I have a real old electric motor that I would like to try out.
This thing is huge. Motors built nowadays this size are 5 HP and up.
I am attaching a pic. For dimensions purposes, the body of the motor between the two end plates is 7 inches. Overall diameter is probably 7 or 8 inches.
On the plate is this information…
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wagner electric corporation
354
st louis usa
Alternating current motor type KA
frame 75
model W30 B185 k354
3/4 hp
1725 rpm
1 ph 60 cycles
110v 10.4 amps
220v 5.2 amps
cont rating 40c ser number n81
~~~
It is the motor off an old air compressor. I’d like to get that compressor working. I have to get this motor working first.
I am not sure whether it was wired for 220 or for 110. More than that, I am not sure of the wiring in any way.
There used to be a box on the side, where the wires went in. But that box was torn off long before I got it. (Not removed… TORN off.) The wires are just cut off right at the motor.
I want to wire it for 110v.
Does anyone know anything about the wiring on this thing ?
Before you say anything… there is no wiring diagram plate anywhere on this motor. I would assume that was on the box that got torn off the side of it.
I am going to have to remove the back plate of the notor itself just to get to any wires inside. It still spins by hand so I have hope for it…
I bet before you know it, babies will be sent home with a sticker warning them that living causes death~piffin ’06 View Image
Replies
How many wires? The thing is one phase AC, which says it's an induction motor, probably capacitor start. Is there a capacitor, or a place where one was once mounted?
The run windings would generally be two windings -- four wires -- that can either be wired in series (240V) or parallel (120V). That's fairly simple. But how the start windings (if any) are wired up is an entirely different issue. And then there's the centrifugal start switch, if any. (Some units this size might use a motor starter that uses a timer or current sensor instead of the start switch.)
usually if you have two wire out of motor, 110 one be hot the other netrual, for 220 both be hot and case be ground. It really does matter on 110 which wire, that will determine which way the motor turns.
Currently it is still sitting on the heater and drying out. (And disgorging all it's spiders and other critters into my kitchen.)I have seen no capacitor. Maybe there was an external capacitor on the compressor at one time ???From what I can see from where it is sitting, (Very big, very heavy, and not in a place where it can be moved around right now.), there are 4 cloth covered wires coming out of the casing. Those 4 wires are divided into two pairs, and each pair is connected to one added wire, and taped. So power goes to two added wires which feed the two pairs of wires. I would assume the case is the ground.Centrifical start switch would be inside the motor, if there is one at all.I'll be taking this out to the shop later today, like after noon or so. I want to be positive the thing is completely dry. I'll take off the end plate and have a look inside. I'll know more after that.I am figuring that at the least, I am going to have to get inside and insulate those cloth covered wires better.When it comes to the capacitor... Isn't there basically one capacitor for all 110v motors ? Couldn't I use the capacitor from an old dayton, and mount it externally ?As for a motor starter, wouldn't there have to be a double pulley on this motor if it used another motor to start with ? It only has a single pulley.I'd hate to see this motor wasted. At the size and weight it is, and being only 3/4 hp... I have to figure it's got tremendous torque.I just found my old dayton motors "cowen paper". A PDF file with generic info on motors. Time to do some reading again.You know, the one good thing about having such a crappy memory is that after a couple years or so, movies become "new" again to me. And some books, too. But it sure is irritating that I have to re-educate myself on this kind of stuff every time I have to do something again.
I bet before you know it, babies will be sent home with a sticker warning them that living causes death~piffin '06
Hate to ask the obvious Luka... but as it's an old beast, have you checked the windings before you invest all this work?
PaulB
I haven't actually done anything at all with it yet except sit it on the heater to dry out.When I take it out to the shop and remove the back of it, I'll check the windings while I am checking everything else.=0)
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
> Those 4 wires are divided into two pairs, and each pair is connected to one added wire, and taped.That sounds like a typical 120V wiring. One of the added wires is hot, the other neutral (doesn't make a lot of difference, though if one side seems to be more like black and the other more like white, make the black side hot). The starter arrangement is unclear, but there's a slight chance this is a shaded pole motor or has the capacitor internal.Do double-check for signs of other wires from other openings, though.The case should be grounded (especially in a motor of suspect integrity), but the ground should not carry any current. You should probably ohm out between the winding connections and ground, and not attempt to use the motor unless you read at least about a thousand ohms.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
Thanks again, Dan.I can't get to this till later. But if I get any grounding at all between either wire and the case, (using the ohmmeter.), I am not going to even consider hooking it up to electricity until I have had a thorough look inside.
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
Cloth-covered wires, uncertain wiring approach, how to start, WET!, possible internal shorts (now or just waiting until your turn your back!), old varnish on windings...Luka, I'd junk it. 3/4 horse from Grainger is cheap! And just because its big doesn't mean its got more torque. The HP is stated, and given a fixed RPM (1800 or 3600, 1800 far more likely), the potential output
torque is fixed, too!They just used to build 'em bigger back then!Either way, let us know, will you? I love these stories!BrooksAnd a late thought: If you do decide to try it, and/or use it, make
SURE its tightly grounded! We'd miss you...
Edited 9/22/2006 2:58 pm ET by Brooks
It's the challenge of the thing, more than anything. If I JUST wanted any old motor on there, I'd find another.=0)I don't like the cloth covered wires, and will probably try to shrink tube them. Or de-solder/remove them and solder in some silicone covered wires.It is bone dry now, and I will check twelve ways to sunday to be sure there are no shorts anywhere.Cheap is in the eye of the beholder. 30 dollars might as well be 3 thousand for all I could scrape together right now. 80 to 300 dollars... forget it.RPM is 1725 rpm. (It's in the little blurb in my first post, from the metal identification plate.) ;o)Even as a challenge to myself, I will not go way overboard with this. I am certainly not going to invest in any parts on a hunch. The motor just wouldn't be worth it. But I do like the challenge of learning about it, checking it out, and possibly getting it to run.
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
Late thought, but with no capacitor the motor is probably split phase and wont have the starting torque for a compressor.
I've a spare 100 HP 460 Vac 3 phase motor in one of the sheds <G>
It is the motor that was on the compressor, from the factory. If it has a capacitor, it is internal, or it was separate. I have no idea whether it had or has either of those. Just one of the things I need to figure out.Since it came from the factory, installed on the compressor, then capacitor or no, it has to have the needed torque. I just have to figure out whether it is supposed to have a capacitor or not.I was kind of hoping there was an old motor officionado around... ;o)Oh yeah, I'll be right over to pick up that 3 phase motor! LOL What the heck would I do with that ? =0) It's probably bigger than the entire compressor.Cool deal that my 20 gallon propane tank turned out to be 30 gallons, huh ? I'm letting it sit a couple days full of water before I empty it.I have a hunch that with that much capacity, pretty much any compressor that I hook up to it will work to run my air tools.What did you think of the pipe-fitting/manifold idea ?
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
It just occured to me that it is going to be a batch getting the water back out of that tank. No vent, of course.Probably have to get an air compressor hooked up just so I can introduce some air pressure into the tank to blow the water out...
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
I doubt there is a cap. inside the thing.....more likely just a centrifugal switch....which may need some attention...one quick way to tell is to look at the wires to determine if two of them are a smaller gauge..these are the start winding that is connected THRU the switchif you can wrap a rope around the shaft and pull start the thing you should hear the switch opening and closing......if you hear nothing then you will have to try a unstick the switch, which of course requires opening the motor up at the end opposite the shaft. if you can open the motor that is....if the switch is bad and will not work......your testing has reached a conclusion, either way you can roll the dice and just stick voltage to the leads and see what happens.... single phase motors will always have some part of the windings running on 110 volts and it will try to run if the windings are still intact I am also curious about one more thing...are there brushes on this Wagner...those were sometimes used by that Mfr.to adjust the motor for the applied voltage.......sometimes........
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Thanks for the reply !Ok, you give me better hope here than you know. Yes, I read about the brushes wagner used to use. I would not be surprised at all to open this one up and find brushes. I am also wondering if, if it has brushes, they are worn too far, and whether I'll be able to find replacements for them. Ah well, we shall see when it is open.=0)And open it up, I will. Taking that back plate off, (opposite the shaft), is the very first thing I intend to do. I'm not putting power to it until I check it out that way...But I am going to get to it a bit later than I had thought. I have to get the old jimmy up in the air right now, to find out what it's gear ratio is. After that I will take the motor over to the shop and take that back cover off.Using the rope is something I hadn't thought about. I think I'll put a rope on it before I take that back plate off. Then spin it, and listen for the cent switch to open. (No power, of course.) If it doesn't click open, but I do find one in there, I'll know it's gonna have to be fixed.Also, if I check it out and find no grounded wires or coils, etc, then put power to it and it doesn't start, I'll try the rope while the power is on, to see if it starts and runs.
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=36550
View Image
The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
That's a real monster of a drill !
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
Drill?? I thought it was a Mixmaster.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
I think it gets something like 60 rpms.
View ImageThe bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
So when the bit gets stuck, it whips two guys around 60 times a minute ??;o)
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
Heard that that was about it.
Found out in an old thread about it that that was what it was, a coal drill for drilling holes to stick dynamite in.
be a fwap fwap fwap fwap fwapThe bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
OK... I see it's time for a little course on motors....
When a motor is rated for more than one voltage, it has more than one set of windings. When you install the motor, for the "high" voltage you wire the two windings in series; for the "low" you hook them up in parallel.
You can identify the winding with a continuity meter; that is, you see which wires are continuous through the motor. This, BTW, is the first test of motor function.
The remaining winding tests are performed with a "megger." This meter allows you to check the condition of the insulation, and will identify shorted or burned out windings. Find an industrial electrician, or power company guy, who knows how to do this.
Single phase motors all have some means to ensure that the motor spins the same way every time. On larger motors, this almost always involves a capacitor... or two... or three. And no, capacitors are not interchangeable, and the size does matter. nor is "bigger" always better.
I suggest you take the thing to a motor shop, and let them have a look.
I suggest you take the thing to a motor shop, and let them have a look
Don't say that, Jeff'll bring it down here for me to fix <G>
ROFLOL !!Haaay Aaaaaaaart !!!!;o)Next thing up, is to try to pull the other end plate without pulling the armature through in that direction. (And to blow a bunch of that crap out of there as well...)Be back in a bit.
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
Ok, here come the pictures.
In this first pic I have removed the end plate, swung it around, and set it next to the motor.
First of all, you can see that quarters are pretty tight in there, even though it is a big motor.
Second, it does have the brushes. Though not like any brushes I have ever seen. They push against the flat front surface there, instead of riding against the outsides of the armature.
Third, no centrifical switch, and no capacitor, either. (I didn't really expect to find a capacitor inside...)
Keep in mind that I have taken this apart without ever even trying to put electricity to it. It didn't make sense to plug it into the juice without first finding out what was inside.
Now, notice that there are no wires going to the brushes. There is a braided wire between two of the brushes, one wire on each side. But there are no wires anywahere that actually come out to the brushes.
There is a square notch in the top of the brush assembly. There is a corresponding tab on the end plate, that slips into that square notch. Is this thing actually using the body of the motor as part of the circuit ???
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
In this pic you can see that there is plenty of "brush" left in these holders.I think I might figure out how to remove those brushes then try to clean up the armature surface a bit. Maybe I'll just leave it alone. LOL
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
And in this one you can see that although the wires seem to be pretty much intact, no cracks in the insulation, etc... They just disappear behind the coil. If I am going to consider replacing the wires, or even just trying to visually trace them... I am going to have to take off the front plate as well, and try to find a way to pull the coil out.I may just be SOL about trying to R&R the thing before I put the juice to it.
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
That's looking like an "AC/DC" motor. No start switch, no starter winding, no capacitor. The two wires you have should be all you need to deal with.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
It may have a starter winding. (Because it looks like it has a centrifugal switch.) But you are probably right about the rest.I found what looks like a centrifugal switch.Yeah, yeah, I figured out the instant I hit the "post" button the last time, that that front plate was not coming off of there without the armature in tow. Because the pulley is on that end.Anyway, I got it out and I saw what looked like a cent switch. So I cut the pulley off the shaft, and completely removed the front plate. (Yes, I said cut. I don't have a gear puller.)Here is what I found...
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
Ok, the bottom half of the motor was full of a combination of grease and auto body shop dust.In that last pic you see the thing that may be a cent switch, all covered in grease and bondo dust.Here, I have cleaned it up.Now, I don't know if this is a cent switch or not. It LOOKS like those two halves should pivot on the horizontal pins. But I have gently pushed and pried to no effect. Nothing seems to want to move.If this is a switch, then I have to figure out whether the pieces are supposed to pivot up or down.You see the "bump" right there in front of you ? It sits on that rod. That rod goes down into the body of the armature. I am wondering if the two pivoting weights are supposed to swing down toward the body of the armature, and push those rods in.I have squirted some oil on the big pieces. I'll let it sit for a while, then go try pushing and pulling again. I do not want to really force anything because I might break it.I may squirt some oil down inside the body of that thing on the bottoms of those "rods". If they end up being able to be pushed down into the body, then that is probably the direction those weights were supposed to go.If so, I'll take this end of the thing apart by driving out those pins. Then clean everything up, oil it, and put it back together and see if I works.Now... why would it push those pins in ??? What is at the other ends of those pins ? The "brushes" slide loosely toward and away from the body of the armature, on the other end.Maybe the weights on the shaft end push those rods in, and the rods push the brushes away from the armature ???That would make that the start circuit. Soon as it has started, it pushes the brushes away, and the run circuit takes over... ???But then, that would leave those rods pushing against the brushes the entire time the motor is running. The brushes are held in position by that tab on the body...If my hunch is correct here, this is probably why they discarded the compressor. See, there was another reason for these forensics... It helps me to figure out the reason the original owners trashed the compressor. Once I have that figured out then I can figure out whether it is worth it to restore or not.If they trashed it because of this, then the head is probably still good. Now it becomes worth it to at least check out the head.=0)Ok, back to it. Nothing for it but to take those two pins out and see what the "weights" do...Those will probably be the last pics I take.
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
Ok, I was right.Those are cent weights. They do swing downward instead of up. They do push those rods. The rods do push the brush assembly on the other end.I got the weights to working sorta freely.I Put it all back together. Wired it up. Got my flashlight ready just in case... And hit the suicide switch. (Wall switch wired inline with the power line. In a box and wrapped with a piece of inner tube, and a ton of tape besides...)She fired right up !! I could hear the cent switch working, every time I turned it on. The brushes were making a lot of flashing and spitting.So I took that end back off and had a closer look at the brushes.They are supposed to slide freely in and out in their holder, and two of them were stuck. I am in the process of cleaning each brush, then I'll reassemble and see what happens...
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
OK, it's making a little more sense. This is a hybrid between a commutated motor and an induction motor. The brushes operate during startup to power the armature, then the centrifugal mechanism pushes them away (this is the reason for having the odd disk-type commutator). So it starts as a DC motor and runs as an induction motor.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
DC, commutator, induction, AC... Whatever.;o)I recognised the centrifugal switch when I saw it, and did figure out that it pushes the brushes away.Cleaned up those brushes, and while I was at it, I put a little non-detergent oil on the tab that holds that brush body in place... Put it all back together.... The only time the brushes flash is when it is starting, then the cent switch pushes them away, and that is the end of that. The two wires were one black and one white, so the wiring was easy to figure out. I don't know if I had to have that ground on the body of the motor, but it is definately going to stay that way.Very smooth and quiet motor...The true test will be when I get it under load. Cross yer fingers, wish me luck, whatever.I hope this has been entertaining to some people. I know it was a blast for me.=0)Tomorrow, I will carry the tank up the hill, bolt the motor and head back onto it, and then the race is on to see how soon I can get it all replumbed and working.=0)All that for an antique 3/4hp motor... LOL But it does feel good to have used my head and hands to beat the odds. Even if it turns out to be gutless now. If it's gutless I have another motor to work on. A 1hp motor. It doesn't spin by hand, so I am not holding my breath for that one.
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
congratulations......... maybe lightly touch up the comm. with med or fine sandpaper. might get rid of some of the arcing ... just don't lose the brushes,
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.Wer ist jetzt der Idiot
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Thank you.I may take Art up on his offer to clean up the comm on his lathe, later.One of the brushes is already broken. It's stuck in it's holder as well. But it's still working.I do not, of course, hold any hope for ever finding replacement brushes, so I hope this keeps working for at least a couple years. It's not like I'll be using it constantly. But when I do use it I'll probably have it running all day, and possibly turn it on two or three days in a row.
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
Jeff, brushes is brushes mostly, it's the shape you have a problem with.
If they are hard metal impregnated like automotive starter brushes you can find one from an old starter and shape it by rubbing on a piece of sandpaper until it fits.
If they are softer (blacker usually) you'll need something out of an old tool. Same thing, just sand easier.
Joe H
These brushes seem to be a composite.The top half of the brushes seem to be bronze. The bottom half seem to be a hard version of the same black brushes you find in tools.How they got the two to bond and stay that way, I have no idea. On one it looks like the carbon portion "leaked" into the bronze portion of the mold they were made in, so maybe that's how they did it. Just poured the two together into a mold somehow ???Anyway, I agree. It looks like automotive brushes may work.These are a square shape from one side. Then it is a wedge shape from BOTH/EACH of the other two sides. Sanding something down into the exact shape is going to be tedious work, but obviously worth it to try if that one brush goes out.We have a coast to coast hardware in Monroe that has a bin full of various brushes. I think that if I decide to replace these, I'll take the good pair in there and see what I can come up with that would be the closest.If they have nothing close, and can't order anything close, I'll check out starter brushes. They are the closest match I am already aware of.If I do that, I'll take that holder/carrier completely off the shaft, and clean it up really good. Then put some silicone dielectric grease into the sockets the brushes ride in.I think putting that bit of non detergent oil on the tab that centers the brush holder allowed the brush holder to move more smoothly and completely away from the commutator. That's why it stopped sparking after startup, not because I cleaned the brushes...
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
Keep in mind that the brushes only work during startup, so the don't need to be long-wearing. They do need to be able to handle the relatively high current, and it sounds like the existing ones are a combo of sintered bronze and graphite -- the graphite makes good contact and lubricates while the bronze handles the current. Probably would be best to not use pure carbon replacements. A starter brush would seem a likely candidate.I'd say leave the good ones alone, and only replace the bad one if it seems to not be working or threatens to disintegrate.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
Yup. I was thinking the same. Those starter brushes are pretty tough.The brush that is bad is already mostly gone. What is left of it is the bottom 1/3rd or so, and that is firmly glued in place by the gunk that killed the motor in the first place. If it ever comes "unglued", it'll go out in a blaze of glory !!!=0)
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
You might want to look for a motor shop or an autoelectric service that rebuilds starters to see if they have matching brushes.
Maybe next time I get into town.There's no place like that in Monroe, or anywhere nearer to me. And I rarely go even as far as Monroe. Today was a "town" day and I didn't go any farther than Sultan.If I take them out again, I'll make measurements and take pictures.Probably go as far as carry them to the coast to coast hardware in monroe as well.I just want to get this compressor finished and working, first.
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
Here is the shape of the brushes.
Make the square about 1 inch across, and you have the size and shape pretty much right, right here.
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I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
there is a little motor shop in LaPorte, I will check this week for any thing that might work as a replacement...they might even have something in the dust bin....who knows?.
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Very cool !I found nothing online with searches in many different forms.
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
Sorry for the wait,
the motor shop had nothing..in fact the nice lady was very persistent in looking for Warner brushes !!, and even more flummoxed with the wedge shape and brush mounting ...any how, the storeroom at work is full of brushes, except Wagners of course....but if you are so inclined, send me some measurements ....particularly the length and dia. of the shunt...the wire attached to the brush that is, and perhaps junkhound and you can make them work .I looked at brush mfrs. and their on-line catalogs list only current typesone place I glanced at was Helwig Carbon in Wis..
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Thank you.I'd forgotten. ;o)I am going to dismantle an old starter sometime soon, and compare the brushes.I'll let you know when that happens."Soon" for me can mean anything between later tonight, all the way through a couple years from now. (Or when the motor kakks, whichever is soonest. LOL)
callin all angels
callin all angels
walk me through this world
don't leave me all alone
Anytime J.....
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In theory this motor should have excellent starting torque. Starting torgue is the bane of regular induction motors, but commutated motors have very good torque all the way from the start. By combining the two they get the speed regulation and lower maintenance of an induction with the starting characteristics of a commutated motor.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
Well I hope to be able to test this out by next weekend.=0)
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
It is a repulsion start motor.From Fitzgerald & Kingsley "Electrical Machinery"In ac series motors the rotor and stator windings are conductively coupled. Replusion motors are similar to a series motors except that rotor and stator windings are inductively coupled - ie the rotor current is obtained by transformer action from the stator.(power is to the stator and the rotor brush are shorted) ...The pure rpeulsion motor ahs the high-starting torque varying-speed characteristic typical of series mtors and permits sped adjustemy by brush shifting.Repulsion-Induction motors ahve aboth a commutated windiding and a a squrrel-cage rotor winding, the latter being buried in the slots belowed the commutated windings; henmce they combine both the repulsion and induction torques.In Repulsion-start Induction-Run motors a centrifgally operated evice short-circuits all of the commutator segments and usually also lifts the brushes when the motor reqches about 75% of synchronous speed, afterwhich the rotor windings is like a shorted chricuited squirrel cage and the motor operates as single=hase induction motor....Prior to about 1930, these motors where widely used for applications requiring high starting torque. Since then, however, the simpler capacitor-star motors have generally taken over the field.Torque/spped curve shows a 400% torque at zero speed.
Perfect.Exactly spot on !Sounds like this one is a keeper. Worth actually taking the time later to truly "restore" if it actually works on the compressor, and keeps working.
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
Hey, good pix.
If you get down here, bring the rotor and will throw it on the lathe and true up the commutator.
Yup, I hate seeing these kind of pics when they are not big enough for you to actually see any detail.I tried to take the pics as if I were the one who would have to look at them, and figure things out.
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
One of the things I've learned is that life goes along a lot easier if I get rid of clutter. A rule that I try to live by is that if I don't use something for more than a year or two, throw it out or give it to someone who will use it.
What you have there is CLUTTER! Do yourself a favor, chuck it out and watch an educational TV program for the same number of hours you're going to waste on that piece of counter weight. If you still insist on getting that equipment running, buy a new motor cause they're a lot more efficient than that old piece of junk. Better yet, take it apart and take the copper wire in for recycle and bucks ( $2.00 at least).
Hey, I gotcher woodway right -here !;o)You totally miss the point.Different people, different values.In my opinion the tv is a waste of time. This is fun. I'm solving a puzzle, and I may even get it to run.Watching tv, all I'd get is a fat arse. (Well... FattER...)Man, life would be too boring if I lived it like you do. I almost pity you. But then, because of your own values, I am sure you feel the same about me.How about we just agree not to diss each other over our own personal values ?=0)
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06
clutter? What the hey is clutter?
be oh, that's what junkhound has in his shedsThe bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
be oh, that's what junkhound has in his sheds
Hey, I got no clutter, what I have I call "strategic reserves".
EVERY time I have ever thrown anything away, I need it 3 days later.
Only exception is old car bodies, those do go to scrap metal, -- sure glad I let 6 cars sit around for 10 years, scrap metal price went from zero to $40 a ton in the last few years. (finally scrapped them this summer) Got $20 for one cat converter too!
I'm with Luka on this one, I enjoy my life style, never will be a prissy, fussy dude.
Hey, I got no clutter, what I have I call "strategic reserves".
be This...I understand.The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
Thank you Art.The day I become like that, is the day I have no more challenge in my life. With no more challenge, what would be the reason to go on ?Since the limitations I have are not going to go away, I have to choose my challenges. The wrong challenges could kill me in a heartbeat. Challenges in dealing with people are the ones that could kill me the quickest. Logistical, forensic, computer and mechanical challenges are the best.These sort of challenges are what I choose. Not an easy challenge, because what would be the point in that either ? But one that, should I lose, it isn't going to kill me. And when I win, I have actually accomplished something difficult. Sometimes something no one else would even have tried, let alone accomplished.
I like a good husky woman. Shows they have sandwich making skills ~Gunner '06