I wasn’t getting any feedback in the other post…probably too long now.
I have everything taped in our new house (9000ish sf of drywall) and have spent a few hours on the second coat. Everything looks good…in other words, I would not need to sand anything I’ve done thus far. I hope only to do a light sand after the final coat. The problem…my technique is taking way too long, and I have a whole house to get done before the new baby arrives!
Currently, I put about 3/4″ of water on top of a pail of proform all-purpose and mix it in. This thins the mud a good deal, but it still stays on the tools. Is this a good consistency? I put the mud on with a 6″ knife, then a quick pass with either a knife on corners, or a 14″ curved trowel on the field joints. The corners come out good on the first pass. The field joints require a lot of pressure to acheive a smooth surface. Should I dump the cambered trowel for a flat one? I know the approach will wear me out in a hurry on the ceiling. Also, inside corners are cumbersome. I’m doing one side at a time, but I tend to get a little squeeze out on the opposite side. How does one avoid this? Any tips would be greatly apprecieated.
Replies
I use a corner trowel for the insides. It takes some practise, but I can finish both sides in one shot. I bed the tape, let it dry, and then use the corner trowel for the second, and usually final, coat in the corners.
For flats, I also use a curved trowel. I have a 12" and 14", but the 12" gets a lot more use. For tapered flats, all you really need to do is bridge across the tapers. A 12" trowel is plenty. Filling the hollow so its a little crowned is better than leaving a depression. I'll make a pass with the trowel, and then clean up any squeeze out with my 6" knife.
Speed will come with practise. By the time you get done with your house, you'll be pretty quick. <G>
so the tapered seams should not have any mud beyond the tapers? This would be a 6" wide joint finished with the knives? In that case, two coats should seemingly be enough. I've never even seen a professional job finished and before the paint goes on, so I have no idea what to look for. That would mean most of my time will be on corners and butts. My corner trowel only has a 4" wind on either side, and I gave up on it a few projects ago. Do I apply/finish in one pass, or put mud on first and then another pass to clean up. I agree with the fact that the corners shouldn't need much work. A lot of mine look clean and finished already, and the second coat seems to be messing them up (paper is still exposed for the most part). Can corner paper be left exposed if well-bedded?
One thing I found is that flexibility of the knife is even more important with a corner knife than with a regular taping knife--I like the corner knife to be pretty flexible. Sometimes I find I am leaving beads of mud that come off the edges of the knife, away from the corners. I try to stop and reload the knife to keep the mud more toward the corner and then I clean up the beads by wiping so the bead is about 1/3 of the distance from the edge of the knife and twist the knife so there is more pressure on the edge than there is at the bend. (The bend of the knife then is away from the corner of wall or wall/ceiling, but still toward the corner.) Usually that is enough, but sometimes I wipe it again with the corner of the knife in the corner of the two walls or wall/ceiling. In most cases, those beads are pretty easily taken care of when they dry by just scraping them with a regular knife anyway.
The thing that gives me the most difficulty in where two walls and ceiling come together. I probably play around trying to smooth that area way more than I should. In some cases I think the straight knife works better in those corners.
I am not a pro mudder--I just do it as part of remodeling. I probably take more time than a guy who only finishes drywall for a living, but I take less time than most D-I-Y'ers.
Do I apply/finish in one pass, or put mud on first and then another pass to clean up.
For inside corners, I apply the mud with a 6" knife first and then make a light pass with the corner knife to spread it and a 2nd pass to finish. Sometimes I have to repeat that exercise :-)
Can corner paper be left exposed if well-bedded?
Yeah, sort of. There's 2 risks here however. 1) If you scuff it with sandpaper, you'll never get a good paint job and 2) I would be concerned about hiding the transition between paper and compound since it may telegraph through.
so the tapered seams should not have any mud beyond the tapers? This would be a 6" wide joint finished with the knives? In that case, two coats should seemingly be enough.
Yes, that's pretty much true. When it's right, you'll see a streak of white about 4-5" wide and then it'll be mottled a bit above and below (because the drywall tapers are somewhat gradual and the the texture of the gypsum, etc.). When you get that fairly well defined streak, you know you've filled in with as much mud as it'll take. The mud shrinks a little when it dries, but usually two coats is about it (maybe some touch up here and there).
If you can run your knife the whole length of a wall in one stroke without stopping, that's a good way to do it. (I usually end up taking long strokes--maybe four feet--and sometimes begin with an up and down stroke, to apply a good amount of mud, then a long horizontal stroke to spread it. (Assuming the tapers are horizontal.))The little places that look like sagged paint or like when paint starts to run, or someimes a feathery vertical line, are where you stop one stroke and start another. Again, that is easily taken care of by scraping with a dry knife before the second coat. Not much sanding should be needed after the second coat on these seams--people like to go crazy with the sandpaper and then they scuff the drywall paper surface.
One of my favorite mud jobs was on a house that had ceilings at 7 feet in the hallways and so I could do the second coat of mud on the tape between wall and ceiling practically in one stroke--just walking down the hall with the corner knife riding in the corner!
"just walking down the hall with the corner knife riding in the corner!"
I should be able to do that on the stilts! I was able to do this on the first coat anyway. It looks like I need to invest in a wider corner trowel. I hate the feel of that cambered trowel; it is just unnatural to my wrist. I done know why I didn't think to just use a knife on the tapered seams. Switch boxes get in the way of course...some little fuzz always seems to catch the trowel. I also have a bunch of can lights that ended up close to a seam as well as fire alarm wires.
All you really need to do for flats is fill the tapers, about 6" or so. I use my 12" curved trowel, partly because I can put lot of mud on the trowel, and then the wall, in one pass. The curve helps put it on heavy in the center, where it's needed most. When the mud shrinks, it'll suck into the taper.
Each side of my corner trowel is only 3" or 4" wide. I'd go measure it, but its on a job right now. When using it, I use my 6" knife to put on a layer of mud on both sides of the corner, then run the corner trowel down, squeezing out the extra mud. I then use my 6" knife to clean up the little bit of mud left on the outside of the run. Hold the knife so its twisted a little bit, with one side off the sheetrock. This trick will clean up the small bit of excess, without messing up what you've already got on the wall.
I like to use knives of increasing width, rather than trowels. Just a personal preference but I think that they're easier for non-professional tapers like me.
The better quality knives have thin blades which respond to pressure nicely, without a lot of force, and it's easier to feel the mud through them. They are also very lightweight so they're not nearly as fatiguing as a trowel.
I use knives of two widths most of the time, one for laying the mud in place and the larger one for picking it up. I have four sizes, 6" to 12" if memory serves.
The trick for inside corners is to angle the 6" broadknife, inside down, so that it's radiused edge doesn't pull mud off the other side of the corner. That will eliminate the sqeeze-out problem too. It leaves a bead on the wall but that's pretty easy to take off cleanly, with a little practice.
Edited 5/9/2008 11:17 am by Hudson Valley Carpenter