Replies

1. 
   philarenewal | Apr 27, 2006 04:59pm | #1

   Here's one opinion.

   Metal cross bracing keeps the joists from tending to roll.  The metal braces are intended to be loaded in tension, so it's OK that they are flimsy.  They can transfer part of the vertical floor load to adjacent joists, but only if the joists can't roll (if it all works, it works -- if a couple braces are loose or not just right, vertical deflection transferred to tension in the braces will twist adjacent joist).

   Solid blocking keeps the joists from tending to roll and is also more effective at transferring part of the vertical floor load to adjacent joists.

   If you want the best floor you can get out of those 2x10's, use solid blocking.

    

   "Let's get crack-a-lackin"  --- Adam Carolla

2. 
   PeteVa | Apr 27, 2006 05:30pm | #2

   Tight fitting blocking will outdo X bracing any day. Spanning 14' 6" for 12" tile, I hope you used 12" Joist spacing to get at least a 720 floor. I'd put blocking on 5' centers in your situation.

   Hate to see tile cracks in 5 years.

1. 
   FrankFromNC | Apr 27, 2006 06:16pm | #3

   Pete,

   >>  I hope you used 12" Joist spacing...  <<

   No, I used 16" OC. So you really think blocking at 5' will sufficiently stiffen the floor, or should I forget the tile?

    

   Thanks

   Frank

   Edited 4/27/2006 11:17 am ET by FrankFromNC

   Edited 4/27/2006 11:18 am ET by FrankFromNC

1. 
   PeteVa | Apr 27, 2006 07:12pm | #5

   I'd just be extra sure that the decking is glued and screwed down well. Might consider a 6" tile also. Test things out with a few hops in the middle of the floor when it's all together before buying the tile.

3. 
   gordsco | Apr 27, 2006 06:27pm | #4

   I don't believe there is any difference in strength compared to cross-bracing but solid blocking has its disadvantages (plumbing/ wire).

   I never thought too much of 1X cross bracing. Its usually the first place to look when finding a squeak. After drying out the ends split. 2X3s are relatively cheap for cross bracing, or ripping 2X6 scrap.

   Extra rigidity? Glue the bracing.

    

   Gord

4. 
   MGMaxwell | Apr 27, 2006 07:21pm | #6

   Go to JohnBridge.com and find the "Deflectometer". Plug in your joists,spans, and OC. It will then tell you if you have the proper floor for your choice of tile. Natural stone require 1/720 I believe and ceramic 1/360. But check it out at the source. If you've got it correct then you don't have to monkey with cross bracing, etc.

1. 
   FrankFromNC | Apr 27, 2006 09:42pm | #7

   MG,

   >>  Go to JohnBridge.com and find the "Deflectometer". ...  <<

   Wow! What a great resource! According to the deflectometer I'm OK for ceramic tile, but there's no way I'll be stiff enough for natural. That's for a length of 14' - which is what I think the lengths really are; I'll check to make sure. I'll just have to find a ceramic tile that I like, or use something else. I'm REALLY glad I looked into this before the tile went down.

   THANK YOU!!!

   Frank

    

2. 
   BossHog | Apr 27, 2006 10:04pm | #8

   I loked all over on that site, and couldn't come up with anything called a "Deflectometer".Got a direct link to it?
   Kiss often - Lips never wear out.

1. 
   Litefoot | Apr 27, 2006 10:19pm | #9

   Boss

   Try this.

    

   http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/deflecto.pl

1. 
   BossHog | Apr 27, 2006 10:32pm | #11

   Thanks - Got it bookmarked now.
   Leadership is: Getting the job done right, on time, and with pride. And then taking care of the people who made it happen.

1. 
   philarenewal | Apr 27, 2006 11:40pm | #12

   Don't mean to be a rabbel rouser, but I don't know where some of you guys get that cross bracing 1x is better than metal and same as solid.

   The metal bracing is loaded in tension.

   1x bracing is loaded in compression.

   Solid blocking is loaded in compression as well as in shear.  It does work better.

   The only way I can think to illustrate this is with a fence gate door.  Everyone knows you load the wooden cross brace in compression or the door will sag (from strike side of door at top to hinge side of door at bottom.  The alternative is a steel turnbuckle loaded in tension to keep the door from sagging (opposite way round -- hinge side at top to strike at bottom).  Now imagine a door made completely of one solid piece of wood.  It won't sag unless the wood splits.  Best analogy I can come up with.

   Anyway, whatever.  ;-) 

   "Let's get crack-a-lackin"  --- Adam Carolla

5. 
   DanH | Apr 27, 2006 10:23pm | #10

   Blocking and cross-bracing should be equivalent if the fit is tight in both cases. It's a little easier to get cross-bracing tight, and it allows passage of wires and small pipes. But blocking is less apt to work loose later on.

   The metal cross-bracing they sell at HD (basically just strips of pipe hanger) is almost useless, except for satisfying the letter of the code. There is a style that's rigid (formed into a fairly deep U shape) and designed so that it can be "toggled" into place (kind of like how a ViceGrip toggles when it locks). But even these are apt to be less effective than wood X bracing or blocking, and they're scarce as hen's teeth anymore.

   I'm thinking of doing some bracing of our kitchen floor before we get new vinyl, and thinking I'll have a go at 2x3 X bracing glued and screwed.

   If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison