Replies

1. 
   Guest_ | Sep 08, 1999 07:07am | #1

   *
   Adam

   Is it out of the question to fabricate a metal plate,predrilled to take the conduit clamps, fasten it over the hacked out hole with rivets or screws and carry on?? It might be worth investing in another identical box, and cut out a patch from the same spot.

   -pm

1. 
   Guest_ | Sep 08, 1999 07:25am | #2

   *Adam"Is it to code; won't be inspected," you're on your own there.We deal with "strange" penetrations a lot, cases where whole side panels of machines or end plates would have to be replaced if we didn't repair as follows: We usually fab a sheet-metal (12-16 ga) plate to cover the offending opening after punching the proper holes in it for the conduit. Seal it, and Teks screw it to the inside. Is it to code? I never had one fail inspection. Can I quote the NEC article that says its ok? NO. Sounds like you might have two other problems.1. Are the pieces of conduit able to be spread out enough to allow the conduit ends and nuts, or did they bring them in in a bundle, now encased in mortar, etc?2. Is this a NEMA 3R or higher box? Will it still be when the repair is complete?Is this low-voltage alarm, etc or is it utility? Probably a lot more lee-way and peace of mind if all 24vdc or some such animalWHETHER THIS REPAIR IS STRICTLY TO CODE OR NOT IS UP TO YOU TO DECIDE. Hopefully other posts will help address that issue.Scott

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   Guest_ | Sep 08, 1999 08:26am | #3

   *Scott & Patrick;Thanks for the input. Answer to #1 is NO. Conduit is in a bundle, encased in mortar. Could possibly spread them to get thread fittings glued on, but forget about getting them into a predrilled hole pattern.I thought about essentially building a repair plate, and then attaching this to the mangled baseplate. Can't trim the conduit lower, so the patch would be a "box" with a flange to attach to the existing box. I figure 6 to 8 hours for a machinist at $75 per hour....If the metal guage and fasteners were adequate, I'd believe code was satisfied.Any thought on the concrete to seal the openings?Thanks for the disclaimer-I realize once you depart from standard methods and approved materials, you are on your own. If this was 24V I'd just slap wingnuts on the wires and adios...Again, Thanks

1. 
   Guest_ | Sep 08, 1999 08:49am | #4

   *AdamThere's nothing keeping you from punching the holes in the pattern of your bundle. A greenlee punch set or a hole saw and some time is cheaper than the rates you quoted. If you want it fabricated by someone else, try this. Slip (do not glue yet) the conduit ends over and place nuts on them. space apart w/cardboard just enough for the nuts to rotate. Take another piece of cardboard and PRESS it on the conduit ends, hard enough to transfer pattern. Take box dimensions,1 conduit end and pattern you just made to a Sheet Metal Shop. Take them about an hour and the material charge will be nil. Around here the charge if flat would be about $30. If brake work is needed expect around $50Scott

1. 
   Guest_ | Sep 08, 1999 09:22am | #5

   *This might be easier to do if the plate was plastic rather than metal. I think the result would satisfy the safety concerns which the code tries to address.Requirements for fastening conduit to junction boxes are designed to ensure that the connection is mechanically sound, all metal parts are bonded together (for metallic conduit; not a concern here), and that the wiring isn't damaged (bushings, etc; again not a concern w. PVC). Junction box requirements are to ensure that all connections are accessable, uncrowded, and protected by grounded metal or nonconductive enclosure.With the conduit and box embedded in mortar, it sounds like they're mechanically secure enough. But you should probably try to plug up that 6" hole around the conduit bundle with something. Just having bare concrete exposed to the interior box may not be a good idea, since it may be partially conductive in some circumtances (not good; you either want it very conductive and positively grounded, or not at all conductive). But either a grounded metal, or nonconductive, fix-it plate should be OK, I think.

2. 
   Guest_ | Sep 08, 1999 10:07pm | #6

   *Thanks all.Scott, I was being a bit flip when I quoted the rates. Your latter suggestion was what I wound up doing. (My attempt with the punches was a disaster since the holes are so tightly spaced, there isn't enough material to support the punch action. The bundle was real tight.)Took the pattern to a shop this morning. Cut the holes with a metal holesaw. Cost was $100 not including my time....I guess that makes it $102.98 total :)Thanks again.Adam

3. 
   Guest_ | Sep 09, 1999 05:04am | #7

   *Two useless cents worth...I built a home in Curacao....and they do this sort of thing throughout entire homes...conduit, concrete,boxes and no boxes and semi locations, semi plumbed and semi layed out, semi near where the wall will be built....etc, etc....Yet the finished homes all stuccoed up with all kinds of wall thicknesses and changes to make the final product work are beautiful....These guys pore floors within 5 to ten inches of level without levels and transits and just use giant amounts of concrete to bed the tile when the time comes for the finished floor to be laid....I was truly amazed that such a different way of building had such great final results.So just do....near the stream,aj

4. 
   Guest_ | Sep 09, 1999 08:16am | #8

   *AdamI see we're on the same pay scale :-)Scott