be a little higher on some items, yet a little lower on others. That's why you need to price it by the package. Really, you should be pricing the entire house framing package, and then take it phased deliveries unless this thing is gonna take you two or 4 months to frame.... :-)
Addressed to you but meant for anybody interested. I have 3- 3 1/2" x 14" x 20' treated PSL sitting in my yard I will sell at way less than the yard rate. Anybody in the PNW interested drop me a line.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
Similar epoxy, similar wood product, similar preservative - ought to be similar price. The advantech is certainly a commodity. Apparently the PSL is not.
What about LVLs? Maybe just as strong but no Weyerhaueser premium?
I bought some LVLs 2 weeks ago. Looking back at the bids, the 16" were ~$4.50 per lin ft. (1.75" x 16"). Lumber prices are very regional.
Really though, if your plans spec PSL, I think that is what you have use. Either that, or get an engineer to OK the change - which wouldn't result in any savings at all, unless your engineer does free-bees. Here, inspectors want changes like that on a stamped letter- those don't come free.
Again - you need to price this stuff with multiple yards. You wanted to be the GC - so, do your job! There is a reason guys like me get paid to do this stuff.
MattI think he needed Pressure treated PSL, a little pricier than normal PSL, or two pieces of 16" LVL.Greg in Connecticut
Thanks - I missed that. Not sure I've ever seen one of those. Where would you use those? I'm thinking maybe a double window or 6-0 door but normally those would be going in a regular framed wall what wouldn't need treated. Or, maybe a dropped girder in a very low crawl space... I could see it on an exterior project like a deck but it sounds like he is building a house.
MattI've only come across them once, and it was for a large deck project, beam pricing exceeded $100,000. Didn't get the job, but it was an education in bidding.Greg in Connecticut
After a couple days of email exchanges with my lumber yard, engineer, and architect, we have identified and the engineer has approved the use of a different vendor for our PSL beams at about 60% of the cost. The alternate beams are Anthony Treated Power Preserved 24F-V5M1 Glulams.
Yippee.
Where are the treated PSLs to be used?
As a support structure between piers and the house's flush framing. The engineer wants PSL because of the moisture issues - bare ground just a few feet away.
Hummm...
Here code says that girders don't have to be treated unless they are less than 12" to the grade, joists 18". We are in the termite belt too. I'd never build anything any lower because tradesmen need to get access - plumbers, electricians, HVAC guys, etc. BTW - we are on IRC 2006.
Maybe your in a costal area or other damp environment?
I was at my building supply yesterday and asked my salesmen who has been selling lumber for 30 years about PT LVLs and PSLs. He said: "I can order them. There is not much call for them so we don't stock them." It's the largest building supply in this medium sized city.
The PSL beams are to be layed on piers and a 1.5 story house layed on top of the beams. I'm stuck with piers because site conditions make both a basement and a slab unworkable. A house with either of those would have no nead for PSL beams. Oh, and did I mention my beams have to be light enough for a gaggle of men to handle by hand? And light enough to take across a lake on a barge? What a project...
10+-year-old question and comments...
2020 update:
"Pressure Treatment" for PSLs is still typically a third party process and shipping to and from very few beams sized treatment facilities is added expense. Then, because PSLs are significantly filled with glues (you have to see them built in the factory to appreciate how much glue is in them) there isn't much room for the 'pressure treatment' to go into the 'wood' so it isn't all that effective. This came from my Weyerhaeuser rep. Same for all lsl, lvl psl engineered beams.
Some day they may have glues with moisture and termite resistance built-in but don't hold your breath for it.