A small kitchen remodel our company is doing failed final on an electrical code violation.
Penninsula is less than 6 ft out from wall at a right angle to the wall run of cabinets, so the counter dimension is less than 4 ft from the inside of the ‘L’.
Counter overhangs back of penninsula 12″. There is an outlet at the backsplash where the penninsula begins, that covers 2 ft out. We put an outlet in the center of the remaining less than 4ft in the back panel under the overhang and about 6″ down from it.
This is SOP for us.
Inspector passed us and left. This is a local inspector that covers all trades in Ct. Most of our work is in NY and we are held to UL inspection for the electrical inspections there.
10 minutes later he come back and says maybe there is a problem with the outlet in the back of the penninsula. He brings in the code book (2006 IBC maybe 2003, not sure) and opens it to a page with diagrams of a U shaped kitchen layout with outlet locations and specs…………..he then fingers over to the right side top of the page where there is an “exception” paragraph that mentions a handicapped accessible kitchen may not have an outlet under an overhang greater than 6″.
Well I read it as an exception to the standard rule of a kitchen, one that is of universal design may not have an outlet benaeth a counter overhang greater that 6″.
He says it applys to all kitchens. You need to have an outlet on the end panel and you need to blank this one off.
So I pointed out to him that then we would not fulfill the 2ft rule and he stared at me blankly. Before we could get in a debate we both agreed that he should check into this. He is young and green.
He calls back later and stands by his decision. I ask him if given a 10′ penninsula with an 18″ overhang where do you put outlets and he tells me you cant have an overhang greater than 6″ the code book says so.
Oh hoey. I think he is dead wrong, so does our electrician who normally uses the NEC and from what I understand, it is the NEC code that is in the IBC.
No big deal to add the outlet and blank off the box and the client is ok with that.
What say you experts who have a book to look in to?
Thanks.
Replies
Are you talking about the IBC or the IRC.
AFAIK there is no electrical code in the IBC.
In fact as part of the whole IBC code set there is,
"2006 International Code Council Electrical Code Administrative Provisions (soft cover)
Price: $12.00 (Member Price: $9.00)
Product #: 3980S06
Add this item to your shopping cart. (You can always remove it later...)
Book cover
Contains the text necessary to administer and enforce the 2005 National Electrical Code¯ and complies with electrical provisions contained in the other International Codes¯."
Which based on the table of contents has no actual CODE, but rather how to adopt the NEC code, setup inspects and the like. But the code in in the actual NEC.
But that does not not mean that there might not be related requirements in the IBC.
But the NEC has the same limitation.
"(5) Receptacle Outlet Location Receptacle outlets shall be located above, but not more
than 500 mm (20 in.) above, the countertop. Receptacle outlets rendered not readily
accessible by appliances fastened in place, appliance garages, sinks, or rangetops as
covered in 210.52(C)(1), Exception, or appliances occupying dedicated space shall not be
considered as these required outlets.
Exception to (5): To comply with the conditions specified in (1) or (2), receptacle outlets
shall be permitted to be mounted not more than 300 mm (12 in.) below the countertop.
Receptacles mounted below a countertop in accordance with this exception shall not be
located where the countertop extends more than 150 mm (6 in.) beyond its support base.
(1) Construction for the physically impaired
(2) On island and peninsular countertops where the countertop is flat across its entire
surface (no back-splashes, dividers, etc.) and there are no means to mount a
receptacle within 500 mm (20 in.) above the countertop, such as an overhead
cabinet"
KItch appliances have short cords so if the have to go out back over a 12" over hang that will take up 2 ft of the cord leght.
"So I pointed out to him that then we would not fulfill the 2ft rule and he stared at me blankly. Before we could get in a debate we both agreed that he should check into this. He is young and green."
What 2 foot rule?
For a peninsula you need on receptacle even if it is 20 foot long.
"(3) Peninsular Counter Spaces At least one receptacle outlet shall be installed at each
peninsular counter space with a long dimension of 600 mm (24 in.) or greater and a short
dimension of 300 mm (12 in.) or greater. A peninsular countertop is measured from the
connecting edge."
.
A-holes. Hey every group has to have one. And I have been elected to be the one. I should make that my tagline.
Thanks Bill,
Not sure now which book he had especially after looking at the covers. IRC is what I believe he had.
The wording you posted is VERY similiar, possibly the same.
In a way it makes sense considering the cord issue and the fact that he told us the outlet needs to be blanked off.
What 2 ft rule?
This one, which basically covers spscing of all countertop outlets.
"(3) Peninsular Counter Spaces At least one receptacle outlet shall be installed at eachpeninsular counter space with a long dimension of 600 mm (24 in.) or greater and a shortdimension of 300 mm (12 in.) or greater. A peninsular countertop is measured from theconnecting edge."
So let me ask you. If you have a countertop with a greater than 6" overhang that is 4 ft long as measured from the connecting edge, where do you put the outlets?
He wants us to put one outlet only at the end panel of the penninsular. That leaves 2 ft still uncovered by and outlet.
Or just to make it reall simple, you have an island with 18" overhangs all around. Where do you put the outlets?
According to this rule, overhags in general would be disallowed.
We do this all the time in NY and pass inspection with independent inspectors following the NEC. And some of these guys are tough nuts. We used to get called for not having the outlets beneath the overhangs. When islands and penninsulars started becoming popular n one knew where to put the outlets. The inspectors stared requiring them as per code.
Thanks for the help.
Eric[email protected]
Man, I love this site.
Forrest - not an electrician
Forrest,
How is it handled where you are?
I'd really like to hear more on this. The BI in question stated to our electrician that the had the states attorney's office issue a legal ruling on their interpretation of this section of code and now that is what they go by!
Both of our electrical contractors are top shelf; NEVER fail and inspection.[email protected]
" At least one receptacle outlet shall be installed at each
peninsular counter space with a long dimension of 600 mm (24 in.) or greater and a short
dimension of 300 mm (12 in.) or greater."AFAIK that defines WHAT IS A PENINSULA. The critical wording is at least ONE.That sections says absolutely nothing about spaceing.(1) covers WALL counter spaces and that has the reqirement that there are no more than 2 ft from a receptacle.(2) covers islands and only requires 1 receptacle(3) is peninsulas and is the save as (2) except that it also defines where the peninsula part starts.Neither (2) or (3) have any spacing requirements and they are not a subset of (1). They are at the same level. But they aren't wall mounted contertops so that part is not covered.I did a google on - kitchen peninsula countertop receptacles - hoping to find some discussions on this in one of the electrical or code forums, but did not in the first couple of pages. I did find several on having the receptacle on the cabinet instead of the wall. But not appropriate to this question.And find many places where they had checklist/handouts on code requirements and they all impolied only one.So I agree with the BI, except for one thing.The small appliance circuits can also supply the dinning room and pantry.With a 12" overhang I would think that would be an eat at counter top and the receptacel under that overhang could be treated as serving the dinning area.Thus you can keep that receptacle, but it would not serve the peninsula, but ONE counter end would (unless countertop is broken up by sink or cooktop)..
.
A-holes. Hey every group has to have one. And I have been elected to be the one. I should make that my tagline.
Thanks again Bill,
As far as I have been informed, countertop is countertop and the 2 ft out let rule applies regardless.
As for the BI insisting that the current outlet be disable and blanked off, I can understand that given your point on the appliance cords.
The wording of these codes is so damn muddled it takes a team of lawyers to interpret. And of course the code is always open to what the BI 'thinks" it says and that is all there is to it sometimes.
Thanks for your hard work and help. Like I stated earlier, it's no big deal to put the outlet on the end as long as the HO agrees to it. It's not the nicest look to have n outlet in a finishe raised end panel, that's why we normally try yo keep them out of site under the overhang. Most ho's will tell you that they never intend to use them anyway!
Thanks,
Eric[email protected]