Yes, that’s right. It’s a “how to” thread on field shelters and bunkers. Feel free to think it strange but some, like myself, like to be prepared in their mind what steps to take in case of an emergency where going back to nature and surviving on it will be an only choice. If you have some land already, summer is burning what are you waiting for!
Field shelters are underground cut and cover, Bunkers are designed with 2 basic things in mind. Firing position and adverse protection from the elements…mortar surface burst. Lets look at both in detail.
Field shelters can be as simple as a 2′ wide X your hgt to a cut done by a shovel… to a planned operation involving heavy earth moving machine, place a prefab unit in slot, and then backfill it. You will need a drainage ditch right out the front of your shelter which is slopping downward and away from your sleeping area and a board walk over it exiting. Sand bag your front sheathing and incorporate some type of durable air vent system for exhaust. Here is a list of materials for an excavated area type shelter;
4’x8’x3/4″ plywood- 20 each
4″x8″x14′ timbers- 13 each
4″x4″x8′ timbers- 10 each
4’x4’x10′ timbers- 2 each
2″x4″x12′ timbers- 4 each
2″x4″x10′ timbers- 9 each
2″x4″x8″ tibers- 10 each, price these out in your area and that is idea to a cost for a small cut shelter without labor.
Bunkers, now here is alot to talk about. Try to picture what I am writing about and scale from there in construction. It’s all in the laminated layer distribution method to transmit part of the load of the top layers to the undisturbed earth on each side of the shelter/bunker.
Heavy overhead cover is an art for the worthy, just like earthquake proof structures. here are some tips in a bunker style construction, I know everything is not “ideal” in the field but make the best of location and materials.
1. A bunker should be constructed wholly or partly below ground level. If above ground level, columns or posts should extend below ground level for anchoring.
2. The protective cover and roof of a bunker should be designed so that it moves freely but it is rigid enough to displace as a unit. It must also be able to absorb the shock of an exploding event. To accomplish this, sandwich type construction is used. I personally wonder how much effort is put into bunkering down where it’s needed in Iraq but that’s another story….
A. camo layer 5cm
B. burster layer 30cm
C. waterproof layer
D. cusion layer 30cm
E. cushion and burster layers extend beyond edges of shelter a min of 1.5cm. Thickness of laminated boards verify, 7-2.5cm boards may be called for. Remember in solid timber construction, notching of lumber should be avoided.
Next thread; tactical wire placement 😉 Prota-
Replies
Those Black Helicopters circling your building site yet?
Joe H
the little voices in my head are telling me to clean and load all the guns
did you start taking a new med. lately? Or them cheap pills from Canada?
Dude, if any terrorista really wanted to ####k with us, it would just be a big , bright , flash and whummmph..lites out. You ain't gonna build anything that will save yer butt, and who wants hang around AFTER that anyway?..
I'll take the exit..gimme a chance to get caught up with some ol friends..
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations.
What the f$%^?
With what I work with, it shouldn't be surprising that it attracts a bit of the survivalist element. Almost all end up disappointed with what mere survival costs. Strangest was a guy who claims to have spoken with Einstein and was having a panic attack in front of me about the upcoming pole shift. Some of the things people fear...both real and imagined...
I swear I know that guy..was he Al's paperboy? I've also been apart of all that "flaky woo woo" crap..it seems in Asheville there is a whole society of that mindset...magnetic field shifts, new planets heading our way, atlantis returning, bunch of nut cases.."tonite we will channel the spirit of St. Germain, etc"..aaarrgghh.
somebody is laughing all the way to the bank, in Waynesville.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations.
I dont want to see the other side of the "flash"
Had a world wise old boss way back when I worked the 707 program. He had spent 5 years in a #### forced labor camp. He finally could afford to build his dream house in the early '60's-100% by himself and his wife , his wife had loaded cement onto rail cars in a different camp in Austria during WWII .
When I built my first house in the early '70s, he was kind enough to show me parts of his house he had seldom shown anyone else. He KNEW what a$$holes could inflict when in absolute power and did not want it to happen again without some countermeasures.
Anybody here have a SUB basement in their house? 3 feet below normal basement floor with 8" reinforced ceiling, complete with it's own well, labyrinth and filtered hand operated air blower with blast valves, 5 ton locking concrete door on another labyrinth, 303 Enfield in cosmoline and a few K of ammo, 3 old water heaters buried off to the side filled with kerosene and dual 3/8 copper feed lines, an early transistor radio with battery bank and 3/4 steel cable above ground for an antenna, plus bicycle and Lister diesel powered generator, 2 ft dia corrugated steel pipe for escape to the surface filled with sand, etc!.
Another 60 ft deep and he could'a qualified for a launch control facility for hardness.
And no, I do not have a sub basement, but did spend last week reviewing GMD BV.
Spent 6 month on temporary assignment in SLC in the 90s, and went thru quite a few new houses to see what construction was like there. Nearly every new house had a foot thick concrete front porch, under which was a 'shelter'. Realator said you could sell few houses there without such a shelter.
Edit PS: hum, I see prospero uses #### for words that are 4 letters, start with N, end with I, and have an a and a z in between. Shuda' used the word Fokker (heck no lady, them was flyin Messerschmidts) in front of it too.
Edited 6/2/2004 11:06 pm ET by JUNKHOUND
What's "SLC" ???
Around here, the concrete shelter under the front porch is primarily for tornados. I'd say they're on about one house in 4.
BTW - If you wanna use the "N" word, just spell it "Naz!".If you want anything said, ask a man. If you want something done, ask a woman. [Margaret Thatcher]
SLC=big lake in Utah.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations.
O.K. - I'm slow, but I catch on.
I suspect it has something to do with LDS teachings, then. They want their church members to have a year's worth of food stored up. I guess if there's a catastrophe they want their church members to survive. Heck with everyone else.Do you study the law, or do you study the loopholes?
I've looked at a lot of new houses in the greater SLC area and never seen one with a shelter like you describe. What neighborhood are you talking about?
layton area
I've seen a few in up in Logan. I always wondered about the folks who store food/ build shelters for "bad times". Most of what I've seen they wouldn't (don't know enough) to last more than a few days. i.e. have a generator, and 5 gallons of gas/fuel (old), have food for a year (old/stale/gone bad), 100 gal of water for a family of 8, shelter with only one door, waste issues not covered. Tornado shelters I can understand - some hidihole for a few hours is a whole other issue. Try to go camping a few times and find out what it takes to live like we are used to. Just a thought, if you are not smart enough to go "camping/backpacking" for a month, then you probably are not smart enough to live in a shelter for very long either.
Watching to much news about the war again I see. Look guys, if it makes Prota feel better building a bunker thats cool with me. I can't wait for the tacticle wire placement thread (cough). http://www.showcaves.com/english/explain/Subterranea/SecretBunkers.html
Next thread; tactical wire placement
Won't the hard part be not letting the thread degenerate into differing interpretations of different, but similar, FMs? <g>
Field Fortification has some different guidelines than Improvised Shelter, is different than Passive Defense. Then, there's the combat engineering FMs . . .
Add to that, it's just like construction--local conditions dictate the methods. Down in sou' Louisiana, it is right hard to dig drain sumps in field fortifications, where the water table is only a few feet deep . . . 'Course, down in the bayou, finding timber for a bunker is less difficult than finding dry ground to site it on . . .
Can't even pull off the highway to pizz down there without your ride sinking.
Joe H
without your ride sinking
And people wonder why there's a johnboat (aka bateau o piereau) in the back of so many rides down that'a'ways . . .
And, as it seems apropos, a link to memorable movie lines: "They said is was daft to build a castle in the swap, but I did. It sank. I built another one, and it sank too . . . "Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
louisana? You mean like FT Polk? Once heard a Navy Petty Offficer 1st Class call it "the only place he ever sunk on the high ground". Look at the bright side, at least you could fish or catch crawdads in the grenade sump.
louisana? You mean like FT Polk?
I'm admitting nothing.
Just been to a bayou or two.
A person visits, and their training & experience kicks in--a person starts thinking about digging in an LP/OP out in the bayou. Hard to have a grenade sump with a 6" watertable (or a WT that varies with the tide . . . ) Always figured that an LP would need netting & treetop location (and beink veddy veddy kwiet, we's huntink wabbits . . . )Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
We all die. I'm not rushin it any, but for crying out loud!
I could have a fatal accident or a heart attack just building the thing!
I looked pretty hard in the IBC and can't find any listings for'bunkers'. How are the inspectors on this sort of thing?
"Lets look at both in detail. ............A bunker should be constructed wholly or partly below ground level. If above ground level, columns or posts should extend below ground level for anchoring."
Um, I agree with the second responding poster. Take your meds. Not enough $ for a real bunker/shelter? Wish I had a pic handy of mine. 18" of steel reinforced concrete on the walls and ceiling, all below grade, 260 sq/ft.out in the country.
Edit: Found it. Use it to store car parts.
View Image
Jon
Edited 6/3/2004 6:45 pm ET by WorkshopJon
I guess if there a huge disaster, at lest you can keep your car running ???The La-Z-Boy... this is very flattering, isn't it? Why don't we just call it the half-conscious-deadbeat-with-no-job-home-all-day-eating-Cheetos-and-watching-TV recliner? [Jerry Seinfeld]
You got me. I did learn how to build black helicopters and much better things besides bunkers ya know. Like, for instance, before Tenet resigned they created the most powerful audio listening device ever. It was nicknamed "brood X" and disguised as a cicada (his power became to strong.). I don't know how many more of those bugs are out there but never fear, your gov't is at work right now to stop these things. You should start seeing them taper off soon because and the change in leadership.
Thank you all for reading the thread at least. I had a good excuse for a sub-terran party shack but now I am not so sure. Pretty WW2 thinking of me huh. Still making the tangle foots thow... ;)
somehow I thought you'd be more organized lol...
down here, lowes sells these fiberglass shelters that you bury in the ground for hurricane shelter. with out power, a/c or bathroom, I rather take my chance with the storm.
"somehow I thought you'd be more organized lol..."
CAG,
Outa' sight, outa' mind. Honestly, I have little clue what's in there. It's just a small room in my basement that I stack [60's era muscle] car parts that I may need "someday" Though I do see an N2O bottle there ii the distance.
Jon
Gonna form in a shelter/wine cellar/humidor when I pour my basement. That way when it hits the fan I'll have plenty of vintage wine and cigars to pass the time with. Might need some summer sausage and cheese too. And some beer. And my girlfriend. And my two German Shepherds. And..... Hell, gonna need to make it bigger...
Mark
Gonna form in a shelter/wine cellar/humidor when I pour my basement.
Resist the temptation to make the wine cellar a tasting room, and you will be better off. You might want to dedicate a cabinet to the cigar storage, good wine storage is often a tad cold for good cigars (and not moist enough).
For wine storage, the overhead is less critical than for storm shelter. For storm shelter, make sure you tie the overhead protection into the walls (having it fly off with auntie em is under-helpful).
Oh, and for wine storage, use block to lay out the walls, even if you have a poured concrete basement. Mostly, as it is simpler to get the wine-specific air unit in, when you decide you need one. Also, when the wall wants moving, you can dowel it into the floor & wall as needed, and just cut off & patch the old dowels.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)