Replies

1. 
   Guest_ | Oct 07, 2000 04:40am | #1

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   build the deck on a roof...or use a roof for a deck or build a roof under the deck or build a roof over the deck or pray for no rain...

   near the stream,

   aj

1. 
   Guest_ | Oct 07, 2000 06:30am | #2

   *Do a deck of plywood and cover it with rubber roof membrane (EPDM). The membrane comes in various thicknesses; i use 45 mill and cover it with indoor/ outdoor carpeting to protect the membrane, or build a wood deck on sleepers on top of it. There are various ways to apply it (glue down, screw down) and accessories (termination bars, flashing)--your supplier can talk you through it. At 15 feet in height, though, the stuff underneath is still likely to get wet from blown-in water...blue tarps...

1. 
   Guest_ | Oct 08, 2000 03:18am | #3

   *Well, that's certainly fine for waterproofing, but if all he wants is to basically keep things dry underneath, I doubt he'd want to spend the requisite 80 million dollars for the membrane system as well as the compromises it creates for the deck surface itself.A good tip came up here last year or so, I can't remember who had it, but it called for making a slight slope for plastic panels channeled by the sides of the deck joists. I originally challenged this idea because I didn't really understand it, but I think now that it is a very good, low cost solution. You can email me if you'd like a better description, I'm a little tired tonight and I know that what I typed up there may be hard to follow.Good Luck,MD

1. 
   Guest_ | Oct 08, 2000 06:48am | #4

   *At 15' it sounds like you have lot's of room to build your deck then build a corrigated aluminum or plexiglass roof underneath. This can be accomplished several ways depending how long and wide the area is in which you want to cover. Please be more specific.

1. 
   Guest_ | Oct 08, 2000 09:30am | #5

   *3/4 Plywood is about $.52 a square foot here, the membrane is $.55 a square foot, and the indoor/outdoor carpet will set you back the most, about $.67 a square foot. Throw in some term bar and glue to bump it up to $2/sq. ft. and the deck has to be at least 40,000,000 sq. ft. to cost what you estimate, MD. On the other hand, with the same amount of money, one could only build a 20,000,000 sq. ft. wood deck and maybe a 10,000,000 sq. ft. plastic deck. =)))What do you mean by compromises for the deck surface, MD? Having done both ply deck and 2X wood, i'm continuing to install the EPDM because i've never had a single leak under membrane or at the flashing, nor had to maintain it, but i'd like to know what CAN go wrong... Corrugated plastic and aluminuminuminuminum? This is "Fine Trailer House Building"? eee-yeeewwww...

2. 
   Guest_ | Oct 08, 2000 01:56pm | #6

   *Splintergroupie,Did you say .55 a square foot for EPDM membrane? A tremendous deal. Do they throw in the labor too? And you criticize Pro-dek's mention of aluminum and "plastic" (underneath the deck, mind you) yet recommend indoor-outdoor carpeting? That's just as trailer trashworthy. What next, astro-turf?The compromises: Well, first, the membrane traps water against whatever is put on top of it. So, If you put a conventional deck on top, you trap water against the joists, i.e. rot them. Also, you can't nail or screw through it. If you're putting a conventional deck over a conventional deck, isn't it pretty compromising to buy 1 deck for the cost of two? As you said yourself, epdm is available in a few different grades. I don't know what grade you buy at .55/sq ft., but it's certainly not likely one rated for traffic or putting the weight of another deck on. So to me, those are the compromises, in addition to looking at the carpeting, which I doubt the poster really wants.MD

3. 
   Guest_ | Oct 08, 2000 06:17pm | #7

   *I have put many a deck surface on glue down EPDM which was over plywood...The decks were built on sleepers of 2x4 on its side....Fantastic decks....but don't copy me as I like being the only one in my area doing this so well...near the stream but think trailer parks are neat to drive by....lots to look at uaually,aj

4. 
   Guest_ | Oct 08, 2000 08:44pm | #8

   *I recently saw a system of plastic (or vinyl more likely) panels that screw on the joists on the under side of your deck and snap together. Theses are installed on a slope and allows water to drain through the deck and out the front. I cant remember which mag I saw it in but it looked fairly easy to install, maybe someone else has seen the mag and can help

5. 
   Guest_ | Oct 08, 2000 09:40pm | #9

   *Sounds familiar.

6. 
   Guest_ | Oct 08, 2000 10:17pm | #10

   *Hey, Mad Dog!Yup, 45 mill for $.55. Just bought it this summer. I use it full-glue. The first one i ever did (it was $.45 then)was my 10 x 12 balcony with a sleeper and deck system over the rubber. In fact, what i did was buy over-size 2x joists for the balcony, ripped the angle in them for drainage, saved the off-cut for the sleepers, put a couple extra 2x2 squares of the rubber material spaced 1' along the sleeper bottoms to provide more cushion and drainage, ran the sleepers in line with the drainage direction on top of the joists--back to level again--and built a wood deck on top of the ply and membrane, which unfortunatly didn't include labor and yes, i did it all without a permit (branded!). (There is no need for fasteners through the membrane, except for where the term bar is located and that gets caulked with butyl.) The place is now a rental, the deck was not maintained properly and is decidedly no longer worth resurrecting, but the ceiling underneath (Victorian beaded-edge pine) is still protected and perfect. Of course, it's only been twelve years, so there may be unanticipated probs in future. Since the membrane stops the water, you can use regular, not PT lumber as for an exposed deck. In the instance you cite, water trapped against the joists (sleepers?) and rotting them, we're talking essentially an exposed deck, where one would normally use PT lumber, which wouldn't rot...? A wood deck on top of ply deck is more costly, but not twice.As far as the carpeting goes, yeah, it bothers me a little, too, except i got this nice deep gray stuff with a rubber back that echoes a house paint color and which shows no sign of giving up after two years out on the next deck i made (32 x 8--a one-piece whopper to wrassle into submission by myself), and it lies down pretty well, not obvious like the corrugation situation. Since i spray lacquer under this deck (over my walkout basement woodshop)it would be apparent if it were leaking or rotting. Four dogs, three cats and i walk on the deck all the time, and i have the occasinal party.Any panels placed under the deck will collect debris. What do they cost, Wood Doctor?I hope to put the next deck on the new place this week, and i appreciate the astro-turf idea--think it'll look darling with a white-picket fence for a railing and some virgin silk flowers in the planter boxes! Gotta get me some of those chainsawed little pooches for either side of the stairs, name 'em "Mad Dog" and "Madder Dog" -- ; )

7. 
   Guest_ | Oct 08, 2000 11:47pm | #11

   *for the rain collection system check out http://www.dry-b-lo.com. It's a frnchisevdeal & I would love to see one of the systems installed.My preference is a plywood deck with Duradek (a walkable roof membrane looks kinda like vinyl flooring http://www.duradek.com) over that. I have yet to see a problem with this system. It won't even come close to .55 sq/ft though. It is cheaper than edpm & a wood deck though.

8. 
   Guest_ | Oct 09, 2000 01:25am | #12

   *Hi, Rob,There's a walkable vinyl deck guy here (drat, his ad's not in today's paper) that i called before returning to my EPDM thang, but i remember the cost was eye-popping plus i couldn't get the material and do the work myself. Can you give me cost/ft (close is good enough) so i can do a comparison with the local yokel and his franchise? Product has great warranty, as i recall.The dry-b-lo looks workable, but concentrated water in each trough will form depressions/puddles in the ground underneath, unless there's a way to hang a gutter. Aluminum overhead seems susceptible to punctures, or am i the only one to flail a hoe like that?

9. 
   Guest_ | Oct 09, 2000 04:26am | #13

   *I'm charging a MINIMUM of $8.00/ft & $10.00 is not uncommon. Even at theese prices the cost is less than edpm & a wood deck. The price varies to material amount needed & how complicated is the application.I agree with your assesment on the Dry-b-lo. I also wonder how noisy it is in the wind & rain.As for the durability of the Duradek, I inststaled alot of it on the 2cnd floor deck for a hotel 3 years ago. This place gets alot of golf fans staying there for various pga & lpga events. The fans are notorious for putting on their spikes before leaving for the tounamanets. So far it has held up quite well.

10. 
    Guest_ | Oct 09, 2000 04:36am | #15

    *Thanks for pricing, Rob--pretty much what i recall quoted to me. Wow, golf spikes--that is really some testimonial!

2. 
   G_Cobb | Oct 09, 2000 04:36am | #14

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   I want to build a new deck 15 feet above ground and want to be able to use the space below also.My question is how do I go about building this without everything under it getting wet.